Proposal(s) for Victoria 3

[Gurkhal]

I defiantly agree that adding in building, art patronage and other aspects would improve the gameplay of a Victoria sequel, as I also see it as being a great way to play tall for small counties, like Belgium and the Netherlands, alongside more peaceful games as you suggested. I also seem to have mis-understood some of what you were suggesting, as my interpretation of using granduer for projects like art patronage was that it would be consumed like a currency. Sorry about that.

Your suggestion of attracting a certain group of immigrants seems like a good idea, would some new pop types or even just representation of prominent individuals in game contribute to this idea (i.e. these groups or individuals would want to emigrate to your nation, giving bonuses to prestige from artists, research from scientists, etc)?

- to the first part.

To the second part I don't think that it would be necessary to have new POPs, the POP system does risk of getting bloated if expanded to much, but I think that representation of prominent individuals would be a nice reflection to how the world develops in different games.

 

[Avian Overlord]

I have some thoughts on what might work to make the economic model work better and handle the difference between state run and free market economics better than "no involvement" vs "micromanaging everything":

• The Firm. Firms are the units that build factories, rgo expansions and (sometimes) railroads. All countries use the firm system, but firms can be private, nationalized, or some mix thereof.
• Firms own these directly, and have one account where costs come out of and profits are deposited to shareholders.
  
• Firms will "propose" various factory expansions/constructions, then try to raise funding for the proposal. The government (i.e. the player) can step in with a loan or even a subsidy to cover the costs, otherwise the firm will have to rely on private loans, the money of capitalist pops, or its own savings to pay for construction.
• State owned firms will deposit all profits in the national treasury rather than shareholders. Should also employ bureaucrats rather than capitalists. Perhaps should depend on laws.
• Firms have acquire each other and will compete. How to handle monopolies should be a big political question, perhaps pushing a move towards radical liberalism (trust busting) or socialism (nationalization).

Thoughts?

 

[deannnkid]

I have some thoughts on what might work to make the economic model work better and handle the difference between state run and free market economics better than "no involvement" vs "micromanaging everything":

• The Firm. Firms are the units that build factories, rgo expansions and (sometimes) railroads. All countries use the firm system, but firms can be private, nationalized, or some mix thereof.
• Firms own these directly, and have one account where costs come out of and profits are deposited to shareholders.
  
• Firms will "propose" various factory expansions/constructions, then try to raise funding for the proposal. The government (i.e. the player) can step in with a loan or even a subsidy to cover the costs, otherwise the firm will have to rely on private loans, the money of capitalist pops, or its own savings to pay for construction.
• State owned firms will deposit all profits in the national treasury rather than shareholders. Should also employ bureaucrats rather than capitalists. Perhaps should depend on laws.
• Firms have acquire each other and will compete. How to handle monopolies should be a big political question, perhaps pushing a move towards radical liberalism (trust busting) or socialism (nationalization).

Thoughts?

Well trust busting would be more social democratic not liberal. Liberals would definitely not support trust busting since liberalism (especially the 19th century liberalism) would not support very much intervention into the free market.

 

[Avian Overlord]

Well trust busting would be more social democratic not liberal. Liberals would definitely not support trust busting since liberalism (especially the 19th century liberalism) would not support very much intervention into the free market.

I suppose I should mention that I'm also in favor of cutting anarcho-liberal and replacing it with radical liberalism, which is more left wing than the classical liberals. As for trust busting being liberal, well, the United States was notable for doing it in this time period, and the 19th century US is not exactly known for social democracy, to say the least.

 

[fr-rein]

I have one small request.

Please make Victoria 3 follow British English. It is a minor request, but it is quite crucial for the atmosphere to see around the language closer to the last century rather than contemporary American.

Please have British English.

 

[Kovax]

Please have British English.

I'm American, and I still have to agree with that. Victoria wasn't an American.

 

[deanwebb]

I suppose I should mention that I'm also in favor of cutting anarcho-liberal and replacing it with radical liberalism, which is more left wing than the classical liberals. As for trust busting being liberal, well, the United States was notable for doing it in this time period, and the 19th century US is not exactly known for social democracy, to say the least.

"Trust busting" in the USA led to the formation of oligarchical business structures, where power is shared between the few instead of held by the one. Also late 19th/Early 20th Century US time is known as "The Progressive Era", when the Socialist Party was actually a thing.

I have one small request.

Please make Victoria 3 follow British English. It is a minor request, but it is quite crucial for the atmosphere to see around the language closer to the last century rather than contemporary American.

Please have British English.

Have it be the form of English for the nation with the highest industry score.

 

[Luckierexpert]

An idea I've had is to switch the army production system to that of HOI4 or a similar system (i.e. you need the equipment to build the unit before you can produce it), which if it is coupled with limits on the global market could solve some of the issues late game or with nations like China Westernising by limiting the import of arms, which could prevent nations becoming black holes for guns and artillery.

 

[Ruck]

The German Kaiserreich should have a special government form called "Bismarcks Kaiserreich" where every action you wanna do needs approval from Mr. Bismarck.
You want to make war with Belgium ? Bismarcks says no, we have no acceptable war goal.
You want to build more Navy Ships ? Bismarcks says no, that would not please our British friends.
You want to make an alliance with the Osmanic Empire ? Bismarck says no, that would make our Dreibund friends in Austria and Russia angry, we need to balance the power in Europe.

