Problems with France in the 1936 scenario

[xsmilingbanditx]

Well again...it's, like others said before, a thing of Balance and Sandbox vs Railroad.
Focuses already help there but imagine, everytime Germany goes Rhineland with the 200k or whatnot Army, France opposes because it has three times the army size and enough Equipment to Support double that. Two months later the new Endboss would be the SU that wouldn't stand a chance too. How much fun is that?

You have to remember, all the Systems of a game are hard abstractions of real world circumstances. Some fit better than others.
So, France having a shortage of Equipment in 1936 could mean they cannot produce enough - it could also read as "aw well it's Peace and stuff and we have a huge army so why bear the cost of producing/transporting/repairing all that stuff we won't be attacked anyways". Aka bad/incompetent Leadership.

As much as I appreciate mods like BICE and the work people put in ... it's basically "we split up Infantry and Support Equipment into eight other things people need to produce, and then we add five different kinds of military factories for the lulz" which, in my honest opinion, doesn't really add anything to the game mechanically or gameplay wise. It's nice for immersion maybe.
Another thing is the conquering. I am fully aware that you should never be able to capitalize 100% of the capacity in conquered regions. But in the current state (and when you don't have time to use the agency to help you) I find myself asking "why conquer?". I mean you barely get Manpower or factories and constantly lose Equipment and Manpower to garrisons so...where's the gain? Further nerfing the spoils of war just kills the reason for conquest (it's just a game after all, I'm not a warmonger ).

 

[Leinad965]

France has nerfed the beginning of the game and Germany has focuses to attack them earlier than historical. Both things are probably for game reasons, so France will fall AI vs AI. If you go after year 1941, it starts to be realisticaly strong.

 

[Stonne]

I totally agree, I made a post about this a few months ago ( https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/make-france-realistic-again.1388555/ ) but the devs seems to not have seen it...
It’s sad because France is probably one one of most interesting countries to play but it’s just so unrealistic...

 

[xsmilingbanditx]

France has nerfed the beginning of the game and Germany has focuses to attack them earlier than historical. Both things are probably for game reasons, so France will fall AI vs AI. If you go after year 1941, it starts to be realisticaly strong.

Well if France would have been realistically strong in 1940, we wouldn't be sitting here, arguing about that opinion, would we?
There is a thin line between limiting the AI and at the same time offering the Player options to overcome those limitations. And they are, quite frankly, there. It is possible to hold France especially with the help of Britain. Maybe not all the colonies but the mainland for sure.

 

[Leinad965]

I just want to specify, that while in previous HOI versions was France nerfed as a whole, now is nerfed only in historical dates. So for ahistorical scenarios it is not as bad, as it may look.

 

[Nakkivene]

The Allies can hold France in MP and without played meddling Axis always loses in SP. If France was realistically powerful (and Italy weak and so on) there would hardly be a point to playing this game.

 

[Hiksday]

The problem with France is that by the time you make it a real major power it's 1943 and the war is finished .
You can't really go on the offensive , you just defend and wait . While historicaly accurate it's boring to play .
I would rather see debuff for the first 6 month of the war than crippling national spirit for 4 years .

 

[him_15]

France simply has to be defeated to have a proper balance in this game between the Axis and Allied no matter what. This is their destiny.

 

[Emperor_Napoleon]

France simply has to be defeated to have a proper balance in this game between the Axis and Allied no matter what. This is their destiny.

This. The Axis would be very weak and vulnerable if they had to fight a strong France in the west and the USSR in the east at the same time. That’s sort of why Hitler made sure that didn’t happen historically. If France doesn’t fall in 1940, the game becomes extremely unbalanced and an easy Allied victory is almost 100% guaranteed.

 

[Jays298]

I think France works the way it's supposed to. It's frustrating to play but when the AI plays it it runs perfectly.

But I think what people want is an alt history awesome ability to make France powerful.

I remember reading Churchill's speach. I think he said there were 800 German tanks, maybe 1200, that broke through the French lines. The French army just wasn't in the right place. Couldn't be in fact.

 

[Shaka of Carthage]

If France doesn’t fall in 1940, the game becomes extremely unbalanced and an easy Allied victory is almost 100% guaranteed.

If France doesn't fall, the US should not intervene in the European war.

 

[Áurum]

1. France starts with largest army in Europe after the Soviets. Yeah it needs some serious manpower min-max to get into few million soldiers, and I agree it's not all that historical. It does make a good challenge for the French player though, and gives initiative to beat Germany before they outbuild everyone. One way to win Germany is to declare war on them instantly when Rhineland fires, deal with the civil war quickly and then just beat them with army double or triple to theirs.
2. Idk, balance I guess? If they didn't have that rifle shortage, you could mop Germany extremely easy in any war starting 1936-1938. You're right again, it doesn't really mirror history that well. French problems were in organization and morale, not in equipment.

Then the nerf to make France always lose could be significant reduction of division organization, organization recovery and reinforce rate, instead of ahistorical things like equipment and manpower shortage.