Price Increase

[Had a dad]

AFTER 1K POSTS AND 50 PAGES?

So; since 25 posters account for 432 of the posts (23 pages of the thread), last night I have locked the thread to those that have repeatedly posted here. Feel free to share your opinion on the price increase, but the same people posting over and over causes those that post once or twice to be lost in the shuffle.

For those that have lost access to this thread, do not open another thread about this, as you have already indicated your feelings.

 

[Lord Canterbury]

Steam reviews are handled by Steam and we can't actually edit or delete them. This makes sense when you think of it, otherwise developers could delete every single negative review of their game . Your review is locked until a Steam moderator can investigate it further (and locked so you can't edit what it was reported for).

I think his question is why would you ask Steam to delete his review? Assuming algaar is the Al Gaar on steam with one of the highest rated negative reviews, its directly on the topic that matters for much of the community:

"Like the game. Dont like x2 price increase without warning and explaination. I am strongly recommend to avoid Paradox published games due to their marketing policy. Right now, with current prices, you can find much more games with better fun/price ratio." - Al Gaar.

Trying to get reviews deleted for calling out something that many people are unhappy with is exactly the worst way to deal with an angry community (and by the way Paradox, if you have noticed you are in teh process of losing what was previously one of the most loyal communities in gaming). Paradox, you chaps want to take a serious look on Steam at how the world views you right now.

 

[Marshall18]

Wow. The community is really angry. Have you seen the ratings on the games on steam?

I am sure they weren't expecting this much backlash from the community.

Would be interesting to see how this will affect their sales during the summer sales

 

[Skywalker_T-65]

Honestly, this is something I expected to happen sooner or later. Maybe not exactly this, but something along these lines. I may just be more jaded than most from years of playing Bethesda, Bioware and Wargaming products but...yeah. Companies will company. Even Paradox, much as I still support them, was never immune to this. Rose-tinted glasses to when they were a smaller group aside, they've made questionable choices in the past. Anyone remember the East vs. West debacle? Alternatively, that game they announced before anything was ready and hasn't had anything since...I think it was a shooter? Didn't really pay attention since I'm here for the strategy games.

Regardless, the point is, Paradox has never been immune to bad choices. They've been better about it, of course, but still. Is this a bad choice? Very much so. Will this lose customers? Perhaps, though those who really like the games probably would have just shrugged and gone 'fine, whatever' anyway because they've put up with the DLC policy until now. Certainly some loyal fans are going to be turned off and will leave. Totally their prerogative and anyone who tries to say 'stop complaining and suck it up noob' is being out of order, IMO.

I'm still going to get stuff that interests me, because I like the games- Civ, to use the nearest competitor, doesn't appeal to me because of the inherent randomness. But I've already reached the point where I won't buy certain things.

For instance, I still don't have HoI IV because there's little about that game that interests me. Darkest Hour still works perfectly fine- better even -so I see no reason to get it until the thing has more updates in its cycle. I haven't bought Utopia yet either. Though that one isn't on Paradox, that's on me being a poor (by American standards) college student who can't afford to splurge when I've been spending my money on books for my future classroom instead. Other people are in worse straits than I am and just can't afford to get the stuff, which is totally fine to complain about.

I guess, in the end, I'm not up in arms because I'm just used to it from other companies and expected some form of price gouging here too. Bethesda just decided they're going to make people pay 60$ (American) for Fallout 4 VR, even for people who already have the game. Wargaming has long been a bastion of 'buy premium or don't advance' in World of Tanks (Warships is better). Bioware has made many questionable choices over the past few years, ever since ME3's ending. When you get used to being gouged on these things, it's harder to feel anything about it- especially when you still like the company and (some of) their games, bad choices aside.

(Before I get a ton of negative ratings:

By no means, though, am I saying this is a good thing. Or that people shouldn't be angry and complaining. Just because I can't rally any real anger, doesn't mean people shouldn't be angry themselves. Everyone has their opinion and everyone has the right to feel like they do. No question about that)

(EDIT: Also, and this is just a general thing, replying to the mod posts isn't going to help. That's against the rules and, no matter how right you may or may not be...it's not going to do you any good.

I understand the feelings, but it is breaking a rule.)

 

[Pete0714]

"Hey gang,
As you have noticed prices for our products have increased in certain regions around the globe and this is something we've intentionally done. The reason for this is to make our prices match the purchasing power of those areas, as well as create a more equal price point for our products across the globe.

