Why is the total IC displayed in the upper right not equal to the sum of the ICs used on consumer products, supplies, research, and production? I would think that the sum of those four numbers would have to equal the total IC.
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My Best Guess:
There are certain technologies/cabinet members that increase supply production effectivness and lower consumer goods demand, which could explain why the numbers don't add up.
There are certain technologies/cabinet members that increase supply production effectivness and lower consumer goods demand, which could explain why the numbers don't add up.
Supplies is one the one stand out. Set supplies to zero, and your other 3 will add up to your total industry. Not sure what the exact multiple is, but for every IC you invest in supplies, you get a higher ratio (modifiable by techs).
You get about 3 supplies for each IC.
The only IC number you have to be concerned with is the one that you mentioned on the upper right of the main screen. It takes into account all of the things that affect IC: research, ministers, annexing vs controlling, conquering. There are a lot of calculations to set that up right and the only place that the correct IC numbers are displayed in the game is in that number.
The only IC number you have to be concerned with is the one that you mentioned on the upper right of the main screen. It takes into account all of the things that affect IC: research, ministers, annexing vs controlling, conquering. There are a lot of calculations to set that up right and the only place that the correct IC numbers are displayed in the game is in that number.
Just making sure that I understand
So the total IC displayed in the upper right of the main screen = (supply ICs/3) + consumer products + production + research ?
Regarding resources:
coal ---> used for production and supplies
rubber ---> used for production and supplies
steel ---> used for production and supplies
oil ---> used for supplies
Also, what specifically happens when there are enough available ICs to complete a unit by a certain date, but steel, rubber, and/or coal is too low to make the unit? Basically, I want to know the relationship of resources to IC in the four aforemention economic areas.
So the total IC displayed in the upper right of the main screen = (supply ICs/3) + consumer products + production + research ?
Regarding resources:
coal ---> used for production and supplies
rubber ---> used for production and supplies
steel ---> used for production and supplies
oil ---> used for supplies
Also, what specifically happens when there are enough available ICs to complete a unit by a certain date, but steel, rubber, and/or coal is too low to make the unit? Basically, I want to know the relationship of resources to IC in the four aforemention economic areas.
Not completely, as some values are modified by several Techs and Ministers.
1 IC needs 2 Coal, 1 Steel, 0.5 Rubber to work. As long as you are able to have IC (by having enough resources, either from provinces or conversion), you have IC to spend on units. IC is an abstraction, so there are no actual resources put into a unit. As long as you have IC, you produce.
Yes... your producing IC is actually limited by *either* resource availability, or the capacities of your factories, whichever is lower. That factory capacity is what you increase by imrpoving our provinces, researching polypropylene, etcetera. Resource availability can only be increased by getting more resources somehow.
The amount of actively productive IC's is what is displayed in the upper right corner of the map screen (as the second part of the fraction). The first part is the quatity of that which is allocated to military production but not being used to produce units (because you have less orders than the amount of ICs allocated to that cateogy.)
Note that excess ICs allocated to research, consumer goods or supplies do consume resources, while unused miliatry construction ICs do not. If you have a resource limitation you can save resources by throwing the extra ICs into that category. (In all four categories, if enough ICs are allocated the number will be white; if not enough, the number will be red. For research and military construction, the cutoff amount is enough to deal with all of your pending orders at once - you may not require that many if you don't mind that some of those orders will be delayed.)
The amount of actively productive IC's is what is displayed in the upper right corner of the map screen (as the second part of the fraction). The first part is the quatity of that which is allocated to military production but not being used to produce units (because you have less orders than the amount of ICs allocated to that cateogy.)
Note that excess ICs allocated to research, consumer goods or supplies do consume resources, while unused miliatry construction ICs do not. If you have a resource limitation you can save resources by throwing the extra ICs into that category. (In all four categories, if enough ICs are allocated the number will be white; if not enough, the number will be red. For research and military construction, the cutoff amount is enough to deal with all of your pending orders at once - you may not require that many if you don't mind that some of those orders will be delayed.)
Under CORE, extending a province' infra does also increase the number of ressources gathered. That's why I (as Germany) start increasing infra as soon as I lack sufficient ressources to produce, as you do not need ressources to fire those ICs you actually spend on improving.
Ralph
Ralph
If you overallocate IC to research, it has the same as overallocating to units. Both methods idle industries which reduce resource use. But only military overallocation is shown in the main screen. To verify that, just do military overallocation, look at resources used, then do the same with military exactly funded or underfunded while research is overfunded. The resources used up will be the same. So you can idle industries by overfunding either research or units but only units shows on the main screen.
Von Braun asked: So the total IC displayed in the upper right of the main screen = (supply ICs/3) + consumer products + production + research ?
NO. You are looking at it the wrong way. Again the only IC number to pay attention to is on the main screen. The production allocation screen just divides up the IC that you see on the main screen. Note that these numbers are calculated more precisely than what you see on screen and are rounded. Just focus on the one IC number - it's as simple as that.
Von Braun asked: So the total IC displayed in the upper right of the main screen = (supply ICs/3) + consumer products + production + research ?
