Well, I've been visiting Johan's home and have personally seen him use his Balor-account.
Is that evidence enough?
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Well, I've been visiting Johan's home and have personally seen him use his Balor-account.
Is that evidence enough?
Freedom of speech allows people to be less than polite. What else is there to say? Some people will not be kind in their remarks. Oh no.
The only uncivil posts I have seen have been mostly made by those who believe nothing is wrong with HOI 3 and that it works perfectly when they actively defend an obviously broken game.
I still ask the question: Why should I wait 2-3 years after the game and a couple of Expansions and patch's has been released before it works well enough to buy it, and how does doing that help PI make better games?
It seems to me that PI should make the release as bug free and workable as they can get it. Then the people who buy when it released are more apt to sway other people to buy it, and are more apt to buy the next game when released at the released price instead of waiting till it work and paying the developer less for it.
They did - it was just not as bug free and workable as the paying customers expect and deserve.
If Johan was indeed, very surprised, about how flawed HOI3 was upon release, that tells me how little he was involved in the development. The question is, who was responsible for this game being released in such an incomplete state? Please don't place the blame on playtesters. They got their directuion from somewhere.
AFAIK from the rumors in this forum, the people selected as beta testers either haven't tested the game from 1936-1948 or haven't reported issues as it would be their duty. They just used that game as an public preview or so. Other rumors say that they have returned problems indeed (as with the map issues) but they were reported too late as the deadline of the development was reached and the game had to get gold.
Nothing against public beta testing, but the beta app version that goes out needs a remote monitoring so that Paradox would have a clue how many test hours have indeed been played for different countries, on different systems, with a direct crash report inclusive. The test shouldn't end before a rational number of game hours have been spent and if that is not possible in time the test must be seen as failed. Just that is how I would do it as product manager. Customers accept a late release when it makes sense, rather than an early buggy one.
SF
Nothing against public beta testing, but the beta app version that goes out needs a remote monitoring so that Paradox would have a clue how many test hours have indeed been played for different countries, on different systems, with a direct crash report inclusive. The test shouldn't end before a rational number of game hours have been spent and if that is not possible in time the test must be seen as failed. Just that is how I would do it as product manager. Customers accept a late release when it makes sense, rather than an early buggy one.
SF
As someone who's friends with someone who was a professional game tester, let me say that every single issue raised by the community is raised by play testers, it's just a matter of how much the programmers care about eliminating things before release, as well as financial things etc.
Hate to break into your rant, but they've been offering refunds for a while now.
Just because you can do a thing, it does not necessarily follow that you must do that thing.
And some other people have the right to choose not to take them seriously. My point wasn't about what is allowed, but rather what is the best way to pass on the info you want to pass on...
There were loads of posts (now deleted by mods) that threatened legal action, physical violence and others being just internet nerd rage posts about the current state of the game.
The reason you thought that was probably because a bunch of people took their beta download and never made a single post on the forum
Really? I had no idea. What are the terms and conditions? Could someone post a link to some info?
Thanks. And apologies for my ignorance, Garak.
Please feel free to interrupt my rants anytime.
Really? I had no idea. What are the terms and conditions? Could someone post a link to some info?
Thanks. And apologies for my ignorance, Garak.
Please feel free to interrupt my rants anytime.
I choose to interrupt your rant by asking why you have the official scientific name of the common domesticated ferret in your signature...
...
only because I think Mustela Nivalis is cuter
.I know they are offering refunds, unfortunately, I'm not sure where the info is.
The game pre-1.3 was indeed broken. Post it is only flawed. I have just finished a complete game as Japan on hard and it was a real treat. Yes there were many flaws but I for one will not be requesting a refund.
I honestly say, ive enjoyed HoI3. Its not perfect, but i could deal with most of the issues, bar the megastacks and other flaws
But, most of the issues would have been cleared in beta testing. With a game of this scale, you dont get 30-40 beta testers, you get as many as you can, and you get them to try every country on the map if you can.
It would have made this game so close to perfect
But, most of the issues would have been cleared in beta testing. With a game of this scale, you dont get 30-40 beta testers, you get as many as you can, and you get them to try every country on the map if you can.
It would have made this game so close to perfect
I have owned HOI1, HOI2, and HOI3. I enjoyed them all, even with the bugs and related issues on playability.
That said, being an old dude (50+ years old), and having been playing war games since I was a teen (old SSI board games, etc) I still find HOI3 very playable. Some issues make me grumble, but not enough to say that I will not ever buy another PI game, bitch to everyone on the forums on how bad the game is, rant and rave, etc.
Several posts on this thread mentioned their playing time on the game. I have played hundreds of hours of the game, and find it very enjoyable. I like to micromanage the country I pick, and tinker back and forth until my military is unleashed on the unsuspecting neighbors. I am patient and have no problem waiting for the next update.
