Can you recruit foreign people from conquered lands into your army? Otherwise, I don't see many options for a small nation like Hungary except creating a multi-ethnic, Napoleon style army.
Question about manpower
- Thread starter Adonnus
- Start date
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
You can only recruit a very small 2% (thanks for Da9L for correcting me, must have changed then) of the possible manpower from non-core territory. If you have cores on foreign territory that will of course be considered rightfull yours so you will get full bonuses from those. That is to not only prevent massive snowballing but also to keep it somewhat realistic, since i doubt the majority of a recently conquered country were keen of fighting for their conquerers.
For example, if a state you conquered normaly would give you, lets say, 1.000 manpower with your current recruitment policies you would get 20 from it if it is a non-core state.
For example, if a state you conquered normaly would give you, lets say, 1.000 manpower with your current recruitment policies you would get 20 from it if it is a non-core state.
Last edited:
- 2
- 1
A very small 2%, not 10%
Damn... so what happens when the 800k Hungarians are all dead? I mean, there should be some option to make this a higher % especially for minor powers right...
Increase the manpower law even more and research so I get the extra 5% from the Human Wave Offensive doctrine tech.
- 5
- 2
Recruitment and occupation laws, mostly. Softer occupation means more recruitable population in occupied lands.
Fair enough, but if the max is only 2% you could conquer all of Europe and still receive only a small amount of manpower. Eh, it's just my opinion but I preferred the Hoi3 system here in a rare change. Using collaboration governments makes sense since more local troops can free up national troops for the front line. Beyond using foreign factories it gives you at least some other strategic advantage by conquering many nations.
- 6
2% does seem a little small. If you have very soft occupation laws, then I think up to somewhere between 5% and 10% seems more accurate. I would be very curious if any numbers are available from a historical perspective.
- 3
- 2
Wait a minute...
There is a Hungarian village of 1000 people and you can recruit 100 people from that village.
There is also an occupied Austrian village of 1000 people. Are you saying that you can recruit at 2% of the scale so you can get only 20 Austrian traitors to fight for Hungary, or are you saying that you get 2% of your current recruit law, which would mean one in five hundred? Meaning that a village of 1000 people would give you only 2 guys who didn't manage to just get married or 'sick' when the recruiters came ? Or whatever.
LordofWar's post confuses me...
"if a state you conquered normaly would give you, lets say, 1.000 manpower with your current recruitment policies you would get 20 from it if it is a non-core state."
Does that mean if that state HAS 1000 people, of which 100 are able bodied willing males, or does that mean that it is actually a town with population of 10 000, which normally gives 1000 able bodied willing men, but if occupied gives only 20?
There is a Hungarian village of 1000 people and you can recruit 100 people from that village.
There is also an occupied Austrian village of 1000 people. Are you saying that you can recruit at 2% of the scale so you can get only 20 Austrian traitors to fight for Hungary, or are you saying that you get 2% of your current recruit law, which would mean one in five hundred? Meaning that a village of 1000 people would give you only 2 guys who didn't manage to just get married or 'sick' when the recruiters came ? Or whatever.
LordofWar's post confuses me...
"if a state you conquered normaly would give you, lets say, 1.000 manpower with your current recruitment policies you would get 20 from it if it is a non-core state."
Does that mean if that state HAS 1000 people, of which 100 are able bodied willing males, or does that mean that it is actually a town with population of 10 000, which normally gives 1000 able bodied willing men, but if occupied gives only 20?
do occupation laws affect annexed territory, as well as occupied territory? if not, what do you get in the way of efficiency (IC/manpower/resources) from annexed territory? can you increase it?
There is an occupied state with any amount of possible soldiers. You take 2% of those and then apply your normal conscription laws. We saw in the MP WWW what happens when this is not done: Germany conquers Russia and goes human wave. So yes, a high reluctance of conquered Population to fight for their oppressors seems legit and is needed for Balance.
btw: A similar model, or to be correct, a model with a similar effect, was applied in EU4 ( in I guess very much all Versions). But in EU4, this malus degraded over time. Since HoI4, you Play for years instead of centuries, there is not enough time to make the malus go away.