Our prices have remained pretty much the same for several years and it's only natural for us to re-evaluate price points at regular intervals based on the strength of various currencies, fluctuations in world markets and many other factors. This is something that all publishers do and we are no exception.

Sadly this means that the price has gone up for certain regions and whilst this is something we'd like to avoid, it's necessary to keep our price point more in line with our other markets. We sincerely apologize for any frustration this may cause and hope you can understand why we are doing this."

Hey gang,
As you have noticed prices for our products have increased in certain regions around the globe and this is something we've intentionally done. The reason for this is to make our prices match the purchasing power of those areas, as well as create a more equal price point for our products across the globe.

Our prices have remained pretty much the same for several years and it's only natural for us to re-evaluate price points at regular intervals based on the strength of various currencies, fluctuations in world markets and many other factors. This is something that all publishers do and we are no exception.

Sadly this means that the price has gone up for certain regions and whilst this is something we'd like to avoid, it's necessary to keep our price point more in line with our other markets. We sincerely apologize for any frustration this may cause and hope you can understand why we are doing this.

So...As I understand it (correct me if I am wrong or mistaken) paradox seemed to be indicating that for years they were pricing it lower in other countries, but higher in ones like mine in the US. So now, since other countries are doing better they get to finally start paying closer to what we have been paying for the same product. Now, as a person who has been paying more to support this game in the US for years while others in other nations apparantly have been paying less, who should be ticked off? I have a hard time sympathizing with the main complainers here if they have been paying less than me for years for a luxury item internationally. Its not food or water or health care, its a game.

 

[henricosta]

It really sucks when a company acts like a company and actually care about making money to get longevity for their company and actually serve their owners like they're legally obliged to (oh wait, what?). People talking about what's "right" and what's "fair", it would be fair that everyone would pay the same price, no matter where they live or how wealthy they are, since there are poor and rich people everywhere. Don't talk about equality and being fair if to you it means that YOU should get stuff for cheaper price just because you were born in a country that hasn't been able to develop their economy to a level where people can afford these kind of "luxury" products (games).

Yeah, 'cause that's how things work.
But it is not.

 

[ZVERMIX]

So now, since other countries are doing better they get to finally start paying closer to what we have been paying for the same product.

Except these countries are not doing better. They are all experiencing serious economic problems. If anything the standard of living and purchasing power decreased.
And even if the country was doing better, increasing the price by 100%+ is ridiculous (as is the case with Russia, as illustrated above).

 

[algaar]

Just to add information about the review I posted earlier - it is not flagged as "off-topic" and "abusive" anymore and not deleted.
Steam mods did that or Paradox themselves - can't say.

 

[DetCord]

Except these countries are not doing better. They are all experiencing serious economic problems. If anything the standard of living and purchasing power decreased.
And even if the country was doing better, increasing the price by 100%+ is ridiculous (as is the case with Russia, as illustrated above).

We're not doing that great here in the States either. I mean unemployment, the real unemployment numbers (U-6) the DoL doesn't tabulate is rather staggering at 22% or 40-45 million people. More people are on one form of Welfare or another and its gone up over the past eight years. States and cities here are going bankrupt. Yes, you read that right. States and cities. Arizona for example was so broke that they had to sell their state capital buildings to private investors. The list goes on.

How we avoided this price increase while Canada didn't is beyond me. I mean people here just aren't buying stuff. Which, ya know, is kinda bad for a consumer driven system...

 

[Pete0714]

Except these countries are not doing better. They are all experiencing serious economic problems. If anything the standard of living and purchasing power decreased.
And even if the country was doing better, increasing the price by 100%+ is ridiculous (as is the case with Russia, as illustrated above).

To be fair, when I didn't have money, I spent what I had on food and bills, and only bought one game a year. When I had money, I spent more money on games. I never blamed it on the game company for being too expensive. It's a luxury item, not a necessity. Food , water, housing, education, healthcare, those things are needed by all human beings and should be ensured to all and income adjusted. Why did I as an American have to pay more for my same game than folks other countries? How is that fair?

 

[Pete0714]

We're not doing that great here in the States either. I mean unemployment, the real unemployment numbers (U-6) the DoL doesn't tabulate is rather staggering at 22% or 40-45 million people. More people are on one form of Welfare or another and its gone up over the past eight years. States and cities here are going bankrupt. Yes, you read that right. States and cities. Arizona for example was so broke that they had to sell their state capital buildings to private investors. The list goes on.

How we avoided this price increase while Canada didn't is beyond me. I mean people here just aren't buying stuff. Which, ya know, is kinda bad for a consumer driven system...

