[PRIVATE] United Moderate Party HQ

[unmerged(24047)]

It depends on where the platform will shift.
I could find place in the new party, but only if the issues of the new entity match with mine.
I still don't know, but i don't place veto on that.

 

[Craig Ashley]

First off, gentlemen, I'm back. Problems with the old ticker knocked me out for far longer than I'd like, but my doctors have allowed me to resume my usual work schedule.

A merger with P4P is an intriguing possibility. We would form a strong bloc for the next election cycle, if we can come together on a reasonable platform and ticket. I think it might be wise to have a meeting between our respective memberships, or at least a conference involving a few key players on both sides to see who stands where.

 

[unmerged(10397)]

Via Speakerphone

Welcome back, Jake. Sorry I couldn't be there to meet you myself, but I'm at the secure government location.

I've been meeting with Fourgères regularly, but we haven't had a formal inter-party conference.

Right now, the proposal we're talking about has the P4P merging into the UMP, with me retaining the leadership and Fourgères becoming my Deputy. We'll rename the party and redraft the platform a bit to conform with the new makeup of the party. We've been talking about redrafting parts of the platform anyway though, so everything seems pretty good.

 

[Craig Ashley]

What portions of the platform are being considered for redrafting?

And has there been any talk to the ticket for the up coming elections?

 

[unmerged(10397)]

Via Speakerphone

We haven't talked much about the platform, but I know Loic is anti-death penalty, and we've agreed that we need something in terms of prison reform.

As to the ticket, we've been discussing Loic as our Presidential candidate, given that he believes he can pick up an endorsement from Josephus, and will thus be almost sure to win. That and, of course, he's a good candidate.

You may recall that when he first got here he had some problems with being rather...undiplomatic...but he's made quite an effort to change that. Now Loic's doing quite well with the MIDA. He's a very sharp man.

Also, a word about Cornelius Dank. I don't know how much you know about him, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't suspicious of him. I don't really think he's running the show, but I'm nearly certain he's supporting it in some way.

 

[Craig Ashley]

"I don't know much about Dank personally, but I've read some of his writings and heard some of his speeches. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if he was connected to the bombing. The bigger question to me is if the ESA as a party is connected. Dank is the new chairman, right?"

"Loic would be a fine choice for a candidate, but I gotta tell you John, I was considering tossing my hat into the ring. The public can't be happy with Uncle Joe's performance in the Diamond Office, so his long time nemesis, namely me, could be an attractive candidate."

"I've made an appointment to talk to Loic in person for later today. I'll talk to him about these things and see what he has to say."

 

[unmerged(10397)]

I'm not sure, Jake. Sure, all Joe's supporters will be upset with him over his inactivity.

But can you really get up in front of people and call him on that?

Think about why I became Speaker instead of you when Talbott disappeared. Think about why this party was falling apart until I took over. Think about why Vasco IKK was the incumbent instead of you in Term VI.

No offense, but your record speaks volumes against you.

 

[Craig Ashley]

I've had health issues. Joe's been the Diamond Office the whole term, healthy as a horse, and hasn't done a thing. Even though I didn't complete my term, let's remember a few things:

I guided the nation through the most turbulent foreign policy crisis with the Americans.

I drafted and passed several key bills, including HERB, ESTHTA, and RFA, which is more than Joe has done in his entire legislative career, let alone presidency.

My cabinet and I helped lay the ground work for the renewing of NAFA and the first coal deal that helped keep millions of workers at their jobs. We were also the ones to finally resolve the refugee situaiton.

Yes, I had an abreviated time in office, but I accomplished plenty while I was there. And I think the voters recognize the difference between personal health issues and old fashioned inactivity.

Besides, this isn't an issue we need to resolve right now. Let me talk with Loic a bit, and see what he has to say.

 

[unmerged(10397)]

Via Speakerphone

Jake, you've been dismissed from basically every major position you've held in our government.

Personally, I have believed your health reasons every single time. And I've welcomed you back with open arms every single time. But if an athlete is sick every time he's put in the game, even if it's not fault of his own, doesn't his coach eventually stop putting him in?

If you disappear without a word again, it will destroy the credible, steady appearance that I have been building in the face of Josephus's inactivity.

The last time you asked me to support you for the Presidency, it was the first time I'd seen you since I appointed you as my Chief of Staff. You didn't say a word about it, and I let it go. Then, you disappeared. The centrist cause went into decline for years after that.

And now, you're putting me in an almost identical situation. If you were in my position, can you honestly say you'd agree to such a risk?

 

[Craig Ashley]

First off, I'm not asking you to support anything right now. I just said I was considering throwing my hat into the ring. Let's not be so hasty.

I understand your concerns regarding my old ticker. I'm sure it would come up, if I ended up running. If you don't want to support me, that's fine John. That still doesn't mean that I'm not going to explore my options.

 

[unmerged(33865)]

I hereby apply for membership in the United Moderate Party. The P4P has been dissolved and just to be sure I have resigned from it as well, so I am not a member of any other party. Here is a copy of my citizenship papers.

 

[HJ Tulp]

Hmmmm I assume this means that the P4P-UMP merger is a fact?

