Redesigning EU4: A thought experiment - Part 1: Trade

[Gemberkoekje]

Redesigning EU4: A thought experiment - Trade & Monarchs

Disclaimer: I do not wish to imply that any part of EU4 is bad. I haven't played the full game. I also don't wish to imply my designs are better. I just like thinking about these things.

Redesigning EU4: A thought experiment - Part 1: Trade

I'd change the trade direction, in that it's not a fixed, static, one way street.
The directions would still exist, but as a bonus system. You'll make more money if you trade downstream.
It'd work like this: Merchants can be set up to push trade in all directions. This would give a relative trade flow, e.g. 10 trade downwards, 5 trade upwards. The 'winner' of this trade flow gets the actual flow, so in this case, the trade value would go downwards, and the 5 upwards traders would send trade power, instead.

Now, normally, in the world outside of Europe, this would mostly work the same, as powerful european traders would normally steer trade towards Europe. It would be most interesting inside europe, where Antwerp and Venice would not by definition be endpoints anymore.

 

[Unthariel]

Yes... Trade loops here we come!!! Let's make Alexandria, Ragusa, Venice trade circle!!!

 

[Gemberkoekje]

Redesigning EU4: A thought experiment - Part 2: Monarchs

I like the way how Monarchs can be good or bad, and how it's used to make a country more or less powerful over time. I find it weird, however, that a country focussing on something, can get a ruler/heir of completely opposite skills. In the current game, the solution is to play to the ruler's strengths, as a player, but most people don't seem to like that.
I think heirs should have a statistically higher chance to get 'focus' points. So a country which has only DIP ideas, does only colonize etcetera, should have a higher chance for a DIP heir. There's still a roll of bad luck where either the heir is bad to begin with, or still gets better in some other area, but the chances should be lower.
For republics, there should be some randomness in the numbers, and they shouldn't be known beforehand. Not exactly. If you take a DIP republic ruler, it shouldn't be 1 / 4 / 1, but it could be 0 / 4 / 2 or 1 / 5 / 0. Not huge differences, but more realistic, not so deterministic.

 

[Zarine]

Well, I think it should be like today but with trade going both way between links.
Nothing else to change on how the trade is working.

I would add some land "light ship" that we could call road patrol which would have a lower trade power/maintenance ratio than the ships ofc.

 

[Korsan82]

I once made a suggestion regarding trade routes. Instead of having static ones why not make them dynamical and totally changeable?
For example: I decide to open trade with Spain as Italy. I pick the port of the origin and the destination port in Spain, I propose a price for their good (if i am the one who buys) and/or I set the price for my goods.. Then the offer is brought to Spain and if they accept there is a new trade route. Now the player can decide about the quantity of trade. If he wishes to raise the value of that trade route, he simply commands more trade ships (a new class of ship besides galley, transport and heavy ship) which he has to build. These ships will then travel and make money. The more ships are trading on that route the bigger the cashflow can get. Of course this requires some solid trade good value calculation - not every investment should make money.
If there is a price drop on grain because someone else is trading grain for a much lower price our route should not make profit and the cost for upkeep for the transport ships can even grow larget than the benefits.

On the trade map mode trade routes would be displayed with arrows.. Everyone has seen those trade charts where the direction of the trade is drawn. The fatter the arrow is, the higher the traffic on that route is (means the more ships are crossing between the 2 designated trading ports).

This should not only be limited to sea trade, but also for land trade. The envoy used for this would not be the merchant ship but the merchant caravan or the merchant in general.

I am often complaining about the lack of real improvement in EUIV. This is one thing I would love to see... Any idea if something like this is moddable in game?

 

[Gemberkoekje]

I am often complaining about the lack of real improvement in EUIV. This is one thing I would love to see... Any idea if something like this is moddable in game?

I don't think so, while you may be able to tweak some stuff in the trade, I don't think the things you say can be done without actually altering the code (as in, not the scripts)

 

[Unthariel]

I once made a suggestion regarding trade routes. Instead of having static ones why not make them dynamical and totally changeable?
For example: I decide to open trade with Spain as Italy. I pick the port of the origin and the destination port in Spain, I propose a price for their good (if i am the one who buys) and/or I set the price for my goods.. Then the offer is brought to Spain and if they accept there is a new trade route. Now the player can decide about the quantity of trade. If he wishes to raise the value of that trade route, he simply commands more trade ships (a new class of ship besides galley, transport and heavy ship) which he has to build. These ships will then travel and make money. The more ships are trading on that route the bigger the cashflow can get. Of course this requires some solid trade good value calculation - not every investment should make money.
If there is a price drop on grain because someone else is trading grain for a much lower price our route should not make profit and the cost for upkeep for the transport ships can even grow larget than the benefits.