I wish patches came quicker, but am willing to wait until they come out to fix various bugs. I can honestly say that each time a patch comes out more problems are fixed, but come on everyone....they cannot possibly fix everything in a patch...I imagine a fix may create another bug that is not forseen, which then may get fixed in a later patch.
I truely hope Paradox continues to patch the game until it is a FANTASTIC game and not just a good one..I plan on playing many more hundreds of hours on it.......starting tonight when I get off of work!
Keep up the good work Paradox. And remember, "Don't let the bastards grind you down."
KLorberau
That said, being an old dude (50+ years old), and having been playing war games since I was a teen (old SSI board games, etc) I still find HOI3 very playable. Some issues make me grumble, but not enough to say that I will not ever buy another PI game, bitch to everyone on the forums on how bad the game is, rant and rave, etc.
Several posts on this thread mentioned their playing time on the game. I have played hundreds of hours of the game, and find it very enjoyable. I like to micromanage the country I pick, and tinker back and forth until my military is unleashed on the unsuspecting neighbors. I am patient and have no problem waiting for the next update.
I wish patches came quicker, but am willing to wait until they come out to fix various bugs. I can honestly say that each time a patch comes out more problems are fixed, but come on everyone....they cannot possibly fix everything in a patch...I imagine a fix may create another bug that is not forseen, which then may get fixed in a later patch.
I truely hope Paradox continues to patch the game until it is a FANTASTIC game and not just a good one..I plan on playing many more hundreds of hours on it.......starting tonight when I get off of work!
Keep up the good work Paradox. And remember, "Don't let the bastards grind you down."
KLorberau
I choose to interrupt your rant by asking why you have the official scientific name of the common domesticated ferret in your signature...
...
only because I think Mustela Nivalis is cuter
I know they are offering refunds, unfortunately, I'm not sure where the info is.
I suppose the short answer is because it also my "rank" under my name.
It comes from EUIII, and the development of Magna Mundi. I was called a "sheep" by one of the devs, because of my war-mongering play style. He felt that was the lowest common denominator strategy, the one used by simpletons: sheep. I responded that war mongers like treasure, and shiny things. Like the domesticated ferrets.
I have to say, I had a wide range of experiences working that closely on Magna Mundi, in terms of developers, modders, Paradox et al. Not saying that I'm wise. Perhaps just skewed.
The skewed ferret. Not a pretty title...
Incidentally, I don't mean to ruin anyone's enjoyment of this game. I really don't. If I just thought Paradox was a bunch of inept hacks, and I didn't think they were capable of great design, then I would never visit this forum, but I visit most days.
They are the game company for the hard-core war gamers. No one else comes close. I suppose my frustration is that I know if they don't get it right, there is no one else really trying.
I'd love to see some competition. Two hard-core wargaming companies. That's my ideal. Stealing ideas back and forth. Upping each other's game.
Well, it might reasonably be argued that a game such as EU3 or CK is never finished - there's always something more to tune.
As for CK, one can hardly say that it was 'abandoned', as the last patch for CK was released 15.10.2008 - almost 4 years after the game itself was released. It is still lacking in some respects (finding brides..) but at it's latest incarnation, I would say it's as close to being finished as a PI game can be. Try it someday, you might be surprised positively and at least you wont be wasting your time on an unfinished product
Very true. I spoke to more then one HOI3 beta tester after release and they all told me the problems were known and reported and that they were assured they would be fixed before release. Obviously that didn't happen.
It's been about five and a half months since release. Some things that were blatantly broken at release are still broken and I don't think it's unreasonable to wonder why. I also don't expect them to be fixed in 1.4. To be honest, I'm not sure they will ever be fixed, even if there is an expansion (though we are reaching the post-release timeframe that Johan said would be around the time they would consider it.)
In all likliehood HOI3 is a backburner project right now while they try and finish Victoria 2, a game that appears to have had little top management support. Presumably they are trying to do their best on that given the limited resources they've been allowed to dedicate to a potentially marginal offering. Hopefully the future of HOI3 will be considered once they've shipped Vic 2.
They may decide it has no future. We shall see.
Finally, I don't think the "value of the time played" argument is really relevant to the issue of whether the game needs to be improved or not. Anyone who is still around this long after release clearly sees at least some potential in HOI3 that they'd like to see fulfilled. When all is said and done, I still think this is the best game covering this period yet made. And those aspects they got right keep me coming back. But they also make me want the problems to be fixed, even if it's only to the point where the game is working as designed.
What really grinds my gears
, and im sure its the same for others, is that there is no way in hell that the testers and developers thought this game was ready for release. I was QA tester for some time so I remember how it all goes. Im aware that if the patching process is taking months with a large tester pool, if they had postponed the release of the game and done everything in house it might of taken longer and the company would incurred significantly increased. As ambitious as this game is I can forgive, but not forgot. As such, This is probably my last at release purchase of a Paradox title.- Status