Proposed changes in Silesia

[Aramenian]

Proposed changes on the map

The changes consist in a better presentation of Silesia in 1444
1;Duchy of Zagan
-Capital of Zagan
Flag

Ruler Jan II the Mad:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_II_the_Mad
information about the duchy:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duchy_of_Żagań

2;Duchy of Glogow
-Capital of Glogow
Flag

Ruler Henry IX the Elder;https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henryk_IX_Starszy
information about the duchy:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duchy_of_Głogów

3;Duchy of Legnica
-Capital of Legnica
Flag

Ruler of Elisabeth of Hohenzollern:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elisabeth_of_Brandenburg,_Duchess_of_Brzeg-Legnica_and_Cieszyn
information about the duchy:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duchy_of_Legnica

4:Wroclaw
In 1335, after the death of Henryk VI Dobre, after 350 years of reign in Wrocław, Polish princes and kings, the city passed under the rule of Czech kings.
-Wroclaw, property of the Kingdom of Bohemia
There should also be the possibility of freeing the Duchy of Wroclaw
-Capital of Wroclaw
Flag

The coat of arms of the Piast dynasty of Oleśnica until 1492 was identical to the coat of arms of the Duchy of Wroclaw and depicted in the golden field of the black eagle's shield, beak and red claws, with a silver crescent-shaped patch with a silver cross on the inner arch of the patchwork. There are also versions of an eagle without a cross on a loincloth.
The coat of arms of the Oleśnica Piast dynasty (and Wrocław) was the basis for the later German coat of arms of Lower Silesia.


5:Swidnica
In 1392 after Agnieszka's death - a widow of Bolko II - under the treaty of 1353 Swidnica passed into the hands of the Czech kings
-Swidnica, property of the Kingdom of Bohemia
There should also be the possibility of releasing the Duchy of Swidnica
-Capital of Swidnica
Flag



6;Duchy of Opole
-Capital of Opole
Flag

Ruler: Nicholas I of Opole :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_I_of_Opole
information about the duchy:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duchy_of_Opole

7;Duchy of Raciborz
-Capital of Raciborz
Flag

Ruler: Wenceslaus II: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wenceslaus_II,_Duke_of_Opava-Ratibor
information about the duchy:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duchy_of_Racibórz
The ruler of Wenceslaus II, comes from the Přemyslid dynasty, which gives us the opportunity to restore Přemyslid to the throne of the Kingdom of Bohemia. It could be connected with the mission tree for Raciborz consisting in regaining the throne of the Kingdom of Bohemia.

Information about Přemyslid dynasty:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Přemyslid_dynasty

Silesian nobility, aristocracy, piasts and dynasties;http://www.arekkp.pl/en_dynastie.html#Hohenzollern

 

[Rhipeen]

this might be slightly off theme, but I have my own suggestion going on concerning bohemia (Pardubice for historical reasons shouldnt even be in the game and they butchered hradec) but I have Silesia in it too so I am putting it here, any opinions on it?

 

[Hawkslime]

I really like this suggestion. It inspired me to do some of my own reading on the topic (and trust me, it's very complex). One change I'd make is have Raciborz be owned by Bohemia, since it was inherited by the crown in 1336, then was inherited by the duke of Opole in 1521, until 1532. This may allow Zagan to be a vassal, especially if Bohemia were to get +1 relationship slot to compensate.

May also be worth giving them a modifier that means they don't get any HRE opinion malus/ diplo rep hit when annexing silesian vassals to represent the inheritance agreement

IMHO they were still autonomous enough to be represented as a vassal

 

[Hawkslime]

this might be slightly off theme, but I have my own suggestion going on concerning bohemia (Pardubice for historical reasons shouldnt even be in the game and they butchered hradec) but I have Silesia in it too so I am putting it here, any opinions on it?View attachment 495568

Why are there so many new provinces in Silesia?

 

[Rhipeen]

Why are there so many new provinces in Silesia?

The same question can be asked about lowlands, historicaly Silesia was dividied amongst many local dukes with varrying amounts of autonomy unlike Bohemia which was under direct control and Moravia which was too but under appointed person looking after it, but still under direct control where revoke could happen any time, so ideas about PUs are kinda farcetched
today the area what was historical Silesia has 8 milion inhabitans which is almost as much as Bohemia+Moravia itself today (10,5 milions) , so having B+M having 11 provinces and Silesia 5 is kinda meh not to mention less accurate
(side note to lowlands, they still keep dividing it with arguments of type like "it was a lot more populated" and "it was diferent administrative unit" etc dividing lowlands to infinity but at the same time they keep grouping up multiple different administrative units elsewhere with argument "its too small to divide"... why dont they use this argument for lowlands I wonder, lowlands have the smallest provinces in game and yet another province addition will happen there...)

 

[Hero Of Olympus]

Well looks like you've got atleast some changes Look at dev diary.

