Question - slavery in 1.5

[Agamemnic]

Say I've annexed a planet and wish to enslave its species. Will the AI (including sector) now just enslave the entire species regardless of which pop is on which building?
Will it be smart enough to say "pop A is on research so don't enslave"
Or will the 'species management' tab allow preferential treatment for species not on food/mineral buildings?

Apologies if all this has been addressed but I can't find the answers

 

[BlackUmbrellas]

Say I've annexed a planet and wish to enslave its species. Will the AI (including sector) now just enslave the entire species regardless of which pop is on which building?
Will it be smart enough to say "pop A is on research so don't enslave"
Or will the 'species management' tab allow preferential treatment for species not on food/mineral buildings?

Apologies if all this has been addressed but I can't find the answers

Slavery can be set between "Chattle Slavery" (all POPs are enslaved no matter what) and "Caste System" (where POPs on mineral/food tiles are enslaved and POPs on research/energy are not). This is on a per-species basis.

 

[Agamemnic]

Slavery can be set between "Chattle Slavery" (all POPs are enslaved no matter what) and "Caste System" (where POPs on mineral/food tiles are enslaved and POPs on research/energy are not). This is on a per-species basis.

Excellent

 

[grigorii]

A developer wrote that sectors won't be able to enslave in 1.5. Even more, a pop could not be enslaved, only specie

 

[Dan_Daniel2000]

A developer wrote that sectors won't be able to enslave in 1.5. Even more, a pop could not be enslaved, only specie

No, the sectors cant say who gets enslaved anymore, they enslave based on the species rights. Not that they dont enslave at all.

 

[grigorii]

No, the sectors cant say who gets enslaved anymore, they enslave based on the species rights. Not that they dont enslave at all.

ok, thanks for paraphrasing

 

[Mr. Habba]

I wonder however if sectors will be smart enough to fill a planet that is solely inhabited with slaves with mines/farms...

 

[NHunter_rus]

On a related note, based on what we've been shown so far, the slave species (not caste system, but complete slavery) are forced into subsistence living standards. I... don't like that. Why can't I play a Harmonious Collective/Benevolent Slaver Empire? I want to be able to give even slaves decent living conditions.

 

[BlackUmbrellas]

On a related note, based on what we've been shown so far, the slave species (not caste system, but complete slavery) are forced into subsistence living standards. I... don't like that. Why can't I play a Harmonious Collective/Benevolent Slaver Empire? I want to be able to give even slaves decent living conditions.

Have we been shown that?

 

[General Retreat]

Have we been shown that?

Yeah, I believe Wiz mentioned it in a response post in the relevant diary. That said, if there's still a distinction between regulated and deregulated slavery, I imagine a difference in living conditions could appear there. By definition of being chattel slaves, they're going to get the sticky end of the stick. If you want to be a benevolent slaver (wot?), regulate and take the productivity hit.

 

[iniudan]

On a related note, based on what we've been shown so far, the slave species (not caste system, but complete slavery) are forced into subsistence living standards. I... don't like that. Why can't I play a Harmonious Collective/Benevolent Slaver Empire? I want to be able to give even slaves decent living conditions.

You can, it's called use the caste system.

Slavery can be set between "Chattle Slavery" (all POPs are enslaved no matter what) and "Caste System" (where POPs on mineral/food tiles are enslaved and POPs on research/energy are not). This is on a per-species basis.

Chattel slavery is a type of slavery, not a species rights, that the equivalent of current in game slavery in term of bonus, so +20% food and mineral, thus the only one available if you don't buy the expansion.

Species right are Full Citizenship, Limited Citizenship, Caste, Slaves and Undesirable.
Slavery type are Chattel, Domestic Servitude, Battle Thralls and Livestock.

 

[The Founder]

Chattel slavery is a type of slavery, not a species rights, that the equivalent of current in game slavery in term of bonus, so +20% food and mineral, thus the only one available if you don't buy the expansion.

Species right are Full Citizenship, Limited Citizenship, Caste, Slaves and Undesirable.
Slavery type are Chattel, Domestic Servitude, Battle Thralls and Livestock.

We need to be very clear here:
The Slavery Types Chattel and the Purge Type Extermination are free. Those are the types we already have in the game right now (slavery and purge pre 1.5).
The species right system of Full Citizen/Caste/Limited Citizien/Full Slavery/Undesireable is Free.

Other (more specialised) types of Slavery and Purging are part of the paid expansion.

On a related note, based on what we've been shown so far, the slave species (not caste system, but complete slavery) are forced into subsistence living standards. I... don't like that. Why can't I play a Harmonious Collective/Benevolent Slaver Empire? I want to be able to give even slaves decent living conditions.

Propably becasue you should not be able to stack the happiness bonus on top of the slavery bonus. That could easily bring you to +40%. Wich is propably reserved for species traits+Slavery or Happiness.
Remember that the Despotic Empire bonus to slave production has been removed entirely and that Share the Burden had to be reworked (only to offset regulated slavery), because they used to be way to OP for early rushes.

It seems like it is already designed as an either/or type of thing.

