Price Increase

[RafaelCarvalho]

Paradox just readjusted their prices worldwide. According to them, one of its main reason was to better match to the regional purchasing power. However, let's analyze it. Europa Universalis 4's price before the readjustment was R$ 69,99, and now... R$ 105,99, that's a 34% increase! Some of ck2 dlcs also got almost a 50% price increase. The Brazilian minimum wage is R$937,00 and the average salary is around R$1.700. However we still have one of the heavier tax charges in the world, Brazilians work almost half of the year (5 months) just to pay taxes! So a person that gets, monthly, R$1700, due to taxes would gain something around R$1000 (-41%), excluding things such as water/energy bill, food and petrol consumption (what is also expensive in Brazil) would need to pay 1/10 of their monthly gains. This increase is outrageous! CK2 (R$105,99), a 5 years old game is costing almost the same as a triple A game that average R$110-130. Sorry Paradox, but you lost one of your consumers... If nothing changes, Rights of Man will remain as my last purchase of you. I also would like to address that, piracy happens a lot in Brazil, *a lot*, I even convinced lots of my friends to stop with it and buy your games. However, with those prices, the piracy will only become commoner and much more hard do fight against.

 

[pikachu01]

This will most likely increase the chance of people pirating rather than paying for the game, as the game and DLC is priced way beyond their means in some countries.

 

[ToTheMetal]

Average monthly wage in Russia is 39300sh rubles

Way too high. it's either pre-taxed salary nobody sees ever, or it's simply mean value, which is inflated comparing to median that gives a more accurate representation. I'd suggest you redo your calculations with a sum of something like 22-23k.

Then there is the 13% tax rate in russia

There's more to it and the system is pretty shady to say the least.

Average rent in russia is recorded at 14500 rubles in Archangelsik

Mutliply that by 2 (if not 3) for most cities with decent living conditions. Besides, if you subtract that number (14500) from a median salary (23000), it will quickly turn out that an average person cannot buy CK2/EU4 with all the DLCs at full price within a single month with those new prices.

 

[MegaVat]

I think that prices need to stay as is because they are normal and part of the Russian community (the toxic one), which blackmails the publisher with bad reviews and threatening to download the game legally or boycott sales must go.

There's more to it and the system is pretty shady to say the least.

The tax system in Russia is complex, shady and corrupt. The way it works is better to describe on another forum. Briefly, most of the taxes paid by the employer, since in this case, they pay only for the minimum amount and not for the full salary. And the employee will get always what they discuss with the supervisor before.

Minimum wage in Russia is 5965 Rubles p/month

Now its 7 800 Rubles since 1 Jule of 2017.

Then there is the 13% tax rate in russia

Minimal salary can't be lower if you work on a full-time job, so you can't deduct 13% from this amount. Also in Russia, an employer usually pay all taxes for the employee and, many Russians work "illegally" or as "Individual entrepreneur" so they don't pay taxes at all or have different tax rates.

 

[Allein_7]

So, now Stellaris and Crusader Kings II are in club and it makes me so frustrated. The only way which looks reasonable is to stop buying any of their games at the current prices. I still hope that they'll soon come up with an idea to lower prices back to keep their target audience solvent

 

[gmanP]

I think that prices need to stay as is and part of the Russian community (the toxic one), which blackmails the publisher with bad reviews, must go.

The tax system in Russia is complex, shady and corrupt. The way it works is better to describe on another forum. Briefly, most of the taxes paid by the employer, since in this case, they pay only for the minimum amount and not for the full salary. And the employee will get always what they discuss with the supervisor before.

You are so knowledgeable about the shadow business in our country (sarcasm).

Listen, look at how much the prices in Europe and the USA have increased for all time (the site "steamprices") and how much in Russia, Brazil, India, China, South Korea, Turkey, etc. In all this countries, such high corruption?

