Problems with Peaceful conversion to Communism

[Marat]

I have been trying to peacefully convert to Communist rule as Austria. I understand how to change my government to a proletarian dictatorship (ie. change to Const. Monarchy and then allow full suffrage with a Communist party in power) but can't get my pops to convert to communism or even stick with socialism.

I have been a Constitutional Monarchy with a Communist party in power for decades. The ideological thought inventions fired, changing 15% percent of my population to socialist. I raised my taxes for a month and managed to raise that number to 34%. However, when I lowered my taxes (back to 50%) after one month, all but 5% of my population changed away from socialist.

I hope that there is another way to convert pops to socialist or commie and keep them red. I don't want to keep the taxes so high that my population decreases. The only possibility that I can think of would be fomenting a rebellion, but as Austria I am worried that vast sections of the nation would split off as separate states (Poland, Romania, Hungary, etc.)

I also happen to have acceptable healthcare and good unemployment benefits, which have helped to increase my population growth and attract immigrant socialist craftsmen from other countries. Half of my population is composed of craftsmen or laborers with moderate levels of consciousness.

(edited to add spaces and make more reader-friendly)

 

[Dietmar1982]

Why are you so eager to get your pops to be communist?

I'm no expert, but as I understand it, communism is to socialist what reactionary is to conservatives, the high militancy ideology.

What year are you in? I think it gets easier to be socialist as the games progresses.
As Russia, I had a const monarchy who got a socialist party in power about the 1880's or 90's, and about 80% of my population socialist.
I simply taxed the lower class a 100%.
as soon as i lowered this, they all went liberal and conservative again.

Supposedly there are some late game events designed to keep you POPs at the extreme ideologies, but i've never seen them myself.

hope this helps a little

 

[Secret Master]

I will echo Dietmar1982's sentiment. Why are you so eager for your POPs to be Communist? If your government is still a Constitutional Monarchy, then who cares what your POPs think. Just keep the Communists in power. If you are facing some sort of militancy problem, trying to get your POPs to be Communist won't solve it. You should instead hold an election and let your people vote into power a party they like (appointing it yourself increases militancy). If you are just in the mood for a Proletarian Dictatorship, your best bet is to change your government now and work on your POPs over time.

As for events converting people to Communism, they only appear as a result of the very last cultural inventions in Revolutions, so you won't see them until 1919 at the earliest.

 

[HMS Enterprize]

Why the OP wants communism is not the issue really but based on some of the comments made here I have an additional question/observation.

The game engine at present seems to model communism/fascism as a response to 'bad' things- having lost a war, high taxes etc. And in the beginning, this seems like how it should be.

So in effect only pissed off people resort/convert to these ideologies.

But in game terms- once this commie/fascist state takes over and makes positive changes the POPs will mellow- again this is fair enough- to a certain extent.

But this does not take into account that these mellow POPs might want to stay as commies/fascists as these are the groups that gave them their present prosperity, despite their low militancy.

Is there a way for this to be remedied?

 

[unmerged(50629)]

Why the OP wants communism is not the issue really but based on some of the comments made here I have an additional question/observation.

The game engine at present seems to model communism/fascism as a response to 'bad' things- having lost a war, high taxes etc. And in the beginning, this seems like how it should be.

So in effect only pissed off people resort/convert to these ideologies.

But in game terms- once this commie/fascist state takes over and makes positive changes the POPs will mellow- again this is fair enough- to a certain extent.

But this does not take into account that these mellow POPs might want to stay as commies/fascists as these are the groups that gave them their present prosperity, despite their low militancy.

Is there a way for this to be remedied?

I think though, that the game was designed with reactionary extremes as just that. There should not be any way to maintain reactionary extremes for substantial durations of time. Happy people will tend to be happy. Only late in the game, when you begin moving toward the post WW1 era, can you begin to consider having a short enough time for reactionary effects to last. This is modeled in that a coversion to HOI will let you maintain that government through the whole HOI period.

For the OP, I suggest simply maintaining those high taxes month to month. that should keep the people socialist long enough to establish whatever Socialist Revolution you seek. To get Communists, if you can hold elections, simply spam elections every 9 months. Failure to get the "right" government would then lead to substantial militancy, and the Communists you seek.

 

[Marat]

The game is currently at year 1874. Militancy isn't really a problem, but I would like to keep it low. This is why I would like for my pops to at least be socialist, given that I plan on installing a proletarian dictatorship. According to VickyWiki, if a proletarian dictatorship is mostly composed of communist pops, then it will not suffer the negative effects of plurality (at least for its communist pops). I want to take this route with Austria partly because of the benefits of having full citizenship in an ethnically diverse nation and partly for the fun of spreading a red revolution across Europe.

But this does not take into account that these mellow POPs might want to stay as commies/fascists as these are the groups that gave them their present prosperity, despite their low militancy.

HMS Enterprize, you raise a glaring problem with the system. What I am also worried about is that my pops will stop being socialist once their life and everyday needs are being met.

If this is true, and pops don't seem to care about what the party/government is that raised their standard of living, then a communist revolution seems to be doomed to reverting to socialist and then conservative/liberal in a few years. In other words, successful communist governments are doomed to end in revolution, while unsuccessful communist governments maintain their people's loyalty (while starving them to death, thus lowering the nation's population).

 

[Marat]

Originally posted by Bowfling44 For the OP, I suggest simply maintaining those high taxes month to month. that should keep the people socialist long enough to establish whatever Socialist Revolution you seek. To get Communists, if you can hold elections, simply spam elections every 9 months. Failure to get the "right" government would then lead to substantial militancy, and the Communists you seek.

The downside to maintaining high taxes over the long term is that it will result in a substantial drop in population. I had hoped to encourage population growth and that is why I enacted acceptable healthcare around 1855-60. Could my high levels of national healthcare and unemployment subsidies also be contributing to a reduction in socialist pops?

Thanks to everyone for the advice!

 

[unmerged(50629)]

The downside to maintaining high taxes over the long term is that it will result in a substantial drop in population. I had hoped to encourage population growth and that is why I enacted acceptable healthcare around 1855-60. Could my high levels of national healthcare and unemployment subsidies also be contributing to a reduction in socialist pops?

Thanks to everyone for the advice!

Can you hold elections? If so, then the short time necessary to get Socialist elected are likely to have a small impact on your overall population. If not, revolution seems likely to be the only recourse.

Of course, you could just cheat ... I would say playing the game you want to play is going to be more fun thatn the loss you feel in having not done it the "right" way.

 

[Marat]

Originally posted by Bowfling44
Can you hold elections? If so, then the short time necessary to get Socialist elected are likely to have a small impact on your overall population. If not, revolution seems likely to be the only recourse.

I am a constitutional monarchy, so I could enact elections. But I already have appointed a communist party so there is no real need. Also, if socialists didn't win the election, then I would lose the ability to convert my non-national cultures.

When you say that revolution would be the only recourse do you mean that a red revolution would convert my pops to commies?