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Honestly, I think the desert penalty should apply. The Almoravids and the Almohads based themselves out of the Sous valley, which has been one of Morocco's most fertile areas since time immemorial. It's not like the Sous valley is as inhospitable as the Ahaggar. Ideally, each dynasty should generate with event troops associated with a high decadence and an event chain from the lead up to their takeover, which were always over perceived slights in interpretation of Orthodoxy. Although, I'd imagine that last bit is a VIET kinda thing.
It's not as if them conquering stuff outside the Sahara was ever an issue before I applied the penalty, so the supply limit and tax penalty should be plenty to keep them in check. There's very few holdings in the Sahara, so that alone reduces their levies by a lot, and the holdings nearly only being cities reduces it further.
 
Honestly, I think the desert penalty should apply. The Almoravids and the Almohads based themselves out of the Sous valley, which has been one of Morocco's most fertile areas since time immemorial. It's not like the Sous valley is as inhospitable as the Ahaggar. Ideally, each dynasty should generate with event troops associated with a high decadence and an event chain from the lead up to their takeover, which were always over perceived slights in interpretation of Orthodoxy. Although, I'd imagine that last bit is a VIET kinda thing.
Well, they based their power there but (the Almoravids) after they conquered it from the desert.
The idea of event troops and high decadence for every decadence looks nice, but speaking about desert nomads it is in bright contrast to the concept of decadence (by Ibn Khaldun) which was that the desert tribes actually don't suffer decadence until they move their powerbase and capital to sedentary areas.

Ibn Khaldun's concept of decadence was that sedentary dynasties suffer decadence as opposed to nomadic desert dynasties/tribes who are immune to decadence as long as they stay in the desert. According to Ibn Khaldun normal dynasty declines and after 4 generations it usualy collapses. CK2 concept was a tool to do this, but it still lacks balance. The dynasty, which suffers high decadence is attacked by hordes from the desert with event troops. But as the game was being tweaked, the decadence became too easy to be lowered and therefore it doesn't work at all.
The concept is broken and I think that it should just be this way:
The desert tribes should be immune to conquest from Egypt, Syria or Maghreb etc., they should be relatively weak (economicaly), but strong enough militarily that when the decadence of their sedentary neighbours (Egypt, Maghreb) rises, they should be able to conquer it.

It's not as if them conquering stuff outside the Sahara was ever an issue before I applied the penalty, so the supply limit and tax penalty should be plenty to keep them in check. There's very few holdings in the Sahara, so that alone reduces their levies by a lot, and the holdings nearly only being cities reduces it further.
Sahara is weak, but I actually did some additional research and have found and added few more settlements (circa 20 settlements for all those Saharan provinces, so nothing very balance breaking), because I really think the desert deserves to be martialy stronger.
 
CK2 concept was a tool to do this, but it still lacks balance. The dynasty, which suffers high decadence is attacked by hordes from the desert with event troops. But as the game was being tweaked, the decadence became too easy to be lowered and therefore it doesn't work at all.

So PB has a mechanism for simulating the rise of the Almohads and Almoravids? That's good. Or is it in the base game? I don't really know because I mod 99% of the time instead of playing it.

The concept is broken and I think that it should just be this way:
The desert tribes should be immune to conquest from Egypt, Syria or Maghreb etc.,

I agree with this. Most historians and all the books I have on them basically state that, unless the ruling power was a Berber dynasty, the ruling powers only ever controlled the fringes of the settled territory. The mountain and desert tribes were almost completely isolated from outside control. Only the Almohads ever completely controlled them, and even then it was fleeting.

they should be relatively weak (economicaly), but strong enough militarily that when the decadence of their sedentary neighbours (Egypt, Maghreb) rises, they should be able to conquer it.

That's actually the point I was attempting to make, so we're still in agreement.

I've always liked the idea of an orthodoxy movement coming into play to simulate the Almohads/Almoravids. They are one of my favorite areas of history to study.
 
i found a courtier with the immortal trait and i don't think he should have it. ck2_1.png

also all the retinues are available for some reason. and please do something about the calling your entire realm in a rebellion agents you thing.
 
