pupetting questions

[forezjohn]

Hello,
We're currently having a mp game with some friends and as germany i choosed not to take vichy france but puppet it completely,
the matter is that we can't puppet France althoug my allies and I have more than 66% of the country' VP.
What's wrong? should the 66% be held only by one country?
Did i Forgot something?

 

[unmerged(18164)]

Hello,
We're currently having a mp game with some friends and as germany i choosed not to take vichy france but puppet it completely,
the matter is that we can't puppet France althoug my allies and I have more than 66% of the country' VP.
What's wrong? should the 66% be held only by one country?
Did i Forgot something?

I may be wrong in answering your question, but you have to take the French owned province in South America and also French Indochina too...I think.
.
.
I always have a hard time puppeting France becasue of the global implications.

 

[unmerged(3221)]

The puppeting rules generally are:

1) 2/3 of the VP
2) having 2x their divisions.

How do you know that you have 2/3 of their VP? I counted 104 French VP with 39 being outside Europe so that's 0.663461538 or just under 2/3 of their VP. It looks like you need something outside of Europe to get to the 2/3 needed to puppet France.

Also puppeting is sometimes greyed out for inscrutable reasons. As Germany I got the Bitter Peace and then started to annex Scandanavia. Finland got some territories with the Bitter Peace despite being neutral. As I was trying to annex Finland I noticed that I could not puppet them despite deliberately destroying almost all their divisions. All they had left was Murmansk and I had 5x their divisions just within Finland at that point.

So there might be some specific exceptions to the general puppeting rules due to events.

 

[forezjohn]

I control all european territories of france I took Damascus(5vp), my japanese ally controls indochina.
and the italy was attacked so that the french controls tripoly with all its african territories(3vp)
I counted he had 22vp, the jap 15vp, And i about 60(all that for french territories, maybe the army size is a problem i'll look wether it's or not.
And by the way are the navy counted and air force counted and how?
global count, all units are should you have twice the army, twice the navy and twice the air force of your opponent?

 

[unmerged(32570)]

another question concerning vps

Hi there,

i read the texts and now I have a question on my own:

Concerning puppeting, do I have to control 2/3 of the locations containing victory points or di I have to control 2/3 of the value of all victory points a nation originally owned?

 

[javiermcabo]

Hi there,

i read the texts and now I have a question on my own:

Concerning puppeting, do I have to control 2/3 of the locations containing victory points or di I have to control 2/3 of the value of all victory points a nation originally owned?

oh man, this is going to kill me!!

 

[lenny]

IIRC, you also need to control the enemy's capital and the French capital moves to SA when Paris is threatened.

 

[forezjohn]

SA???
the capital didn't move when i was playing, i took paris as capital then the capital moved to other places but i think you have to take only the "official" capital...

 

[BarMonger]

SA???
the capital didn't move when i was playing, i took paris as capital then the capital moved to other places but i think you have to take only the "official" capital...

In some specific cases the capital is moved by event. In those cases you need to take the new capital as well in order to annex/puppet.

 

[forezjohn]

I know that but as I already said the capital didn't move by event or I would have seen it.
I'll have a quick look at the file tonight to confirm it

 

[Pro_Consul]

I know that but as I already said the capital didn't move by event or I would have seen it.
I'll have a quick look at the file tonight to confirm it

The French capital movement is by design, to prevent you from being able to puppet France ahistorically easily. It is meant to simulate the French government going into exile. Also there is no game message to tell you it happened. Just go check the province list after you get Paris, and check all the French VP provinces outside of Europe . One of them will now be the capital (I believe BarMonger is right and Frances moves theirs to SA). You need that province in order to puppet. The same applies, more or less, for the SU, Belgium and Netherlands. They all move their capitals out of the theater of their original capital whenever that province is lost or threatened. The Soviets move theirs back behind the Urals (IIRC), the Belgian capital moves to the islands in SE Asia, and the Netherlands capital moves to Africa. Like I said, though, after you take the original capital just hit F6, pull up the VP province list, sort by owner, and check all the provinces of the country you want to puppet. One of them is now the capital. And if someone else captures that capital, only THEY can puppet or annex that country, even if you control all the other VPs that country had.

 

[unmerged(3221)]

If you need the French capital to annex or puppet, and it has been moved by events which is unfortunately not listed in the game log, it's usually Cayenne in South American just north of Brazil. Cayenne, however, is not a VP province and it is not listed in the ledger pg 1 summary of VP provinces.

In 1.06 I have been seeing the French Capital move into French Algeria instead of moving to Colmar in the Maginot Line. It's been moving to a mountain province that is inland so that makes it difficult to quickly grab it.

I don't think that anyone can come up with a complete set of puppeting rules that universally apply. The general rules seem to be known but the specific rules seem to elude all of us. Us might even include the game developers.

 

[forezjohn]

Us might even include the game developers.

I hope not!
if they don't know how their own game work....

by the way thank you all for your responses