• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

starchitect

Gestalt Consciousness
60 Badges
Sep 6, 2016
352
494
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Surviving Mars: Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
I quite like the new control mechanic in CK3, and I think Imperator actually has the potential to make a lot more use of it. The goal is to get full output out of provinces with high control, likely those close to your capital, with high loyalty, or good infrastructure. Control would effect pop output and province warscore cost, so disloyal borderlands would be easy to occupy and take in war, while central home provinces would not. It would integrate both into economy and warfare, and to some extent would be an anti-blobbing mechanic.

How it would work:
Every Province has a control value, from 0 to 100. No modifiers at 100, at 0: -100% pop output, -100% Province Warscore cost

Control is a trending value based on the following:
  • Distance from Capital, modified by roads, ports, and terrain
  • Loyalty of the Province
  • Loyalty and Charisma of the Governor
  • Province investments such as Courthouses or Military Procurators
  • Whether or not a Province is Occupied
  • Difference between current value and Equilibrium (Like EU4 Estate Loyalty)
Generally, land in your capital region will be at or near 100 control and behave as is now. However, in far flung regions of Empires, control may become a problem. While at peace, no province should be able to trend completely to 0, but a distant, disloyal province with a babbling buffoon of a Governor might have an equilibrium value of say 10-15: making the province both nearly useless to you, and easy picking for an expansionist neighbor, since they can snap up vast swaths of land you have little control over cheaply.

To make control become even more interesting at war, make settlements instantly defect if they reach 0 control while occupied, and border land you own. Occupation would add a ticking control modifier, but something rather small say -0.2/month. This means that a territory with 12 control before a war would instantly flip if occupied for 5 years. Even if it does not flip instantly, the longer you occupy it the cheaper the land will be to take, and even if it is not conquered a long occupation will have a lasting impact on land, as it will reduce pop output until it trends back to whatever equilibrium it was at before occupation (a double edged sword, as if you reduce control in land and then take it over, it will take a long time to be worth anything to you as well). With the modifier for difference from current value and equilibrium, land with good to decent control will never reach 0 from occupation (easy example numbers here, say for each point away from equilibrium control is, gain +0.01 a month, then, with the example of -0.2 a month from occupation, a province with a control equilibrium above 20 could never reach 0 while occupied).

This would dramatically change warfare, as it gives an incentive to the attacker to accept peace quickly so they do not completely destroy the control in the land they occupy, and to the defender since the amount of land an attacker can take at once goes up the longer they stay in a losing fight. The balance here would be tricky, as you do not want to encourage attackers to just full occupy and sit on land for cheaper warscore cost, but perhaps with a full surrender/call for peace option, along with harsher war exhaustion (things I think the game needs anyway), you could find a balance point. It would allow for border wars between big empires to allow for vast swaths of land to transfer, but make gamey things like snaking in to take the capital and most valuable land more difficult. (likely since control would reduce warscore cost in most land, base warscore cost should increase to balance this). Distance from capital would have a big effect on both wars and your economy.
 
Last edited:
  • 20Like
  • 1Love
  • 1
Reactions:
Jan 4, 2020
1.900
3.663
Not a bad proposal per se, but if you make controling distant areas harder, warscore should be removed completely, NOT increased further (as you want. This control mechanic would be a better anti-blob system than warscore.
 
  • 6
  • 1Like
Reactions:

starchitect

Gestalt Consciousness
60 Badges
Sep 6, 2016
352
494
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Surviving Mars: Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
Not a bad proposal per se, but if you make controling distant areas harder, warscore should be removed completely, NOT increased further (as you want. This control mechanic would be a better anti-blob system than warscore.

I am saying that warscore cost to take a province with low control is reduced by the control percentage. So low control means that province only is cheap to take for your opponents. That part really isnt anti blob. It means that It will be easier for Thrace to take the distant bits of Western Anatolia from the Antigonids than it would for Seleucus to take the heartland in Syria. Or easier for Rome to take parts of Iberia from Carthage than to take Carthage itself.
 
  • 1Like
  • 1
Reactions:

Rabid

Field Marshal
40 Badges
Jan 4, 2008
4.047
3.417
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis: Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Victoria 3 Sign Up
  • BATTLETECH
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • BATTLETECH: Flashpoint
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris Sign-up
  • Stellaris
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • 500k Club
  • Victoria 2
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV
I haven't played CK3 but this sounds very much like EU4's local autonomy.

Why do you feel the need for this to tick down over time? It should be a fixed value based on logical geographical, logistical and political circumstances as per your list of modifiers. I found the gradual decrease in autonomy in EU4 to be rather frustrating and silly, and the one upside, of making occupations in war more punishing, isn't something which Imperator particularly needs.
 
  • 2
Reactions:

starchitect

Gestalt Consciousness
60 Badges
Sep 6, 2016
352
494
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Cities: Skylines - After Dark
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Stellaris: Lithoids
  • Surviving Mars
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Surviving Mars: Digital Deluxe Edition
  • Cities: Skylines - Parklife
  • Stellaris: Distant Stars
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Stellaris: Megacorp
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Stellaris: Ancient Relics
  • Surviving Mars: First Colony Edition
  • Imperator: Rome Sign Up
  • Crusader Kings III
  • Stellaris: Nemesis
  • Europa Universalis 4: Emperor
  • Imperator: Rome - Magna Graecia
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Stellaris: Federations
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
I haven't played CK3 but this sounds very much like EU4's local autonomy.

Why do you feel the need for this to tick down over time? It should be a fixed value based on logical geographical, logistical and political circumstances as per your list of modifiers. I found the gradual decrease in autonomy in EU4 to be rather frustrating and silly, and the one upside, of making occupations in war more punishing, isn't something which Imperator particularly needs.

I agree. Might not have been entirely clear, but I think control should reach a fixed value- which is what I was calling the equilibrium value. However, certain things, like occupation or possibly events could modify it temporarily. But absolutely, you should not be able to reach 100% control really anywhere besides the capitol. The ticking down example listed was only for a territory under occupation.
 
  • 2Like
  • 2
Reactions: