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Charles Reeps

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To game the system, build with Consumer Production, then switch to HI for a day - and your industry will finish sooner.

Yes - very good trick, though some might call it gamey:)

I do a variation of this by sequentially DOWing the countries I'm going to conquer. I conquer each one, suffer a period of peace for a while, then begin anew against my next target. As often remarked on this forum, you then "rinse and repeat." Still feels like clubbing baby seals, though:)
 

21oliver

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To game the system, build with Consumer Production, then switch to HI for a day - and your industry will finish sooner.

How much do you gain by that? And then when it switches back?

I do a variation of this by sequentially DOWing the countries I'm going to conquer. I conquer each one, suffer a period of peace for a while, then begin anew against my next target. As often remarked on this forum, you then "rinse and repeat." Still feels like clubbing baby seals, though

I do that as the Soviets to maintain the HI...
 

Opanashc

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How much do you gain by that? And then when it switches back?
You save 73 days on ~82% of the first load of IC. With 5 practical (no + or -), IC takes 420 days to build and CGO, and 347 with HI. With 200 total IC, you can put 33 IC into production (CG and production only) on CGO, and 27 at HI. Those 27 can finish faster, and 6 other ones finish 1 day later (when IC is allocated to them). Then switch back to CGO for the next batch, and repeat.
The higher your practicals, the greater the effect (greater % of IC in que gets finished at once). Watch out though - when you change laws, build que gets updated in accordance with current practicals.
 

21oliver

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Do you attack Persia after Finland? What about Sweden for another front against Germany?

I play the Soviets over and over, it all depends on how i decide to play that sitting. I may go head to head with Germany and do little conquering or i may take half the map, depends on my mood. Time is on the side of the Soviet Union, not Germany. the longer it goes the better it is for the Soviets, usually at least. They have the resources, manpower and the Axis have the Allies to worry about. If you want to really cause Germany problems dont let them stack up on such a small front, spread them out and then let your MP take over. For example have in leningrad a fleet loaded with troops ready, on Sept 1 1936 when Germany attacks Poland (and thus you wont get Dow'd by the allies for your aggressions...) take Denmark. From there launch into Norway and Sweden and then fire the Winter war in Nov (for Finland). If you want puppet them all, except for Denmark (which also provide nice naval bases to hit the US with later on). Now proceed to take Afghanistan, Persia and Turkey. If you want to spend some LS you could from the beginning start working Xibei San Ma, Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary and Yugoslavia so that they stay out of the Axis corner, and then pick them off one by one. Eventually you have the Germans surrounded on about 3 sides. From Denmark & Yugoslavia you can come right up the gut into Germany. If Germany starts to push in any one spot it sort of stretches them out leaving them vulnerable.

Opanashc-

You lost me, im not sure if i understand you. Let me start from the beginning. First thing i do as the Soviets is queue up 39 IC, and I always get War Economy by Sept/Oct which allows me more production. I cook some practicals ala Charles method 3 LFx3 5 ABx5....

Now come Jan 1 1937 I fire the Purge. Should i or should i not use HI? I never did until yesterday. And if i switch at what point do i switch and for how long? Sometimes there arent clear cut batches either, alot of stragglers, i usually wait for a clear obvious next batch to make changes, to keep it sort of uniform.

Ive found in general using HI i can get to 200 IC faster, and usually have around 210 instead of 200 by Jan 1 1938. Not sure how it plays in the long haul still looking into it.

I am interested if switching back and forth or something along the lines of what you were trying to explain can be more efficient.

then switch to HI for a day - and your industry will finish sooner.

Im not sure where and when you want me to do this? Do i wait until a run is almost over? does it matter?
 

Opanashc

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You are running CGO. You have a batch of industry with ETA of around 2 month (its January, IC to finish in March for example). Switch to HI, watch that batch finish (should be prioritized in the que), switch back to CGO, enjoy your IC 2 month earlier. The positive side here, is that you can que up more stuff under CGO than HI, but still acquire it with HI time. All you need is money to change laws.
 

21oliver

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I generally do batches. I start with 39 IC, then i do 50 at a time. So typically you only use HI for 1-2 days?

Once i get to the winter war im generally at war for some time (i stagger my invasions) so ill be staying in HI, my concern is from the Purge up to the winter war.
 

jju_57

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Better than IC building is the following trick.

At the start of the game as Germany guarantee Republic of China. When Japan attacks in 1937 you are now in war against Japan. You get full laws and all the nice benefits. Now one of two things happen. If Japan hasn't defeated China by September 1939 you can get a peace deal with Japan after you are at war with the allies. Then if you want you can still get Japan into the Axis. Or the second option is Japan defeats all of China in late 1938 or 1939. In this case you can influence then invite Japan into the Axis if you desire. But you can keep the laws till actual war and even demobilize if you want. It is a nice IC bump for the pre-war years.
 

21oliver

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I myself dont like things i consider too gamey. I dont mind for example flip flopping laws, but i wont say stay at war with Ethiopia for a long time to maintain the better laws. I myself wouldnt DOW someone i didnt intend to fight. I can see the benefit in game of it, like many little things. I myself generally play it straight.
 

jju_57

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Yes it's gamey but I thought people wanted ahistorical stuff that was plausible. And issuing a guarantee on China is very plausible. Finally you don't DOW anyone, it's Japan that does the DOW. Germany and Japan just happen to be too far away from each other to do anything about it.
 

Pro_Consul

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Just to further the experimental goals of the game (my excuse for being gamey) I suppose the German player could use some of that big IC bump to feed LL to China, giving them a fighting chance to hold the Japanese off longer and perhaps even change the usual geometry along the Soviet Far East border region. Not sure what ultimate purpose that might serve, but I might have interesting possibilities. And if one stays at war with Japan all the way until USA enters the war, then that coupled with using spies to get the Bund Party in power could quickly bring USA into the Axis.

OK, i'll admit it. It's gamey. But it still might be fun. :laugh:
 

Charles Reeps

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Is it possible to get China into an alliance before Marco Polo? If so you could station troops there before the DOW occurs, wipe out the Japanese on the mainland (the Japanese troops tend to melt when faced with German troops), and then just wait them out. This way you could stay at war permanently. Just a thought.
 

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Dunno about alliance, but if you could just get mil access it could provide the same result.
 

Charles Reeps

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Dunno about alliance, but if you could just get mil access it could provide the same result.

This is a good angle, but your timing would have to be perfect because any units stationed in China would not be supplied. They would lose Org and Strength until war allowed them to be supplied, thus you would have to order their transport very close to Marco Polo. You would also have to consider a window large enough to let your transports get away.
 

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This is a good angle, but your timing would have to be perfect because any units stationed in China would not be supplied. They would lose Org and Strength until war allowed them to be supplied, thus you would have to order their transport very close to Marco Polo. You would also have to consider a window large enough to let your transports get away.

I am fairly sure ground units cannot die from being out of supply, no matter how long it persists. They would just need a period to recover from it once war began and they came back into supply from the Chinese logistical network. But your point is still a good one; the less time they have spent out of supply, the better, regardless.
 

Charles Reeps

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I am fairly sure ground units cannot die from being out of supply, no matter how long it persists. They would just need a period to recover from it once war began and they came back into supply from the Chinese logistical network. But your point is still a good one; the less time they have spent out of supply, the better, regardless.

I didn't mean to imply the units would die. Sorry if I did.
 

jju_57

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Some LL to China in my games meant China survived long enough till Poland. So I was in war from Marco Polo event (1937) on.

In one game I timed things just right and got lucky enough where I had Japan and China make peace and then got both Japan and China into the Axis.