I think we didn't avoid the price increase, in think they gave it to us all along.

 

[DroP90]

If a Brazilian wants to buy all expansion DLCs for EU IV he will pay R$180 with the current 50% discount, excluding Mandate of Heaven that only has a 10% cut. How the heck you guys want to expand your player base on our like this? I know you guys have been interested in this since games like HoI 4 and Stellaris launched with Brazilian-PT support. With this new prices don't even bother to put our language in your games.

R$20~25 on a single piece of DLC on sale is lame af, common Paradox. This is what I pay for FULL AAA games on sale.

R$180 for all DLCs on sale is a joke, to summarize, I'm planning to buy Fallout 4, Far Cry 4, Dishonored 2, Doom and a couple of other games and I will spend no more than R$150 this sale.

 

[sterrius]

Also more people will spread the word of your old and new products.

 

[DroP90]

Why did I as an American have to pay more for my same game than folks other countries? How is that fair?

OMG, entitled much?

Dude, how much did you paid for your PC?

I recently bought one with the following config:

i7 7700K - Z270F - 16GB DDR4 - M2 960 250GB - 850 EVO 500GB - NZXT S340 - Corsair H80i and some other things (peripherals, fans and such)

I spent almost R$6000 on this PC, and you have to account for my GTX 1070 bought last year for almost R$2000. Ah, my monitor is a shitty Dell IPS 60Hz, because those good 144Hz panels costs more than R$2500 and I couldn't afford one right now. And on top of this, some of these parts like the processor and the 2 SSDs were bought on Amazon-US and brought to Brazil (luckily I wasn't taxed), if not I would've paid even more. And you know how much is the average salary in Brazil? R$2000, the minimum wage is R$950.

Also, last year I bought a car, paid around R$35000 on a 2013 VW Polo (google if you don't know it). Yes, R$35000 in a used car, since the new ones in the same category starts at R$55000. And on top of this you have to account for taxes, license fees, insurance and so on.

So yes, recently I've spent more than R$50000 with a PC and a car. Tell me, with U$50000 which PC and which car I could've bought living in US?

So please, stop crying about paying a couple pennies more on digital games, I pay WAY more for everything else living in Brazil, and when you consider other things like quality of life, security, infra-structure and so on, you will see how much your whine is lame.

 

[Pete0714]

OMG, entitled much?

Dude, how much did you paid for your PC?

I recently bought one with the following config:

i7 7700K - Z270F - 16GB DDR4 - M2 960 250GB - 850 EVO 500GB - NZXT S340 - Corsair H80i and some other things (peripherals, fans and such)

I spent almost R$6000 on this PC, and you have to account for my GTX 1070 bought last year for almost R$2000. Ah, my monitor is a shitty Dell IPS 60Hz, because those good 144Hz panels costs more than R$2500 and I couldn't afford one right now. And on top of this, some of these parts like the processor and the 2 SSDs were bought on Amazon-US and brought to Brazil (luckily I wasn't taxed), if not I would've paid even more. And you know how much is the average salary in Brazil? R$2000, the minimum wage is R$950.

Also, last year I bought a car, paid around R$35000 on a 2013 VW Polo (google if you don't know it). Yes, R$35000 in a used car, since the new ones in the same category starts at R$55000. And on top of this you have to account for taxes, license fees, insurance and so on.

So yes, recently I've spent more than R$50000 with a PC and a car. Tell me, with U$50000 which PC and which car I could've bought living in US?

So please, stop crying about paying a couple pennies more on digital games, I pay WAY more for everything else living in Brazil, and when you consider other things like quality of life, security, infra-structure and so on, you will see how much your whine is lame.

Ok, first of all, I am not trying to whine. In fact, I am fine with paying more, but I was making a point about everyone else equating this price increase in other countries with an act of economic injustice. Now, the price of all you stated for cars and computers etc is of course ridiculous, and so how about we ask if there are bigger, much bigger issues of injustice that need to be dealt with as well. I am not some Trumpian conservative, and I am disgusted with the way things are going in that realm. In many areas I am a globalist liberal. But I feel that acting as if I as an American somehow deserve to be charged more because of where I live is no more just than your having to pay such ridiculous amounts for a car or a computer. And yes I guess I am entitled, I have a damn good life right now, but I also have had to live paycheck to paycheck, had to skip meals and fear bill collectors for not paying on time because I had no money, and I will say that at that time I sure as hell was not worried about game costs.