NO. You are looking at it the wrong way. Again the only IC number to pay attention to is on the main screen. The production allocation screen just divides up the IC that you see on the main screen. Note that these numbers are calculated more precisely than what you see on screen and are rounded. Just focus on the one IC number - it's as simple as that.
As john heidel said, no. The main reason it is wrong that he didn't mention is that the supply slider shows SUPPLIES, NOT ICs. So a more accurate formula would be total IC displayed in the upper right of the main screen = (supplies/3) + consumer products + production + research. Still not exact because the number of supplies per IC varies a bit depending on what industrial tech you have.von Braun said:
No it doesn't. That is a feature of the engine which is not changeable by a mod. If you're sure you are seeing it then please ask about it and give your exact testing process in the CORE discussion thread because AFAIK no one else has seen it.Roland II. said:
john heidle said:
Bloody hell, well I never knew that! :rofl:
That would explain a lot of observed phenomenon wrt supply consumption.
Why was this fact documented somewhere in the game? Even the book of unfacts (the user manual) would been a start!
Thanks for that fact.
One major reason would be that since it is modified by techs and ministers it is actually different for every country. It's fairly easy to check: just unlock all the sliders and put all ICs into supplies and see how high the slider goes.Cunneda said:
@JDROU
my testing was simple. I checked the amount of ressources germany was producing, then started to improve INFRA in all ressource gathering provinces. After the completion of that I again checked the amount of ressources gathered and saw an increase by some 5%. No conquests done in the mean time. In my current game as Japan I'm doing the same and also notice an increase in ressource production. Besides, it's mentioned in the manual that increased INFRA does improve industry efficency. (which does not mean anything, as I learnt).
If this is a CORE feature or a basic HoI feature I can't tell, as I'm playing with CORE; that's my only source of info.
And, yes, a 5% increas is not that striking, lets say making a 5 Oil province to a 5.2 Oil province. But alltogether it counts, additionally as it does not take away any IC from you if done at the instance that you lack ressources anyhow to run at full efficency.
PS:
it might be that I saw simply the effect of recovery of captured provinces. Possible. I will do some additional research on that.
my testing was simple. I checked the amount of ressources germany was producing, then started to improve INFRA in all ressource gathering provinces. After the completion of that I again checked the amount of ressources gathered and saw an increase by some 5%. No conquests done in the mean time. In my current game as Japan I'm doing the same and also notice an increase in ressource production. Besides, it's mentioned in the manual that increased INFRA does improve industry efficency. (which does not mean anything, as I learnt).
If this is a CORE feature or a basic HoI feature I can't tell, as I'm playing with CORE; that's my only source of info.
And, yes, a 5% increas is not that striking, lets say making a 5 Oil province to a 5.2 Oil province. But alltogether it counts, additionally as it does not take away any IC from you if done at the instance that you lack ressources anyhow to run at full efficency.
PS:
it might be that I saw simply the effect of recovery of captured provinces. Possible. I will do some additional research on that.
That or recovery from any strategic bombing against you. Resources recover very slowly.
If a province with 160 coal is reduced to zero coal when taken over by another country, or by strategic bombing, it will take more than a month to recover. The recovery rate for resources is only 2 or 3 a day. I don't know if anyone has figured out a firm number for that resource recovery rate, but if Essen was bombed or Arlon was just taken over, you will see a gradual increase in resources which could distort any tests being done. It's not an easy thing to test.
If a province with 160 coal is reduced to zero coal when taken over by another country, or by strategic bombing, it will take more than a month to recover. The recovery rate for resources is only 2 or 3 a day. I don't know if anyone has figured out a firm number for that resource recovery rate, but if Essen was bombed or Arlon was just taken over, you will see a gradual increase in resources which could distort any tests being done. It's not an easy thing to test.
Well a coal mine might be under ground like Math Guy said but you gotta figure if the area above gets hit bad enough it could possibly collapse the mine under neath. You send a B-17 on a bombing run over the area I'm sure you'd do some serious damage to the internal workings of it.
Why do consumer requirements go down when IC does? If I have no resources, I produce no IC and need no consumer goods. In real life dissent would increase if there were no consumer goods around.
Consumer Goods seems to be a percentage of total produced - so as your total IC improves, so does the amount allocated to CG (proportionally so). Note that this amount is also affected by a number of factors (e.g. ministers dissent value +5 -1 etc - which does NOT appear to acutally increase or decrease dissent (i.e. the dissent number at the top) but rather makes your people more or less reliant upon CG to cheer them up!).
You will of course still see an increase in the number of IC available for allocation but this figure will not be 100% of the total new territories IC etc. which you have captured.
(The CG proportion varies a lot depending on govt. type too.)
You will of course still see an increase in the number of IC available for allocation but this figure will not be 100% of the total new territories IC etc. which you have captured.
(The CG proportion varies a lot depending on govt. type too.)
I did a test under defined circumstance, between 1936 and 1937. To my surprise and sorrow increasing Infra had no effect on ressource gathering.
Ralph
Ralph
Roland II. said:I did a test under defined circumstance, between 1936 and 1937. To my surprise and sorrow increasing Infra had no effect on ressource gathering.
Ralph
q.e.d.