 

[Wizzington]

On a related note, based on what we've been shown so far, the slave species (not caste system, but complete slavery) are forced into subsistence living standards. I... don't like that. Why can't I play a Harmonious Collective/Benevolent Slaver Empire? I want to be able to give even slaves decent living conditions.

You can upgrade them to poor living conditions in the case of chattel slavery and domestic servants, and battle thralls can be given any living conditions you want. The idea that slavery would be remotely economically viable if you gave them decent living standards (keep in mind this covers things like time off work), though. The entire point of chattel slavery is the extraction of forced labor.

 

[NHunter_rus]

You can upgrade them to poor living conditions in the case of chattel slavery and domestic servants, and battle thralls can be given any living conditions you want. The idea that slavery would be remotely economically viable if you gave them decent living standards (keep in mind this covers things like time off work), though. The entire point of chattel slavery is the extraction of forced labor.

Thanks for the answer, Wiz.
I still believe that any slaves that aren't processed (though, giving processed slaves good living conditions will make them better at the role of food) or being force-labored to death should have an option to be given up to "good" (or, at least "normal") living conditions. Forced labor - in my mind - also includes making people work under relatively-normal conditions but on the jobs that just don't want to do. And, let's be honest, not everyone wants to work in the mines.

Also, historically, late-Roman slaves could actually be richer than their lords. And could own their own slaves. So, there are precedents for "good" living conditions for slaves.

 

[Mackus]

Also, historically, late-Roman slaves could actually be richer than their lords. And could own their own slaves. So, there are precedents for "good" living conditions for slaves.

That'd fall under Caste System. Romans didn't keep entire nations mandatorily enslaved. Even if they murdered half of some remote tribe and sold rest into slavery, any of such slaves was theoretically capable to be freed.

Remember, that you are forbidden from giving slaves them high standards only if you mandate that entire race are slaves, no exceptions. That logically excludes treating them decently.

 

[Shatterfury]

You can upgrade them to poor living conditions in the case of chattel slavery and domestic servants, and battle thralls can be given any living conditions you want. The idea that slavery would be remotely economically viable if you gave them decent living standards (keep in mind this covers things like time off work), though. The entire point of chattel slavery is the extraction of forced labor.

I have a small question regarding goods.

If for example I select caste system for a species that means that those that work on science and energy are full citizens and the ones working on farms and mines are chattel slaves.
How do I select for a species that I placed under casts system that I want for the full citizens to have good condition and for the slaves poor ?

And why does caste system make automatic use of chattel slavery ? I think that caste system could very well work with full citizenship/ limited citizenship as well.

 

[BlackUmbrellas]

If for example I select caste system for a species that means that those that work on science and energy are full citizens and the ones working on farms and mines are chattel slaves.

Incorrect- those terms all mean different things. "Caste system" means any POP on a mine or a farm is a slave. They're not "chattel slaves" because "chattel slavery" means you're ALL enslaved- equally, POPs not enslaved are not "full citizens" because if you move that POP onto a mine it is enslaved automatically.

How do I select for a species that I placed under casts system that I want for the full citizens to have good condition and for the slaves poor ?

It's inherent in the fact that the POPs on top of mines and farms are enslaved.

 

[Zoinker]

And why does caste system make automatic use of chattel slavery ? I think that caste system could very well work with full citizenship/ limited citizenship as well.

Easier to implement, I suppose? Though are caste slaves limited to the chattel slavery type? One of the concepts I want to try for Banks is a cannibal plantoid race that has a separate 'salad' caste, (though in that case, would pops working minerals still be enslaved?)

Also, under caste system, what happens to the pop on the capital tile? I always found it odd to enslave the capital population.

 

[Wizzington]

Thanks for the answer, Wiz.
I still believe that any slaves that aren't processed (though, giving processed slaves good living conditions will make them better at the role of food) or being force-labored to death should have an option to be given up to "good" (or, at least "normal") living conditions. Forced labor - in my mind - also includes making people work under relatively-normal conditions but on the jobs that just don't want to do. And, let's be honest, not everyone wants to work in the mines.

Also, historically, late-Roman slaves could actually be richer than their lords. And could own their own slaves. So, there are precedents for "good" living conditions for slaves.

For individual slaves, sure. For entire populations of mine workers? Yeah, no.

 

[The Founder]

Thanks for the answer, Wiz.
I still believe that any slaves that aren't processed (though, giving processed slaves good living conditions will make them better at the role of food) or being force-labored to death should have an option to be given up to "good" (or, at least "normal") living conditions. Forced labor - in my mind - also includes making people work under relatively-normal conditions but on the jobs that just don't want to do. And, let's be honest, not everyone wants to work in the mines.

Also, historically, late-Roman slaves could actually be richer than their lords. And could own their own slaves. So, there are precedents for "good" living conditions for slaves.

For individual slaves, sure. For entire populations of mine workers? Yeah, no.

As Wiz said: You are too focussed on single cases.
A single unit of Human Pops in Stellaris is something around 500,000,000 people (personal guess). Even if 1% get that lucky, that is still 495,000,000 living in shitty conditions. Indeed those 1% will propably just become part of the non-enslaved population (higher caste). With the missing 5,000,000 being filled by newly enslaved people.