Q: does it make any sense (korea)

[Aetius]

Originally posted by ZheShiWO
Iam preaty sure the Americans broke the Japanese military and civilian codes, so how can their spy agencies be impressive ?The Americans knew about Midway after all..

The Japanese had several parallel spy organisations. The military one was divided into at least 4 divisions, 2 under the Imperial Navy and Army general staffs and then another 2 which served under the Military police of respective branch. Then you have the spy organisations run by factions within the army in co-operation with criminal organisations like the Triads and so on. Each of the organisations had their own communication method which meant that cracking one set of codes did not give the full picture. Enough to win the war though.
The Americans AFAIK manage to crack the naval codes and diplomatic codes. No big achievement since both the British and Dutch had done this much earlier. The IJA codes I am not that sure about.
Now even if the Americans did manage to break the Japanese codes, it doesn't mean that the Japanese spying organisation is bad, just that Japanese encryption technology is bad.

 

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Extoll me on the wonders of Japanese spys then ? Please, preaty please, tell me some great achievement that will merit a Japanese spy bonus ?

 

[Aetius]

Originally posted by ZheShiWO
Extoll me on the wonders of Japanese spys then ? Please, preaty please, tell me some great achievement that will merit a Japanese spy bonus ?

I am not saying that they should have a spying bonus, but they weren't that bad at spying. Most of the effort was directed at the Chinese though.
The Japanese were quite good at political manipulation, they successfully guided Sun Yat Sen to eliminate the Manchus, managed to secure the defection of Burma to Axis side by educating Aung San and his friends and install a series of relatively loyal puppet governments through East Asia.
The Japanese had cracked both the US and UK diplomatic codes before 1941, which matched the US and UK skills at cracking the Japanese codes. They also ran brothels close to US military bases to which successfully recruited spys to gain intelligence on US ships.
As for the success of the Japanese spies, well they did succeed in what they were supposed to do: gain enough intelligence to secure the rapid conquest of the Dutch East Indies. They also managed to gain enough intelligence for Japanese to carry out their secondary goal: securing the flanks for the invasion of the Dutch East Indies. The Japanese did successfully launch attacks in 4 major areas at once: the Pacific Islands, Malaya, the Phillipines and Pearl Harbour. That the Japanese lost the war was no fault of their spying operation.

 

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Had the elections been held in pre 1950 around 48-49 when the only time the amount of people leaving S.K outstriped those entering S.K, then yes. After 1950 they were held and no, there was no way Kim would have gained a thing. The influx of American dollars boosted the Korean economy and therefore made Communism a moot point. Face it, Communism is inherently a failed Utpoian idea. Look at the facts of Communism, it only broils en masse in countries that are poor and inpovershed. Where the poor have no hope of gaining or having a better life, so they chose the path in which all are equal and the government "provides" all basic essentials.
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Is that why until "internal conflicts" United States was about to experience 250 thousand workers on strike and 100 thousand armed rebels ready to start a "socialist revolution" here with the army out of the country, during World War One? Its no more utopian than our Democracy, witch in all actuality is a bureaucratic republic where someone stupid enough to wave at a blind man gets "elected" president I must say I like the British Prime Minister a lot better. I do not know much about his politics but much respect to Britain on the way it handled it's self with the trade center thing.Of course I must say right after the thing Bush did well too except for that thing about a crusade........

 

[TeutonicKnight]

Is that why until "internal conflicts" United States was about to experience 250 thousand workers on strike and 100 thousand armed rebels ready to start a "socialist revolution" here with the army out of the country, during World War One? Its no more utopian than our Democracy, witch in all actuality is a bureaucratic republic where someone stupid enough to wave at a blind man gets "elected" president I must say I like the British Prime Minister a lot better. I do not know much about his politics but much respect to Britain on the way it handled it's self with the trade center thing.Of course I must say right after the thing Bush did well too except for that thing about a crusade........

I have no idea what your refering to. To my knowlege a strike is hardly a revolution, and IF 100,000 people armed themselves in an aparrent overthrow of the United States government, I would say good luck.

Communism is a Utopian idea in respect that all are equal. Democracy you are all aloted the right to do better and to think freely, which is prohibited in Communism.

Our Democracy is a Representative Republic, not Bureacratic Republic. To be a true Democracy would be in itself suicidle.

 

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About the code war in the Pacific...

Is it true what I heard that the US used some small indian tribe and their language as a code? This of course was impossible for the Japanese to dechiffer...

 

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Originally posted by Wertigo
About the code war in the Pacific...

Is it true what I heard that the US used some small indian tribe and their language as a code? This of course was impossible for the Japanese to dechiffer...

I once read this. You are speaking of American Indians, correct?? Native Americans?? If you are, then yes. I believe that is correct. I hope I helped!


Meiji-Tenno

 

[TeutonicKnight]

Yes, it was the Navaho Indian language.

 

[Generalfeldmarschall]

yes impossible to crack... very difficult and complex verb conjugations only 3 or 4 whites speak it...

 

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It was a very good idea to use this (The language of the Navaho). Does anyone know who thought of it?? I don't think any Japanese knew the language. I am not sure though, but I don't think so.


Meiji-Tenno

 

[TeutonicKnight]

Hey Meiji, wasn't Takeda Shingen nick-named the Tiger? I can't remember if it was he, Useugi or Nobunaga who actually first used firearms. I do know that Nobunaga was the once who exploited thier advantage and used them to his advantage. I have always been fascinated with the "Warring States Period" Do you happen to know of any good websites or books?