 

[SilentN4saken]

Woah an I though the over priced russia DLC and flaging reviews as abuse was bad! I was quiting eu4 because of it but now I find out they have increased the prices on even there old unsupported games that are already over priced an should have bargain bin prices, guess I wont be going back to try the older games like I was considering

 

[DroP90]

Ok, first of all, I am not trying to whine. In fact, I am fine with paying more, but I was making a point about everyone else equating this price increase in other countries with an act of economic injustice. Now, the price of all you stated for cars and computers etc is of course ridiculous, and so how about we ask if there are bigger, much bigger issues of injustice that need to be dealt with as well. I am not some Trumpian conservative, and I am disgusted with the way things are going in that realm. In many areas I am a globalist liberal. But I feel that acting as if I as an American somehow deserve to be charged more because of where I live is no more just than your having to pay such ridiculous amounts for a car or a computer. And yes I guess I am entitled, I have a damn good life right now, but I also have had to live paycheck to paycheck, had to skip meals and fear bill collectors for not paying on time because I had no money, and I will say that at that time I sure as hell was not worried about game costs.

Ok, sorry if I was rude but your last sentence made me mad.

Our prices were more or less equal until our currency started to deteriorate, today you pay more than me on games if we convert directly, but if you take into account subjective things like purchase power and perceived value of goods you will see how this difference is irrelevant considering other major factors.

 

[Pete0714]

Ok, sorry if I was rude but your last sentence made me mad.

Our prices were more or less equal until our currency started to deteriorate, today you pay more than me on games if we convert directly, but if you take into account subjective things like purchase power and perceived value of goods you will see how this difference is irrelevant considering other major factors.

Sorry about my wording on that statement, I did not mean to sound whiny and entitled. I do understand that many nations are undergoing economic challenges , as well as political ones, that cause very personal problems that you should not have to deal with. Its truly bullshit that no one should have to suffer. I guess my frustration is not my having to pay more or less than others for the game, really I don't care personally, I am fine with it. But I got mad when a game I happen to love a lot got a crapload of negative reviews on steam, not because of the quality of the game, but because of the price change. And I guess when I found out that it was because the price was being changed to be more equal with what I had already been paying since day one, I felt a bit burned about the reaction. Sorry if I sounded like an arrogant entitled American. Have a few too many of those already.

 

[Remitonov]

They jacked up Victoria 2's prices, among others. As if prices here aren't shooting up the roof already. ._.

 

[el0375]

...... And I guess when I found out that it was because the price was being changed to be more equal with what I had already been paying since day one, I felt a bit burned about the reaction. Sorry if I sounded like an arrogant entitled American. Have a few too many of those already.

you dont sound as one . Ofc we all have feelings when we compare what we pay for something compared to other places too . The underlying problem out of all this is the attempt to make the prices more equal around the different markets instead of tailoring them ( even if they claimed as such ) and have them a bit more or less equivalent / proportionate. Taxes aside, this is something I would try to always keep in mind . and here like I said in other posts, this is a digital good so there is space to really tailor the prices, and still bring a profit, increase the player base, decrease piracy , getting the game known and expand the company's footprint etc...
If it was a product like a car you cant apply that reasoning ( because the car has a fixed price of production lets say 10K $, so I would need to still sale it over that price in any of the regions , even if the change of currency would make it cost lets 40K Turkish liras and maybe in that country this price is seen as exceptionally high ).

reading you out it seems its the reaction or feeling you get of sudden waves of negative reviews flooding the pages of the game even if it was a good game as a game for you

it might be messy , sad and so on but I think people can and should be free to add the price as a factor too if they consider it as such( also here more than past they add it because they knew how prices where before instead of now )so when this happened it's to be expected and in general terms it should be so that people react or put it into account and I would rather hear them out rather than not .
the other complexity is that until recently this game had a different set price, so the increase comes as a further shock + how out of touch from reality is in some markets. it can insult them and for some its a valid factor and in all honesty I think putting it into the review that's perhaps the only thing they can do apart from word of mouth to be heard and perhaps show a reactions towards this company decision. But apart from community managers and so on or if it reaches huge gaming mags that have a reputation, probably this wont change much.

All in all its also about how many factors we can put in each individual review, there isn't a set rule that they shouldnt consider price or other factors , so its up to them in good or bad. that's why they are user reviews , all according to their perceptions and hoping for a bit of common sense too ( not always a case)

On the good side , even with this dorky review system it helps see the tendencies and perceptions for the game through time