 

[Em Ay Ef]

Well looks like you've got atleast some changes Look at dev diary.

what changes do you mean? a glance at the diary didn't show anything that wasn't in the previous diary about map changes in Germany. i'm starting to worry i'm going blind.

 

[Mr.Grizzly]

Well looks like you've got atleast some changes Look at dev diary.

Maybe you should revisit the German map DD, Silesia is shown to be split between two tags, one in the north and one in the south. Looks the same in the latest DD.

 

[Rhipeen]

Maybe you should revisit the German map DD, Silesia is shown to be split between two tags, one in the north and one in the south. Looks the same in the latest DD.

I mean, that was already in dev diary around few weeks ago

 

[Mr.Grizzly]

I mean, that was already in dev diary around few weeks ago

I was telling the guy that nothing new has changed since the first DD on map changes for Silesia

 

[Rhipeen]

I was telling the guy that nothing new has changed since the first DD on map changes for Silesia

Oh, I forgot to properly read whole messages again........... should I just commit sudoku? welp this is the second time it has happened to me with you so sorry again

 

[Mr.Grizzly]

Oh, I forgot to properly read whole messages again........... should I just commit sudoku? welp this is the second time it has happened to me with you so sorry again

All good, we all have our idiot moments

 

[Hawkslime]

The same question can be asked about lowlands, historicaly Silesia was dividied amongst many local dukes with varrying amounts of autonomy unlike Bohemia which was under direct control and Moravia which was too but under appointed person looking after it, but still under direct control where revoke could happen any time, so ideas about PUs are kinda farcetched
today the area what was historical Silesia has 8 milion inhabitans which is almost as much as Bohemia+Moravia itself today (10,5 milions) , so having B+M having 11 provinces and Silesia 5 is kinda meh not to mention less accurate
(side note to lowlands, they still keep dividing it with arguments of type like "it was a lot more populated" and "it was diferent administrative unit" etc dividing lowlands to infinity but at the same time they keep grouping up multiple different administrative units elsewhere with argument "its too small to divide"... why dont they use this argument for lowlands I wonder, lowlands have the smallest provinces in game and yet another province addition will happen there...)

Interesting. Not to say I don´t agree, but I do see 2-3 major problem:

1) How would you balance the bohemian vassal swarm? Unless the France system works for all vassals (which I doubt, I am pretty sure we will just get a France-specific solution).

2) I feel like the Netherlands are a solution to the rule. We can´t expect such a province density elsewhere, and Silesia can´t expect a similar province density to Netherlands simply because it didn´t have such a population density and wasn´t as prosperous.

And finally, I like it, but for the developers it is wayyy too much. They have added 4 provinces to whole Bohemian crown lands. It isn´t a problem if you just ask if we like the map, but if you proposed it to the developers, they would deem it too ambitious.

Lastly, I want to apologise for just asking "Why so many provinces in Silesia" instead of properly bringing up my points. I guess that would save you some time.

 

[BalticM]

2) I feel like the Netherlands are a solution to the rule. We can´t expect such a province density elsewhere, and Silesia can´t expect a similar province density to Netherlands simply because it didn´t have such a population density and wasn´t as prosperous.

After European patch Germany will have same (actually a bit higher) province density than Netherlands.
Silesia is kind of Germany / HRE in 15-19th centuries. Not Poland.
Silesia had same or slightly higher population densities than Netherlands. But sure was less prosperous.
But Silesia had higher population density and was richer than average Germany.
Compared to average German province, Silesia should have like 10 provinces. Splitting it to at least 7-8 provinces cannot be too much by any criteria.

 

[Hawkslime]

After European patch Germany will have same (actually a bit higher) province density than Netherlands.
Silesia is kind of Germany / HRE in 15-19th centuries. Not Poland.
Silesia had same or slightly higher population densities than Netherlands. But sure was less prosperous.
But Silesia had higher population density and was richer than average Germany.
Compared to average German province, Silesia should have like 10 provinces. Splitting it to at least 7-8 provinces cannot be too much by any criteria.

Yeah, but how do you balance vassal swarms? That is the biggest brake. I do expect France´s vassal-balancing system to be region-specific. It probably won´t work in Silesia.

By the way, I double checked and you were actually right. Silesia actually had similar pop density as the Low countries, at least as of 1500. Interesting.

 

[Mr.Grizzly]

Yeah, but how do you balance vassal swarms? That is the biggest brake. I do expect France´s vassal-balancing system to be region-specific. It probably won´t work in Silesia.

By the way, I double checked and you were actually right. Silesia actually had similar pop density as the Low countries, at least as of 1500. Interesting.

My solution would be to give Silesia it's proper province representation of eight provinces and keep Bohemia with two , maybe three, vassals. The two that were most important during the early game is what I'd prefer seeing as subjects, though one in Upper Silesia and the other in Lower Silesia could work too. The provinces that are controlled by Bohemia at start should have the cores of the duchies that couldn't be added at game start due to balancing reasons so they can still be represented.