But as long as Bismarck is the Reichskanzler everyone beside France loves you and is a big friend of the Kaisereich. You can even invite all your friends to Berlin and make a Congo Conference Sleepover Pajama Party with lots of surprises in Africa afterwards.

 

[demanvanwezel]

The German Kaiserreich should have a special government form called "Bismarcks Kaiserreich" where every action you wanna do needs approval from Mr. Bismarck.
You want to make war with Belgium ? Bismarcks says no, we have no acceptable war goal.
You want to build more Navy Ships ? Bismarcks says no, that would not please our British friends.
You want to make an alliance with the Osmanic Empire ? Bismarck says no, that would make our Dreibund friends in Austria and Russia angry, we need to balance the power in Europe.

But as long as Bismarck is the Reichskanzler everyone beside France loves you and is a big friend of the Kaisereich. You can even invite all your friends to Berlin and make a Congo Conference Sleepover Pajma Party with lots of surprises in Africa afterwards.

I know you're joking but you actually make a good point

1) have personalities for government leaders, the less democratic you are the better the bonusses but more sever the malusses
2) have a balance of power mechanic and have fleets factor into that

 

[Kovax]

You can even invite all your friends to Berlin and make a Congo Conference Sleepover Pajama Party with lots of surprises in Africa afterwards.

Which reminds me, in my current campaign Belgium doesn't exist. I'm wondering what will happen with the Congo event, or if it will happen at all.

Personalities might be interesting if done right, or an absolutely horrible thing if done wrong. After the last couple of Paradox releases, I'm a bit concerned that it may not end up as a positive change.

 

[Ruck]

Which reminds me, in my current campaign Belgium doesn't exist. I'm wondering what will happen with the Congo event, or if it will happen at all.

Personalities might be interesting if done right, or an absolutely horrible thing if done wrong. After the last couple of Paradox releases, I'm a bit concerned that it may not end up as a positive change.

I think The Congo Conference event doesnt need Belgium, but only that the Congo region is uncolonized until some time (1880 or so).

 

[Kovax]

I've had the Congo Conference fire in other campaigns long after all of the Congo area was colonized by other countries, and Belgium still got it. I haven't seen it in this game, without Belgium, which is now in the mid 1990s.

 

[Gurkhal]

Anyway, to return to the issue of suggestions for a possible Victoria III.

One idea I once saw was in a different place in this forum was the use of the illness mechanics in Crusader Kings II to simulate the spread of certain ideas and moods. In that case it was the spread of jingoism which was suggested could flare up and grow strong in a short space of time before dying back after a while. And this concept could perhap be used for Victoria III?

Hence my suggestion is that instead of things just popping up maybe we can have a map view for ideas in how different intellectual stuff spread across the world and sweeps nations, or part of them, up with it. And the better infrastrucutre and communications between the provinces, the faster this would spread. This would simulate things like the 1848 revolutions, the sweep of nationalism, the Russian Revolutions and the many revolutions and attempted revolutions it inspired.

To take an example: Say that you have an epicenter for a Communist revolutuion in province X, then out from province X provinces will start to be affected by Communist revolutionary sentiments and to gain modifiers and such. And then this quickly spreads out across the railroads and the provinces close to them but its a slow going in the railroadless rural provinces just a province or two away from the epicenter.

EDITED

And one more thing.

In order to actually get a civil war in America, I propose that the CSA would get a event where they can effectively steal a massive ammount of military hardware from the American army and get a mass of defections of generals, and perhaps also officer corps, so that they can actually put a real army in the field and fight a war with the USA.

 

[deanwebb]

Regarding idea spread - things can be slowed down in nations like Austria, which was famous for its secret police that opened everyone's mail.
But they speed up after developments in newspapers, telephony/telegraphy, and radio.

 

[deanwebb]

Regarding the CSA (and the Taiping): these nations need to be able to appear with max. troops possible OR have enough of a truce to where they can build those forces in time for the end of the truce.

 

[Avian Overlord]

I'd say borrowing HoI4's civil war code would be sufficient.

 

[deanwebb]

I'd say borrowing HoI4's civil war code would be sufficient.

I agree. That makes for a formidable opponent, right away. Even though the CSA did not start shooting at the USA on day one of secession, the event can simply read, "The time for negotiation and discussion has ended. Take up arms and fight for your three-letter national acronym, as appropriate!"

 

[Avian Overlord]

I suppose it depends on if the tag break should happen at the onset of hostilities, or the beginning of the secession crisis. I'd be inclined to say the former, with pol-mil stuff happening before and after the outbreak of hostility. Things like Missouri being neutral until the Confederates invaded, etc.

 

[demanvanwezel]

the problem with the current set-up of civil wars is that it's cheesable or plain handicaps ai players

for example as the US you can recruit nothing but yankee troops (or nothing but dixie troops if you're going CSA) and at the start you'll have an army while the other side has to recruit them from scratch
or your soldiers start divided amidst the (now) enemies troops and are inmediatly killed (this is why hungary often doesn't have an army in 1848)