 

[TeutonicKnight]

Here is a link to the code talkers, search the net for Wind Talkers and you will get more information.

http://www.awesomestories.com/movies/wind_talkers/wind_talkers_ch1.htm

 

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During World War One, after the Russian Revolution, our army was out of country and we where on the brink of revolution. The only thing that stooped it was no one in the 'party' could agree about exactly what 'comunissum/socialism' was. So worker said the people in charge where idiots and the rebels got drunk, or what ever armed rebels do when they find out there is going to be no revolution. And we most certainly do have a bureaucracy. I do agree communism is utopian, but thought I would point out it did not only strike in 'weak political' countries with starving peasants as many people are left to believe.

 

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Originally posted by Delinquent Rock
During World War One, after the Russian Revolution, our army was out of country and we where on the brink of revolution.

It would be a lot easier to understand your post if you'd made it clearer who 'we' are.

(As a general rule, it's not a good idea to use words like 'our' and 'we' in an international forum - it can be very confusing. Avatars are not labels that identify nationality reliably).

 

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Originally posted by TeutonicKnight
Hey Meiji, wasn't Takeda Shingen nick-named the Tiger? I can't remember if it was he, Useugi or Nobunaga who actually first used firearms. I do know that Nobunaga was the once who exploited thier advantage and used them to his advantage. I have always been fascinated with the "Warring States Period" Do you happen to know of any good websites or books?

I do not know of any websites or books right now.. Sorry! If I find any, I'll let you know!

Yes, Takeda Shingen was know as the "Tiger of Kai".
I am not sure which person first used them. I probably read it once, but I don't remember.. It was Nobunaga who first used understood their power. The first great battle that was fought with them was Nagashino. Takeda Katsuyori (Daimyo after Shingen) attacked Nobunaga's castle at Nagashino. Nobunaga was on military campaigns. A messenger arrived with the news, and Nobunaga went back to Nagashino. Now, the Takeda had a huge force of cavalry. They were very powerful and had famous cavalry charges, which was one of their main strategies. Nobunaga had his men build up a bamboo fence and lined up his Ashigaru, armed with guns, behind the fence. Behind them were spearmen. Nobunaga also sent a small cavalry force into a nearby wood. The Takeda army charged at the Oda forces. The ashigaru waited for the cavalrymen to get close, then fired, heavily thinning out their lines. When the cavalry got close enough, the spearmen kept them at bay with their yari (spears) and then the Oda cavalry force charged out of the woods at Takeda's flank. The battle ended as an Oda victory.

Meiji-Tenno

 

[TeutonicKnight]

During World War One, after the Russian Revolution, our army was out of country and we where on the brink of revolution. The only thing that stooped it was no one in the 'party' could agree about exactly what 'comunissum/socialism' was. So worker said the people in charge where idiots and the rebels got drunk, or what ever armed rebels do when they find out there is going to be no revolution. And we most certainly do have a bureaucracy. I do agree communism is utopian, but thought I would point out it did not only strike in 'weak political' countries with starving peasants as many people are left to believe.

Ok, never heard of that one. I do know that there has been a small movement in the US with Socialism. I have never heard of such a "revolution" within the U.S. would you care to list some sources.

We do NOT have a bureacracratic Democracy government, I have never heard of such. We have a Representative Republic. You elect a representative who in turn votes/represents you.

Who were those people that were supposedly going to try and ovethrow the government? Poor people, who at the time had no job, which solidifies what I had said. Like I said, I would love to see some proof of said "revolution."

I didn't say weak political parties, I said it broils en masse in countries that are impovershed, key word being en masse.

 

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Meiji-Tenno, if you please, what is the opinion among the Japanese about the book Shogun, by James Clavell? I've heard that it isn't entirely accurate in the background story. I went to Tokyo in 1998, but I didn't think to ask anyone. Your english is excellent, by the way.

As for the "Wind Talkers", there is a new movie (starring Nicholas Cage, directed by John Woo) about them. I haven't seen it, so I don't know in what light it portrays the Japanese soldiers, but hopefully it'll be released over there in not too long.

 

[Aetius]

There were no Navajo speakers in Japan. The US checked before using them. But there was a weak link in the US system: embassies and the US mainland.

 

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Originally posted by 17028
Meiji-Tenno, if you please, what is the opinion among the Japanese about the book Shogun, by James Clavell? I've heard that it isn't entirely accurate in the background story. I went to Tokyo in 1998, but I didn't think to ask anyone. Your english is excellent, by the way.

As for the "Wind Talkers", there is a new movie (starring Nicholas Cage, directed by John Woo) about them. I haven't seen it, so I don't know in what light it portrays the Japanese soldiers, but hopefully it'll be released over there in not too long.

I have not read the book Shogun. Sorry.. Here is a summary of the true story that it is based off of...

There was a British sailor who was sailing to Japan (or maybe the East Indies.. I don't remember his destination) in a Dutch Ship. I think his name was John Adams.. Most of the ships went around Africa and through the Indian Ocean, but he was in one of the few ships that went through the Strait of Magellan. His ship was shipwrecked on Japan, and he was brought to the Shogun, Tokugawa Ieyasu. I think he was the first Englishmen to step foot on Japan. There was a Portuguese Priest (or missionary.. He was allowed to stay as a translator) who acted as a translator between Adams and Tokugawa. The Portuguese didn't like the English so he told Tokugawa that he had come to kill him. Tokugawa Ieyasu didn't believe him and so let John Adams live. Tokugawa was given a tour of their ship and he was fascinated with the objects on board. He didn't allow Adams to return home. So, John Adams became sad. Soon he fell in love with the daughter of a Samurai and so wanted to become a Samurai himself. So, he eventually became a Samurai and lived happily ever after. The End.

There were no Navajo speakers in Japan. The US checked before using them. But there was a weak link in the US system: embassies and the US mainland.

Thank you.