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Did you opt into the 2.02 beta? I noticed all the retinues started showing up as well when I did that, though I may have updated PB at the same time; so I'm not sure if it's related to conflicts with the beta or an independent problem with 3.3.5
 
i found a courtier with the immortal trait and i don't think he should have it.View attachment 96428

also all the retinues are available for some reason. and please do something about the calling your entire realm in a rebellion agents you thing.

Along the same lines, I found a courtier named "Project Balance" ID:9999999 (give or take a few 9s), age 1066 at the shaterred world start.
 
Along the same lines, I found a courtier named "Project Balance" ID:9999999 (give or take a few 9s), age 1066 at the shaterred world start.
Haha, you found the startup event "maintenance man." Well, he was born shortly after Christ's death, and this seemingly inconsequential courtier (who is technically lowborn but could very well be called the founder of many a branch of the Balanse dynasty) is the vessel through which the PB mod and sub-mod game setup/startup events all fire. You may say that he was even a superhero; you're not supposed to actually find him. I would call that a bona fide easter egg, no?

I once found my own Italian courtier "Mr. Maintenance" by accident (he was supposed to be in the court of the Pope, but apparently he moved elsewhere before inevitably dying of, well, being over 900 years old). That was before I added death = yes to the end of the history effect that called all my startup events.
 
i found a courtier with the immortal trait and i don't think he should have it.View attachment 96428

also all the retinues are available for some reason. and please do something about the calling your entire realm in a rebellion agents you thing.
The traits unique to PB all got moved one spot due to 2.0.2 adding another trait. I find it rather silly how Paradox does their indexing in such a way that it breaks things whenever a new one is added (it's quite literally impossible to make a trait implementation completely safe from this; whenever you add a trait you've got the choice of adding it before the vanilla traits; in which case those get messed up. Or you can add it after the vanilla trait, in which case your trait will be messed up whenever vanilla adds a new trait).
Did you opt into the 2.02 beta? I noticed all the retinues started showing up as well when I did that, though I may have updated PB at the same time; so I'm not sure if it's related to conflicts with the beta or an independent problem with 3.3.5
The Jewish retinue being available to everyone has been fixed in the PB beta build. Might be what's causing your retinue issue too.
Along the same lines, I found a courtier named "Project Balance" ID:9999999 (give or take a few 9s), age 1066 at the shaterred world start.
He triggers a bunch of stuff. He should die within days.
yes and he seems to have lost it now somehow.
There's an event to get rid of the Immortal trait when immortals aren't activated.
 
He triggers a bunch of stuff. He should die within days.

Hah, good thing I didnt spend money on inviting him to my court to become my religious leader! So, this might be more work than it's worth, but what about adding him to a religion that's not associated with anything else?

Ya, that sounds like its more work than it needs.
 
This might be because I went to the 867 date, but I found a princess of Karling, ID 163177 Who is a "Princess of ---"

edit: PB version:3.3.5
VIET: .1.5.1
Using Shattered worlds, all PB VIET mods, Gender Equality.
 
This might be because I went to the 867 date, but I found a princess of Karling, ID 163177 Who is a "Princess of ---"

edit: PB version:3.3.5
VIET: .1.5.1
Using Shattered worlds, all PB VIET mods, Gender Equality.
I'd recommend letting a month or so go by; most likely that'll fix it. The game gets confused sometimes when it comes to titles being lost, leading to people being "x of ---" for a little while.
 
Did you opt into the 2.02 beta? I noticed all the retinues started showing up as well when I did that, though I may have updated PB at the same time; so I'm not sure if it's related to conflicts with the beta or an independent problem with 3.3.5

And if you did opt into the beta, they just pushed out another small patch which completely changes how retinue availability is handled for all retinues. PB's retinues aren't updated for that change, so things might get wonky.
 
And if you did opt into the beta, they just pushed out another small patch which completely changes how retinue availability is handled for all retinues. PB's retinues aren't updated for that change, so things might get wonky.
That explains everything breaking, thanks :)
 
Project Balance 3.3.6 released!
May break saves from from 3.2.X. Should work fine with saves from 3.3.X.
If you encounter any issues or have any feedback, please report it in this thread.

Download: .7z archive version
  • Updated retinues to correspond with the newest 2.0.2 beta. If you're not using 2.0.2, retinues might break
  • Fixed the Jewish retinue being available to everyone
  • (PB+SWMH) Removed the penalty to levies in the Sahara. Their holdings being mostly cities should be plenty