Question About the End of the SCW

[dag231]

As Germany, I aggressively courted the Nationalists the second the SCW started, and watched helplessly as they got their ass kicked... but just before they got crushed, I managed to get an alliance in and rushed troops in...

Fast forward a year later, and Spain is in control... I go to annex the Republicans, they agree... and all of Spain is handed over to the Nationalists?

WTF???

I didnt enter the SCW to just give a victory to Franco. I entered it to gain a few very valuable provinces.

Is there an event that fires after a short wait, after the Republicans are no more, where I keep what is mine?

I understand the value of courting the Nationalists as an ally and all... but seriously - I just dont trust them to keep a few provinces safe and sound (the African coast beaches, the provinces along the French border, the islands in the Med), and I want them directly under my control.

Did the game get changed to prevent Germany from gaining provinces?

If this is the case, suing for peace and allowing the Republicans to exist is the only viable alternative for Germany.

 

[Mork]

So you go into a *civil* war on one of the sides, and expect to rob them of their country?

Remember, it's a civil war, the enemy is internal.


Besides, a lot of those provinces are NatSpa's national provinces, of course they revert to NatSpas control, just like any other core reverts to it's "rightful" owner.

 

[dag231]

So you go into a *civil* war on one of the sides, and expect to rob them of their country?

Remember, it's a civil war, the enemy is internal.


Besides, a lot of those provinces are NatSpa's national provinces, of course they revert to NatSpas control, just like any other core reverts to it's "rightful" owner.

In reality, and historically, when an external country intervened in a civil war, it got something out if it. Long-term bases under their control, for example (a classic and current example is the 99-year lease or whatever the USA has in Iraq). The equivalent in HOI2 is not military access, but complete control.

What I entered the SCW looking for, and expecting to get, are long-term "leases" on strategically important pieces of territory. Otherwise, there would have been no point in entering the SCW and wasting all that money, manpower, resources, etc...

 

[blue emu]

Whenever you and an ally fight the same opponent (regardless of whether it's a civil war or not), you automatically hand over to your ally any provinces that he has claims on, when the opponent is annexed. It's part of the alliance agreement.

Eg: Germany, allied with Italy, attacks Yugoslavia. Even if no Italian soldier even sets foot in Yugoslavia, Italy will be given the Dalmatian Coast when Yugoslavia gets annexed... because they have claims on it.

If you wanted to take provinces for yourself, declare war on the same opponent, but refuse alliance.

 

[blue emu]

In reality, and historically, when an external country intervened in a civil war, it got something out if it. Long-term bases under their control, for example...

Ummm... in real life, Germany, Italy and USSR all sent troops to support one side or the other in the SCW. They got none of the things you mention.

Russia sent troops to support Chiang in China... they got nothing out of it.

 

[dag231]

Whenever you and an ally fight the same opponent (regardless of whether it's a civil war or not), you automatically hand over to your ally any provinces that he has claims on, when the opponent is annexed. It's part of the alliance agreement.

Eg: Germany, allied with Italy, attacks Yugoslavia. Even if no Italian soldier even sets foot in Yugoslavia, Italy will be given the Dalmatian Coast when Yugoslavia gets annexed... because they have claims on it.

If you wanted to take provinces for yourself, declare war on the same opponent, but refuse alliance.

Makes sense...

So, I assume, NatSpain has claims on all of Spain...

Piss on them - going to try to get what I want via negotiations... Franco et al just arent that reliable an ally...

 

[blue emu]

Now that you are at peace... get back on your boats, boot them out of the alliance, declare war, and re-invade!

 

[dag231]

Now that you are at peace... get back on your boats, boot them out of the alliance, declare war, and re-invade!

Excellent idea... except for that tiny little beligerance problem...

No, I am content to settle for a peace treaty where Franco gets reamed for being so bloody incompetent in the first place...

 

[mib]

Franco et al just arent that reliable an ally...

Wait, you enter into the Spanish CIVIL WAR and tries to steal provinces from the Nationalists, and you call FRANCO unreliable?

 

[Mork]

In reality, and historically, when an external country intervened in a civil war, it got something out if it. Long-term bases under their control, for example (a classic and current example is the 99-year lease or whatever the USA has in Iraq). The equivalent in HOI2 is not military access, but complete control.

What I entered the SCW looking for, and expecting to get, are long-term "leases" on strategically important pieces of territory. Otherwise, there would have been no point in entering the SCW and wasting all that money, manpower, resources, etc...

There would be plenty reasons, better trades as allies, blueprints, another front for the war against France, a route into Gibralta, ect. Province sized land never got handed off in civil wars.

Besides, when was the war against Iraq* ever an intervention into a civil war?

*Sadams Iraq

 

[dag231]

Wait, you enter into the Spanish CIVIL WAR and tries to steal provinces from the Nationalists, and you call FRANCO unreliable?

Here's the way I look at it... Franco was almost crushed... I had spent a lot of money and all that initial support to make him a winner... but he still managed to get his ass kicked... as he was almost dead - literally, stuck in La Coruna, he reluctantly agreed to let me be his ally... and I proceeded to win back the entire country from the bad guys... now, he seriously expects me to just give it back to him? Come on - lets be serious...

The Republicans come to me and say "hey - why dont we give you want you want, that whole Med Sea control thing and the African coastal provinces, and we end this. Oh, and Franco has to get nothing out of the deal. What do you say?"

What deal would you, as an aspiring Dictator of the World take? The deal where you did all the heavy lifting, spent all the time, manpower, resources and money and did really all the important fighting as Franco had his entire army anniliated in La Coruna - you did all this and get nothing? Or the deal where you secure some very important and very valuable pieces of real estate?

Oh, sure, Franco would be pissed. But thats his own damn fault for being such a piss-poor military tactician, isnt it?

 

[dag231]

There would be plenty reasons, better trades as allies, blueprints, another front for the war against France, a route into Gibralta, ect. Province sized land never got handed off in civil wars.

Besides, when was the war against Iraq* ever an intervention into a civil war?

*Sadams Iraq

True, it wasnt a Civil War, but the outcome was a fairly big chunk of land becoming, essentially, USA property.

As to whether historically land never changed hands via intervention... I'd have to look back into the books, but I am fairly sure such deals were commonplace throughout history...

 

[unmerged(13745)]

In reality, and historically, when an external country intervened in a civil war, it got something out if it. Long-term bases under their control, for example (a classic and current example is the 99-year lease or whatever the USA has in Iraq). The equivalent in HOI2 is not military access, but complete control.

What I entered the SCW looking for, and expecting to get, are long-term "leases" on strategically important pieces of territory. Otherwise, there would have been no point in entering the SCW and wasting all that money, manpower, resources, etc...

Dident you get blue prints when they won the war?

i wouldent call that nothing

 

[Mork]

That abd that Gibralta is now a Gazilian times easier to take as the AI defend more against humans than AIs (IIRC).

 

[dag231]

Dident you get blue prints when they won the war? i wouldent call that nothing

Well... the war is still ongoing for them...

I suppose I should send some exp forces so they could win and all...