Radical Departure-Province/fief issues

[unmerged(19220)]

Hail,
I have a idea on what would in my opinion contribute greatly to the core premise of the game. In a nutshell then here it is, what I propose to give the game more depth in my opinion and a greater feel of the medieval period I propose the following, put a layer of baronial fiefs INSIDE each province. Make each province a count level title, but INSIDE each, put anywhere from one to four barional fiefs. I know this means increasing the game size and scope greatly. In fact that issue was the core debate I had with myself before I decided to post this.
My reasoning for this is simple. It is currently too easy to assume province level control. As I recall from my medieval period reading/history it was quite common for provinces to be a patch work of one or more noble houses whom controlled fiefs inside them at a barional level. Securing each barional holding in the province itself would give one the requirements IF the province was contested to determine IF they had a majority of holdings to claim the title. I enjoy the game but I think Paradox can do even better :} and this in my humble opinion would greatly contribute to the entire premise of the game.
As it stands the provinces are just too abstracted to give me a genuine feel of the period. IF on the other hand provinces held "fiefs" and each represented a unit of political control it would greatly enhance the entire political premise of the game.
I realise this is not a option for CK currently, however IF something like this was done to expand upon CK in say a CK2 I would be delighted. I am looking for a greater degree of modeling the period and CK falls short in this respect again in my humble opinion. IF CK2 includes a model along these lines as one of the improvements to the game concept I would most assuredly buy it! Fact where can I preorder Ck2 :}!
Sheytan

 

[Varyar]

Hmm... isn't that supposed to be simulated by the four social classes in each province?

 

[unmerged(11486)]

Hmm... isn't that supposed to be simulated by the four social classes in each province?

I think he means more along the lines of smaller provinces within a larger one, as in Victoria. That would indeed add a huge amount of detail to the game, but I don't know how interesting it would really be.

If you could appoint nobles to be barons of fiefs within a province without actually having four seperate provinces (1 regiment, 1 castle, etc...) to say increase tax value or noble power or something, that would be quite interesting.

Or is that what you meant?

Steele

 

[unmerged(19220)]

Hail,
Well if it is then im missing how the four social classes represent barional level holdings in provinces :} As I understand it, the four social classes represents precisely that, those social groups and a abstract method for influencing them(the slide bars). I do not however see anything that represents the barional holdings, politics etc, recall if you will the barional class were the work horse class of the medieval nobility. They held in fief lands, managed them for the benifit of thier overlords, and served when called to arms. I really feel using a abstraction of that level of nobility and assuming the four social classes is it falls short of hitting the mark. Having large armys overrun provinces as it stands now makes what I propose even more viable and realistic. Imagine IF you have to control the fiefs or a majority within each province to claim the count level titles? It would in my opinion make for a much more in depth game and more accurately model the structure of nobility during the period. What im suggesting really is making the provinces a general political unit, as they are now, but creating fiefs INSIDE each province to model the period.
Sheytan

 

[unmerged(19220)]

Precisely! Each province when clicked on would give you a option to examine the province, once done would reveal a number of fiefs INSIDE each province, each one, smaller provinces having fewer fiefs etc would be a barional level title and could only be appointed by the overlord of the province whoever held the title to it etc, or as we have in CK my inheritence.. However I did mean making each barional unit if you will a part of the province with its own castle at the least and again my rational for this is simple, it will compel claimants to take all of the rivals holdings INSIDE the province to assume its title. Making the entire provincal control issue much more difficult to suceed at. Further the levy of the count would be dictated by the number of barons loyal to him inside the province in question. So lets assume each baron has at the least a castle/fief, and influnces the number of troops in the provincal regiment by simple math. Province has say 3 fiefs inside it, two of the barons are vassals of the count, so 66.6 of the regiment total would show up for counts levy.
Sheytan

I think he means more along the lines of smaller provinces within a larger one, as in Victoria. That would indeed add a huge amount of detail to the game, but I don't know how interesting it would really be.

If you could appoint nobles to be barons of fiefs within a province without actually having four seperate provinces (1 regiment, 1 castle, etc...) to say increase tax value or noble power or something, that would be quite interesting.

Or is that what you meant?

Steele

 

[unmerged(11486)]

Sheytan: That makes sense, I suppose. Although I would hesitate to give too much control to the barons at the expense of the count. Since being a baron would be probably outside the scope fo the game, not actually controlling much would make being a count less important and interesting.

I like the idea of the regiment, though.

Steele