Questions about trucks (Devs please read and Answer if you can)

[Gamer_1745]

The talk about horses & trucks in another thread has promoted me to post a few questions on trucks that I hope you can answer at this time.

1. Will or can (if modded) different trucks (or half-tracks) have different carrying weights? As in light trucks can carry 10 men & heavy trucks carry 20 men.

2. Will or can (if modded) trucks be used to carry (or tow) things other than troops? Like artillery?

2a. If trucks can (or be modded to) tow (carry) artillery, can an artillery gun have a weight of 15 that requires a truck with a carrying capacity of 15 or greater and not 2 ten capacity trucks?

3. What happens if a unit loses enough trucks so that it has few than needed for the number of troops? I am thinking about winter effects, reliability breakdowns, combat or other reasons? Does the unit slowdown or just lose the excess troops?

4. Will or can (if modded) trucks carry supplies? So more trucks (or wagons if modded in) in a division the more supplies it can carry.

There seems to be so many fun things I could mod into the game!

Thanks

 

[tazaaron]

For a strategic game I think these things are getting a little local for the overall scale. Just having trucks and horses would be pushing it but having different sizes would be over the top and then why would you stop there, if you had different size trucks then you have to start looking at other equipment.

Horses and mules?

 

[Gamer_1745]

@tazaaron

I understand and I am mainly thinking of adding things for greater immersion with mods & DLCs for those of us who want them. It would not be for the basic or new player. I see base HOI IV for those new to WWII & WWII wargaming and as a basis for making a richly detailed WWII strategy wargame with mods & DLCs.

 

[Felicity84]

Are we speaking about Men of War or HOI IV

 

[Gamer_1745]

@Felicity84

I get what you are saying, but I hope it could be done without bogging down the player once things are set it would send the right type equipment to the correct units without micromanagement.

 

[Centurion1973]

I expect, that if there will be any difference between trucks, it will only be Capacity and Reliability

something like:
1936 truck Reliability 4 Capacity 10
1940 truck Reliability 6 Capacity 13

IMO, there is a good chance, that trucks will all have same stats.

But its just a speculation, since we dont have official details.

 

[ingwe]

I suspect (and hope) that trucks will be pretty generic and that you just have to worry about having enough of them. I also hope that half tracks will be a different type of equipment that you also only have to worry about having enough of them.

 

[ObssesedNuker]

I advocate, for the sake of avoiding too much micromanagement, having a single generic "motor vehicle" representing pretty much all non-combat motor vehicles (so not just light and heavy trucks, but jeeps, halftracks, and artillery tractors as well). Foot infantry and (non-motor/mech) cavalry divisions only requires a few (if any) trucks, motorized-infantry divisions requires a whole bunch, and mechanized and tank divisions require the most.

 

[Gamer_1745]

OK I fully understand that many (most?) would not want this level of detail. Some of the questions are just to find out how the truck mechanic works & others are to see how I might be able to mod things.

 

[ingwe]

I advocate, for the sake of avoiding too much micromanagement, having a single generic "motor vehicle" representing pretty much all non-combat motor vehicles (so not just light and heavy trucks, but jeeps, halftracks, and artillery tractors as well). Foot infantry and (non-motor/mech) cavalry divisions only requires a few (if any) trucks, motorized-infantry divisions requires a whole bunch, and mechanized and tank divisions require the most.

I would also be okay with that. I like the idea of splitting out halftracks, but I am not sure that much would be gained. Really I am just happy that trucks are in at all!

 

[shri]

A few things-
If you are going to MOD or implement trucks, then you have to implement Horses also.
After all the 2 most important combatants - Germany and USSR used Horses.

So, how many Horses is one Truck? It is easy to convert at first glance, but then going deep there are some problems-

Trucks cannot breed trucks! Horses can, Game is 9-12 years long, enough to have a Generation of Horses.
Trucks need Fuel, Horses need hay. How will Hay or Horse Fodder be modded?
Trucks susceptible to break-downs, Horses were at times more hardy if proper care was taken (What is Proper care is another possible discussion)
Trucks stop in Russian winter, Horses also die and Stop but sometimes can carry on.
Captured Trucks is easy, how will you show captured Horses??
Trucks are faster, but at longer distances will consume most of the fuel themselves, a vicious cycle starts!. How can this be modded?
Trucks are easier to destroy than a Horse, i know a Horse can be shot, but they can also be left behind by Infantry in rear areas etc.

 

[Hans_Schnitzel]

Horse fodder? Seriously? That would simply be a supply cost of cavalry units. Cav divisions simply don't use fuel, 'cept they include any kind of vehicle.

 

[Gamer_1745]

I know tommylotto is planing to add bicycles to the game, so you could have factories training horses. I am not sure if I would have horses, but wagons & carts which could be made in factories for pulling artillery.

