PSA : If pretender rebels break a country, they break disasters

[Question]

Long story short, this is what happens when pretender rebels break a country :

-They automatically end all disasters

-All active rebel factions then have their demands enforced, BUT the enforce demands code checks if a particular disaster is active.

-Since the disaster was ended before their demands are enforced, they see that no disaster is active, and the disaster-specific demands are not enforced.

For example, the way court and country works is that when you lose to noble or particularist rebels with the disaster active, it will set a country flag. So when the end event fires, it then gives you either a good or bad ending depending on whether you have that flag.

So in the case of court and country, pretender rebels break the country, end the disaster, the end event fires, sees that you do not have the country flag indicating you lost to the rebels, assumes you beat the rebels, and gives you the "good" ending to the disaster.

I setup a test case for this using no mods other than a UI mod. Here, we have Spain with the court and country disaster active :

After the monthly tick, the pretender rebels break the country (obviously) which instantly ends the disaster.

Except that the disaster is ended before the code for particularists to enforce demands is executed, so the game assumes you have beaten the rebels and gives you the good ending to the disaster.

Also attached is a save file if anyone wants to see this in action.

I don't know why pretender rebels automatically end all disasters. I can't see any code for them to do this. It might be yet another hardcoded thing Paradox did.

 

[grotaclas]

How can you break to pretender rebels in particular? Don't you just break to all rebels when 50% of your country is occupied?

Did you try this in a situation where no particularist nor noble rebels are active in the country? Your screenshot shows particularist rebels and when these enforce their demands they end the court and country disaster. Maybe that is the reason why it ended in your example.

 

[Question]

No, the particularist rebels arent ending the disaster, its ended instantly by the pretender rebels breaking the country. You can test this yourself by doing this :

if = {
            limit = {
                has_disaster = court_and_country
            }
            custom_tooltip = bad_ending_court_and_country_tooltip
            set_country_flag = court_and_country_surrendered_to_rebels
            #hidden_effect = { country_event = { id = court_and_country_events.100 } }
            #end_disaster = court_and_country
        }

So when the particularists enforce their demands, they wont end the disaster. Its caused by the pretender rebels somehow.

The point is not whether particularist/noble rebels are active. Its that when pretender rebels break the country, they automatically end the disaster. When i say pretender rebels, i mean that they are active as a faction so their demands get enforced.

I assume theres something specific about their demands that is causing this, but i dont see any code in their demands to end all disasters specifically.

If you only have particularist or noble rebels active and they enforce their demands, it works. They dont auto end the disaster, its ended by code executed in the enforce demands block.

The OP has a save if you want to do more testing with the console or execute commands via a run file.

 

[AFKaiser]

Also happens with peasant rebels and the Ming Dynasty Crisis disaster. Quite confusing when they end the disaster while remaining emperor of china but with 0 mandate. I guess it's caused by this bug.

 

[atwix]

any collapse of nations ends any disaster active AFAIK.

I don't get what you are trying to get at @Question

 

[AFKaiser]

any collapse of nations ends any disaster active AFAIK.

I don't get what you are trying to get at @Question

If rebels enforce the demands, you should get the bad outcome of the disaster, or at least not end it

 

[atwix]

If rebels enforce the demands, you should get the bad outcome of the disaster, or at least not end it

unless you want to find out what exactly triggers multiple rebels enforcing demands at same time.,,

I think I had zealots and peasants enforce at same time once, it might need % amount of land, development or provinces occupied when enforcing.

the OP test setup might have had spain with 60 absolutism, giving him the 10+ bonus.

 

[Question]

Tried doing more testing to see if theres a workaround...i dont think its specific to pretender rebels exactly, but its hard to tell because sometimes i get inconsistent results. I was able to get peasant rebels to auto end court and country as well. Might be an issue with the "break country" mechanic.

 

[Question]

unless you want to find out what exactly triggers multiple rebels enforcing demands at same time.,,

I think I had zealots and peasants enforce at same time once, it might need % amount of land, development or provinces occupied when enforcing.

the OP test setup might have had spain with 60 absolutism, giving him the 10+ bonus.

The point is that if rebels enforce demands, a country flag is supposed to be set so that the game knows you lost to the rebels. That never happens because :

if = {
            limit = {
                has_disaster = court_and_country
            }
            custom_tooltip = bad_ending_court_and_country_tooltip
            set_country_flag = court_and_country_surrendered_to_rebels
            hidden_effect = { country_event = { id = court_and_country_events.100 } }
            end_disaster = court_and_country
        }

The code is only executed if you have the disaster active. The disaster ends before it is executed, so by the time the game gets around to executing the code, it sees no disaster active, concludes you have beaten the rebels, and gives you the good ending.

 

[atwix]

The point is that if rebels enforce demands, a country flag is supposed to be set so that the game knows you lost to the rebels. That never happens because :

if = {
            limit = {
                has_disaster = court_and_country
            }
            custom_tooltip = bad_ending_court_and_country_tooltip
            set_country_flag = court_and_country_surrendered_to_rebels
            hidden_effect = { country_event = { id = court_and_country_events.100 } }
            end_disaster = court_and_country
        }

The code is only executed if you have the disaster active. The disaster ends before it is executed, so by the time the game gets around to executing the code, it sees no disaster active, concludes you have beaten the rebels, and gives you the good ending.

fair enough, but this has been a tactic to collapse to zealots/pretenders during disasters to end them since they installed the mechanic. Its clearly an oversight that smart players might abuse this to end disasters and get rid of -3 stab and 20 war exhaustion after a costly independence war as OPM..

you have a point that it is abusable and that the mechanic on how enforcing different rebel types needs X amounts of parameters.. But its not gonna get changed, if you think about it realistically. They have other stuff to worry about. Its been there since long time, and likely got weird since the patch they introduced disasters.

Its nice to see the mechanics behind it, if you really want to delve into it further though.

 

[Question]

Ending all disasters by itself isnt the problem. Its that the code to enforce rebel demands does not fire properly when it happens.

Again, this is because the disaster is ended before the rebels can enforce demands.