 

[unmerged(33865)]

Admiral Tulp, the P4P has been dissolved. I have applied to join this party. I hope many of the other P4P members will to do so as well. That is not a exactly a merger.

Please don't assume, because the P4P, in an effort to try to shape policy this term, decided to endorse an ESA Presidential candidate, that every member of the P4P agreed with every policy in the ESA platform. For instance, I held back on ridiculing the 4 hour or 6 hour day proposals so as not to creating unnecessary conflict within the administration, but I did so as such a laughable proposal seemed certain to fail without any action on my part. The most progressive members of the P4P were the founder Jonh Kenny, and the previous party leader John Black, neither of whom have the health to particpate in politics anymore. Please take the time to get to know us, I think you will find we share quite a number of common positions.

Besides, it was I who convinced the President to promote you and make you Naval Chief of Service. I also talked him into proposing the compromise on VAT that would have gotten you some new ships, if it was passed. We might get a slimmed down version approved yet. Maybe, when we get the economy growing, we will be able to trim some tax rates next term.

 

[HJ Tulp]

Per de Fourgeres, let me be straight, at alot of points I've allways though the UMP was to leftist for me, with the influx of central left to left members from the P4P that situation is not likely to improve. I'm not saying that's neccesarily a bad thing for the party but I feel I cannot be a part of this. Furthermore Per de Fourgeres, I hope you suggest me as CoS of the Navy because of my abilities and the allocation on VAT funds because it's needed not out of political motives...

 

[unmerged(33865)]

Politics involves policies, recognizing abilities, and sometimes doing favors. I wouldn't have suggested you for that slot if I thought your were incapable of doing it, but I didn't rule you out automatically because of your party. All I am asking for is the same consideration on you part. Also, I don't think the 'central left to left members from the P4P' is an appropriate or useful description anymore. The people that gave it that image, Jonh Kenny and John Black, are out of politics. Look back at my comments at the CAFTA meeting and you will see, on matters of trade, I said the same kinds of things as PG Talbott, who is now in the CUE. Jean Saint Daere, the P4P MGA, obviously has a good understanding of economics, is an entrepneur, and argued against taxing wealth producing investments in the VAT or inheritance taxes. Dagmar FitzHerbert is centrist, but not that active. In the new political landscape this party can expect to attract a wide range people like that, which are neither Socialist nor monarchist. Frans Truman may be typical of what you expected from the P4P, but he is definitely not a socialist. They offered him a GA seat and he turned them down. It is no longer relevant, but I tried to position the P4P as pragmatic, and not be pigeonholed at a particular point on the political spectrum. I understand that you have some misgivings. Why not wait around while we begin to discuss what the best platform would be for the next election, and see what comes of that? You might be pleasantly surprised.

 

[HJ Tulp]

Per de Fourgeres, even before this 'merger' I had my doubts if I was at my place at this party. The main reason why I stayed however was because I wanted this party to stay. Eutopia needs a party like the UMP and I acknowledged that, at that point the UMP was on the verge of collapsing in my opinion, me leaving would have worsened it. Your entry and possible that of many others ensures the existence of a centrist party in Eutopia. I myself however think that I'm more at my place at a party like the CUE.

 

[unmerged(33865)]

Thanks for explaining that, Admiral Tulp. I didn't want you to think we were hijacking your party.

Per Speaker or Major McGrath, is there any chance of getting one of you to second Jean Saint Daere's bill that would finally let us carry out the highway purchase from the Portuguese that Jake Ashley negotiated in Term IX? The budget, if it ever gets passed will accomplish the same thing, but the longer we wait, the more likely the deal will fall through.

 

[HJ Tulp]

Bon Chance mes amis, I hereby resign from the UMP.

 

[Brownbeard]

Hi everyone! I'm here and ready to join!

Oh, and here's my ID

 

[Craig Ashley]

I know we're not going to get a party concensus on this issue, but I'd like to discuss the VAT. Our unemployment rates are already nearing double digets. VAT is going only further surpress demand from the private sector, thereby causing companies to decrease supply and be in a position to lay off even more workers. Taxes by their very nature have a dampening affect on demand. This coupled with the recent round of interest rate hikes is also going to make Eutopia far less attractive to investors. The costs of doing business and even making purchases in Eutopia keep going up.

Plus, others have mentioned the possibility of a work here, buy elsewhere situation. And yes, people will gladly cross the border to make major purchases if it will save them a few bucks, and border communities will cross over daily to make purchases of all kinds.

The biggest issue I see with VAT is it will likely have diminishing returns as time goes on. With demand surpressed, by both VAT and rising unemployment figures, consumption will fall. As consumption falls, VAT brings in less revenues, but still has the stifling affect.

And lastly, there are serious flaws in the set up of the tax itself. Some of the loopholes are embarassing. And the very nature of the tax is regressive. Those who have to spend almost all of their income for day to day needs will be hit the hardest by the tax. The rich can simply sock the money in the bank, invest it in the market, or buy overseas.

If we are going to support some kind of tax reform, shouldn't we examine looking into a more progressive tax system?