I do really hope the Devs answer what questions they can (I am not asking for details like how many men a truck can carry, but can we mod in trucks that carry different number of men?) so I (we) could better understand the mechanics.

 

[bruebottom]

I think Gamer has asked some good questions, as these are question that modders should take interest in, and I do not see it as being a micro-management problem.

The development of trucks from light to heavy, wheeled to tracked, could be handled like tanks or airplanes. This would then be linked to their use; such as towing heavy artillery, moving infantry around or the amount of supplies.

If possible; have the player research heavy trucks, along with heavy artillery, and then an event could fire that informs the player of the two techs being completed. This event would make a heavy artillery battalion buildable and as well as update any necessary unit stats. The player could then add the heavy artillery battalion to his division template. Additional research could see improvements in the battalion stats and the mod would handle all the tedious stuff.

This would be for an immersive game play and it is something that is interesting to me as well.

 

[Hans_Schnitzel]

We don't need to know or even influence how many men a single truck can carry. It would simply be abstracted as: "Truck I" and "Truck II" and once you have unlocked the second one, your mot divisions need less trucks overall, because they can carry more men, but you don't ever see a "men capacity" stat, instead the necessary amount of trucks is reduced and the speed of artillery, mot infantry etc battalions is simply improved in order to reflect that they have faster trucks now. That's all.

 

[Gamer_1745]

bruebottom has said it well!

I could go into many details that I have in mind, but many are dependent on how things work. I know adding any level of complexity to the base game will be too much micro for some, but many of the things I am thinking of I hope most would not find it too tedious and immersion & more game play challenging.

 

[Kovax]

I think the whole argument is missing the point. Trucks will likely be "equipment", and you need X number of them to build a particular unit, and may need to replace any lost or retired ones to avoid some sort of penalty. There won't be "carrying capacity", because the individual trucks won't be anything more than a generic "equipment" item. One 1936 Motorized battalion will require X number of trucks, whether those trucks are made in 1936 or 1945. The units may require more or less trucks as you upgrade the unit, but the truck itself won't change that, as I understand it.

 

[fabius]

Eh, I thought I read they had a change of thinking and trucks are in.

The main thing is that trucks should give some impact to supply capacity.

 

[tommylotto]

I know tommylotto is planing to add bicycles to the game, so you could have factories training horses. I am not sure if I would have horses, but wagons & carts which could be made in factories for pulling artillery.

I do really hope the Devs answer what questions they can (I am not asking for details like how many men a truck can carry, but can we mod in trucks that carry different number of men?) so I (we) could better understand the mechanics.

Well, not exactly. I think that you should have the option to built bicycle infantry as a battalion type, separate from regular infantry -- lighter, faster. I don't necessarily think that you should be required to build the bicycles to equip them. That can be abstracted into the amount of infantry kits required to equip the division.

However, you ask good questions, particularly about trucks and how they will be represented. The mechanics of the game dictate what features can be added through modding. If the number of trucks dictate a division's speed, those same game mechanics could probably be used to add bicycles, horses, zeppelins or whatever and the number of those can effect the division's speed too. The mechanics dictate what mods are possible.

 

[potski]

We don't need to know or even influence how many men a single truck can carry. It would simply be abstracted as: "Truck I" and "Truck II" and once you have unlocked the second one, your mot divisions need less trucks overall, because they can carry more men, but you don't ever see a "men capacity" stat, instead the necessary amount of trucks is reduced and the speed of artillery, mot infantry etc battalions is simply improved in order to reflect that they have faster trucks now. That's all.

This isn't HOI3 though. You will build a definite number of trucks per week. To plan the right amount of factories to put into the production line you really need to know how many trucks are required for an MOT battalion (1,000 men), and multiply accordingly if your MOT Divs contain say 4 or 6 battalions. Then add how many trucks are required for an artillery support unit, and engineers etc to make the Div fully motorised.

Let's say for example that an MOT battalion needs 75 trucks, then you have a figure of about 13 men per truck. Ofc some could have 20 men, while other vehicles have baggage/supplies. But we have an approximate understanding of the "men capacity" of the trucks you build.

The stats have to be pretty detailed, because the game needs to know what happens to the overall stats of a battalion if it doesn't have 75 trucks. Either you failed to supply it with enough trucks, or some of the trucks are out of action due to combat losses, or attrition losses. How fast can the battalion move if it only has 50 operational trucks? Since we assume it won't just abandon one of it's companies, some trucks will be required to make multiple journeys when the Battalion is on the march, and it's ability in combat to deploy it's force quickly where required on the battlefield is degraded.

Ultimately as the number of trucks reduce, but the number of men in the battalion remains the same, the stats come closer to the stats of a foot infantry battalion.