- 5
As fare as I understand it: If you have a state with lets say 1.000.000 pop. your laws, focuses and techs allow you to recruit 5%. So you have a manpower pool of 50.000.
If it is a non-core: you have your pool of 50.000, but only 2% of them are recruitable. Would be 1000 manpower. Sounds low but hay there is still balancing to be done.
EDIT: is the same if you do the 98% first.
Well if all 800k Hungarian troops are all dead, there is nothing stopping all the conquered countries to just declare independence
Much more realistic and makes large conquests by minors much harder, and rewarding.
As for the numbers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wehrmacht_foreign_volunteers_and_conscripts):
Around 1 million foreign volunteers and conscripts served in the Wehrmacht, out of around 120 millions in occupied countries (not counting USSR except Baltics as they are mentioned separately and are also a special case, but this number includes all volunteers including countries which were not occupied by Germany) compared to total of 18 million Germans serving in German army out of around 80 million total German population in 1939 (http://www.feldgrau.com/stats.html). So 0,8% compared to 22,5% out of total population, which is 3,6%. So 2% may be a bit on a low side, but roughly right given the amount of guesswork and quality of sources (quick google search).
- 8
- 5
- 1
From what I remember:
Only occupied territory. Annexed territory has no unrest and you get all the IC and resources. The 2% manpower-modifier should remain though.
- 1
- 1
From my understanding... this means that countries with low population should focus on a NON HUMAN WAVE doctrine.
Say... superior firepower? Just a suggestion. Mold your doctrine to your nation, not the other way around imho.
Say... superior firepower? Just a suggestion. Mold your doctrine to your nation, not the other way around imho.
Here is the final math:
Region has 100.000 population.
It gets a non-core penalty.Which disables recruitment of 98%.
Now your recruitment pool is 2000.
Your recruitment policies will be calculated on this.
For example Scrapping the Barrel (%25) will give you 500 manpower in this example.
Region has 100.000 population.
It gets a non-core penalty.Which disables recruitment of 98%.
Now your recruitment pool is 2000.
Your recruitment policies will be calculated on this.
For example Scrapping the Barrel (%25) will give you 500 manpower in this example.
- 1
I'm kinda glad there is a forced cap on manpower gain from occupied lands.
My HoI 3 games usually had me sitting on 1000's of extra manpower and still able to produce 100's of divisions.
For example. My recent game as Germany had me at over 100 manpower a month. Granted I had annexed metropolitan France, the UK, Poland, the low countries, Spain, Norway, Canada, the Caribbean and Russia up to the Chinese border. But by 1953, even with 530 active divisions, I could rebuild my entire army twice-over. This would have been unlikely, even with an Axis-dominated globe.
Of course, the propaganda of the day illustrated my HoI game as the realistic outcome of German victory.
Start at 51:45 for the part I'm talking about.
My HoI 3 games usually had me sitting on 1000's of extra manpower and still able to produce 100's of divisions.
For example. My recent game as Germany had me at over 100 manpower a month. Granted I had annexed metropolitan France, the UK, Poland, the low countries, Spain, Norway, Canada, the Caribbean and Russia up to the Chinese border. But by 1953, even with 530 active divisions, I could rebuild my entire army twice-over. This would have been unlikely, even with an Axis-dominated globe.
Of course, the propaganda of the day illustrated my HoI game as the realistic outcome of German victory.
Start at 51:45 for the part I'm talking about.
Can manpower grow overtime(population growth), or can this be modded in maybe?
Popuation does not grow in 12 years. Certainly not at war. Basically, even with the most desperate conscription law, every soldier you can have in 1948 was already born in 1936. Not speculating any further about the age of the soldiers in "scraping the barrel" since it is abstracted for a reason.
The amount of military age manpower, however, does grow as the younger generations come-of-age. And the way the demographics work out means this quantity can increase or decrease depending on circumstances. Podcat has stated this is modelled in the game, although the details are unknown.