Reason behind making User Modifications Sub-Forum Private

[lightzy]

Hi,
Just wanted to pitch in and say that I'll never buy the game without looking at the mod forum and the modding community.
That's just me.
My decision on which game to buy is bases on which game I think will live longest and give me the most bang for my buck, and that is about 90% mods.

thank you.
Please tell your extended focus groups to take a hike, I bet noone in the 'focus group' was lacking access to viewing the forum


If you want anti-piracy then don't let unregistered see htmls or be able to download stuff.
Not letting people see if the game is worth their money is a pretty poor decision, considering many of your past games relied heavily on mods to make them worth the money

 

[Weijun]

Hi,
Just wanted to pitch in and say that I'll never buy the game without looking at the mod forum and the modding community.
That's just me.
My decision on which game to buy is bases on which game I think will live longest and give me the most bang for my buck, and that is about 90% mods.

thank you.
Please tell your extended focus groups to take a hike, I bet noone in the 'focus group' was lacking access to viewing the forum


If you want anti-piracy then don't let unregistered see htmls or be able to download stuff.
Not letting people see if the game is worth their money is a pretty poor decision, considering many of your past games relied heavily on mods to make them worth the money

Does Magicka even have mods? Aside from graphical/map mods, how can you know how a mod changes a game without playing it first?

Take Victoria 2: SexiiColours dramatically changes the way the map looks, but is actually a very simple mod. PDM and VRRP are major mods that substantially change the game, but one really has to play them to know whether he actually likes them. Moreover, without a full game of vanilla under one's belt, one has no point of reference. If you have not played Victoria 2, is it not enough to know that Victoria 2 has about 67,000 posts in the User Modifications sub-forum?

I suppose the more important point is that as a rule, all Paradox games have major mods. Rome, which gets so little love, has several good ones (I have been playing RotA). It looks like even Sengoku has a major mod called Monumenta Iaponiae Historica. (Not having played through a full game of vanilla, I cannot tell you how much MIH changes the game or whether it is fun.)

Most Paradox games have tremendous replay value. I would have thought the major factors in longevity are:

1. Gameplay/how fun it is
2. Immersion/historical accuracy
3. Challenge/Varied experience for different countries
4. Graphics

Mods are best at improving #2 (the main reason I almost always play with mods), sometimes too good at #3 (Magna Mundi), and rarely are a factor in #4 (Kudos to MEIOU). However, the vanilla game fundamentally determines gameplay. If the game is fun, the mods will thrive. If it is not, then no amount of mods are going to save it. ( Diplomacy has been around since 2005, yet there are only about 500 posts in the mod forum...)

 

[Marfig]

My decision on which game to buy is bases on which game I think will live longest and give me the most bang for my buck, and that is about 90% mods.

[blabla]

Rubbish! Your whole post reeks of hypocrisy.

Beside, Paradox games, being grand strategy games for the most part, have the highest replay value of any genre.

 

[P-51]

but buying game X doesn't give you any special rights to the rewards for buying game Y. It's really basic, subforum access is a reward for buying our games.

Once again you're admitting that user-made mods are now a product that you are trying to sell. I don't understand how you can call a subforum "special rights". Especially when we have always had access to them anyway. So was this a free-trial period or something? We had free special rights to view the mod subforums for the past X years and you've suddenly decided to take away those special rights? Or did you just invent the concept of them being a "special right" in the last couple of months specifically to justify taking them away?

 

[s1234567890m]

Once again you're admitting that user-made mods are now a product that you are trying to sell. I don't understand how you can call a subforum "special rights". Especially when we have always had access to them anyway. So was this a free-trial period or something? We had free special rights to view the mod subforums for the past X years and you've suddenly decided to take away those special rights? Or did you just invent the concept of them being a "special right" in the last couple of months specifically to justify taking them away?

The ones you had access to you still access to....

 

[P-51]

Yes. Did I epicly misword something? I don't see how that comment is relevant.

 

[Darkrenown]

Once again you're admitting that user-made mods are now a product that you are trying to sell. I don't understand how you can call a subforum "special rights". Especially when we have always had access to them anyway. So was this a free-trial period or something? We had free special rights to view the mod subforums for the past X years and you've suddenly decided to take away those special rights? Or did you just invent the concept of them being a "special right" in the last couple of months specifically to justify taking them away?

No, access to the sub forum is the bonus, the content is not being sold. No matter how you try to twist this it is totally simple: We are not selling or advertising mods.

Us giving you free access to parts of our forum in the past in no way forces us to give you free access to new parts we make, like sub-forums for new games. This is a private forum, run by Paradox, you have no inheritance right to access it. Nothing has been taken from you though, you just don't get access to the new parts without registering the games.