On the trade map mode trade routes would be displayed with arrows.. Everyone has seen those trade charts where the direction of the trade is drawn. The fatter the arrow is, the higher the traffic on that route is (means the more ships are crossing between the 2 designated trading ports).

This should not only be limited to sea trade, but also for land trade. The envoy used for this would not be the merchant ship but the merchant caravan or the merchant in general.

I am often complaining about the lack of real improvement in EUIV. This is one thing I would love to see... Any idea if something like this is moddable in game?

I must admit I don't like this idea. Something similar is already in Hearts of Iron 3 and I always automate it. It also limits you quite a lot since you would be hard pressed to open as many trade routes as you can in order not to lag behind. And what about resellers? This would only simulate the direct trade. It would also essentially kill trade zones. I noticed a lot of people see the trade nodes as CoT's in EU3. They are not the same. Trade node simulates trade for entire region...

Anyway I really hope they don't do something like what you suggested because that would become very tedious, very fast.

 

[beckermt]

You can push tradepower back upstream. For example, Ottomans can put a merchant in Venice and push trade back to Constantinople. Though, they might need a province to do so...

 

[Korsan82]

I must admit I don't like this idea. Something similar is already in Hearts of Iron 3 and I always automate it. It also limits you quite a lot since you would be hard pressed to open as many trade routes as you can in order not to lag behind. And what about resellers? This would only simulate the direct trade. It would also essentially kill trade zones. I noticed a lot of people see the trade nodes as CoT's in EU3. They are not the same. Trade node simulates trade for entire region...

Anyway I really hope they don't do something like what you suggested because that would become very tedious, very fast.

I didn't know about HOI3 I just saw a friend of mine playing it and then I tried it as well.. Didn't like it much.

The option to automate it even makes this better as it would be optional. Someone who wishes to focus on a trade nation would have fun with manual trade routes, someone who doesn't want to bother with it sets it on auto and focusses on other aspects, such as war. So people like you would not have any disadvantage from that..

The reseller thing could be simulated the same way: Say Thrace is making trade with Alexandria. There is a trade route already existant and then you decide to connect Edirne to that trade route as a reselling route.
You do the same thing with Edirne: set origin and destination, which is same as Thrace's destination in order to make it work on the same route. The result would be trade route with different sidearms, a tree to all participating ports. The benefits of a trading shore province then has effects on inland provinces of course as an increased trade volume means increased production. Keeping the balance between import and export granted ofc...

What I want is get rid of abstract gameplay elements and make it how it actually is - realistic. I wish I had the modding knowledge and a game moddable to an extend that fullfills my needs

 

[anzac1915]

@ Korsan82: You mean kind of like Trade in Anno 1701?

 

[Thanik]

I didn't know about HOI3 I just saw a friend of mine playing it and then I tried it as well.. Didn't like it much.

The option to automate it even makes this better as it would be optional. Someone who wishes to focus on a trade nation would have fun with manual trade routes, someone who doesn't want to bother with it sets it on auto and focusses on other aspects, such as war. So people like you would not have any disadvantage from that..

The reseller thing could be simulated the same way: Say Thrace is making trade with Alexandria. There is a trade route already existant and then you decide to connect Edirne to that trade route as a reselling route.
You do the same thing with Edirne: set origin and destination, which is same as Thrace's destination in order to make it work on the same route. The result would be trade route with different sidearms, a tree to all participating ports. The benefits of a trading shore province then has effects on inland provinces of course as an increased trade volume means increased production. Keeping the balance between import and export granted ofc...

What I want is get rid of abstract gameplay elements and make it how it actually is - realistic. I wish I had the modding knowledge and a game moddable to an extend that fullfills my needs

But how player/AI will handle with it with 30 possible trade routes and dynamical changes of trade values, and owner of province:>?
Hell micro? Oh no!

 

[americanu197]

Part 3 Technology and research
Im so sick of click to research systems
Why not implement a system where technological advancement are just events that happen every now and then depending on the nations open-mindedness and education facilities and where technology gets shared faster between friendly nations or by conquering