 

[Captain Gars]

Once again you're admitting that user-made mods are now a product that you are trying to sell.

No. And the mod-forum is more than just a number of mods. It's also a place of information, like helpful documents for modders and devs answering questions. And that is something we reserve for those who buy the game.

 

[lightzy]

The point is that mods is a major part of why PC gamers buy games.

Imagine the uproar of bethesda decided not to support mods for skyrim...
And dear lord, how angry fans were with civ5 because of 2ks decision not to release the sdk

No, if I don't see that mods are hard at work rebalancing and reworking a game, and that they're not complaining about the developers lack of support and all kinds of problems and hinderances with modding, then I don't buy a game.
Especially a strategy game from paradox (there are probably only few here who play the paradox strat games unmodded.. there's hardly anyone who plays skyrim unmodded, hardly anyone who plays strategy games like rome:TW, medieveal:TW and basically any TW game without mods, etc etc... civ4 would not be civ4 without FFH...etc...

Hell, all other companies go out of their way to show how supportive they are of modders and what fabulous content modders are making, because they know it sells the game better.

So please reconsider this silly policy.

Like I said, I won't buy any paradox game where I can't see the modders active (unless it's on one of those $2.5 sales on steam)

Nobody says they're entitled to access to private forums, but it is a very legitimate request in this case.

 

[Marfig]

Like I said, I won't buy any paradox game where I can't see the modders active (unless it's on one of those $2.5 sales on steam)

I think your attempt at blackmailing a corporation into a decision they don't want to make needs to be better dissimulated. You are just too obvious and, consequently, hard to be taken seriously.

 

[Captain Gars]

Especially a strategy game from paradox (there are probably only few here who play the paradox strat games unmodded..)

And you know this how? Just because the most active members on the forum all play with mods doesn't mean that the majority of those who buy our games do so.

 

[RedRalphWiggum]

And you know this how? Just because the most active members on the forum all play with mods doesn't mean that the majority of those who buy our games do so.

I'm not even sure that that is true, TBH.

 

[Calahan]

Especially a strategy game from paradox (there are probably only few here who play the paradox strat games unmodded..)

And you know this how?

Perhaps it was feedback from extensive focus groups?!

 

[Ritterkreuz]

while I cannot talk for others, before buying a game I usually read about the mods developed for that game. It was the case with EU3, as well as Total War series or even Cossacks. On the other hand, the only game I'll probably buy without having to even check the mods is Magna Mundi.

 

[Darkrenown]

And you know this how? Just because the most active members on the forum all play with mods doesn't mean that the majority of those who buy our games do so.

Not even that IMO, I was one of the most active posters on this forum before I started working here and I barely touched the big mods. A brief spell with SRI/Del gratia for EUIII and the modding I did for V1 is about it.

Certainly a lot of people on the forum like mods though. But then, a lot of people here buy and register their games too, so they have access to the modding forums.

 

[lightzy]

I think your attempt at blackmailing a corporation into a decision they don't want to make needs to be better dissimulated. You are just too obvious and, consequently, hard to be taken seriously.

Yes, I'm an obvious blackmailer. Brilliantly done.

It's an obvious claim.
I don't buy the game until I see for myself how supported mods are and what's the scope of mods being made

The game popped up on steam.
Normally I wouldn't even bother to post in these cases and move straight on, but something about this game in specific caught my attention enough to post.
That's it really.
MODS = integral, important part of PC gaming. companies go out of their way to support and advertise their support of modders and what kind of amazing things modders do with their games. in order to sell better.

that's about it.

thank you, goodbye

 

[Darkrenown]

I don't buy the game until I see for myself how supported mods are and what's the scope of mods being made

Or in other words, you don't buy games until long after their release. Certainly that's a valid choice, but I hope you understand that what you're saying is you're at best a late sale and aren't actually a fan of the game in question at all.

 

[P-51]

No, access to the sub forum is the bonus, the content is not being sold.

Bonus means its part of the product, ergo it is being sold.

Us giving you free access to parts of our forum in the past in no way forces us to give you free access to new parts we make, like sub-forums for new games. This is a private forum, run by Paradox, you have no inheritance right to access it. Nothing has been taken from you though, you just don't get access to the new parts without registering the games.

Nobody is claiming rights to anything. But that doesn't mean you're not trying to turn your subforums into a part of the product. And yes you have taken away the traditional setup of the forums that we've had for years. After years of it being standard procedure to have access to user mod forums for games we didn't own, how can act like it is perfectly normal to suddenly take the away without explanation?

 

[Lor Dric]

Just curious, have you read the copyright notice in the forum rules?

 

[P-51]

I'm sure I scanned over it at some point, but who the hell remembers that stuff?