 

[Chosen One V13]

So, now Stellaris and Crusader Kings II are in club and it makes me so frustrated. The only way which looks reasonable is to stop buying any of their games at the current prices. I still hope that they'll soon come up with an idea to lower prices back to keep their target audience solvent

They won't. The reason was solely in ditching the ballast and to keep milking US and EU with highest selling rates (those wasn't affected by price increasing) this is how it is looked like, this is how they treat rest of us. U cannot explain it with other conclusions, because: 1. They did that in ninja style without warning and 2. They increased it in best scenarios by 50% in worst just doubled the prices even for 2013 titles. There is no company's that do like this (I mean decent company's).

 

[le_souriceau]

I'm playing Paradox games since school years, and bought EU (2000) and HOI (2002) CDs with my hard-earned child savings back then. Now I'm grown man, almost 30, still love and play frequently series like EU, HoI, Stellaris very good too. So, generaly I'm rather OLD and loyal, so to say, costumer. Registered especialy to sound my opinion.

But now, I feel completly betrayed by this new "raise gamer taxes" policy slider in my country (Russia, again). While I personaly have good job and free money to buy games even with this "balanced" prices... I very definetly not so eager to do it now. Teste of this Paradox action is very sour (and even biased against poor countries), especialy when some very good games priced more adequatly (Witcher III, as good expample used several times above, and many more interesting Indie-games worth of support).

They make their choice, we, as a community, have full right to do our choices.

0) be angry and vocal about all this situation;
1) not buy games for their "full price", only on heavy sales or not buy them at all (if it some minor insanly overpriced DLC);
2) double/tripple strictness of our reviews (higher price = higher quality, all is honest), give Paradox game lower for problems we were more likely to forgive at past times;

Anyway, every action have consequences. I hope Paradox feel them soon enough. Financial way.

 

[isikus]

Having played computer games since I was 10 and having enjoyed the Paradox games for three years, I've never seen a game dev company which made me question my willingness to avoid game piracy more than Paradox. First unreasonably high prices for a number of not so big DLCs, now this. I mean, Russia is the fifth country by the number of EU4 players at least (http://steamspy.com/app/236850), even Sweden is #6. Now that the prices got EVEN MORE higher, I personally will stop purchasing Paradox products and will support all others who express similar opinions until Paradox starts caring about the community economicwise.

 

[Augustus93]

This is so shady, raising it for the poorer regions of the world by 50% and 100% while they leave the prices for Europe and North America alone. Does this make sense? No.
It would be one thing if they decided to raise the base prices by say 5% or even 10% across the board but raising it up to 100%(!!!) in poor areas is a joke. So why do this? Do they want less Russians and third worlders on this forum? I guess so because this decision will cause exactly that.

 

[isikus]

I think that prices need to stay as is because they are normal and part of the Russian community (the toxic one), which blackmails the publisher with bad reviews and threatening to download the game legally or boycott sales must go.

Isn't refraining from buying a thing for a price which seems too high for you a natural thing to do? By which means writing a bad review for something you've purchased and not enjoyed the price/quaity ratio does seem toxic for you? These are the legit ways to get the much-needed attention from the publisher as I see. Are there any better options to try to legally solve such an unacceptable for the vast majority of the regional community case other from these?

 

[gmanP]

Europe:game was 27.99 eur-- 39.99 (1.43x) GDP per capita PPP: 1.06x
USA: game was 29.99 dol-- 39.99 (1.3x) GDP per capita PPP: 1.027x
Russia: game was 499 rub -- 1399 (2.8x) GDP per capita PPP: 0.96x
2011-2017

Good joke Paradox, good joke

 

[Mortheim]

So, recent reviews on EU4 are mixed...Well, it is interesting

 

[le_souriceau]

Well, guys, I beaten my lazyness, and want bring real numbers/facts into our discussion here.

We have this statement:

Hey gang,
As you have noticed prices for our products have increased in certain regions around the globe and this is something we've intentionally done. The reason for this is to make our prices match the purchasing power of those areas, as well as create a more equal price point for our products across the globe.

And little below russian goverment official statistics for purchasing power of population from goverment website (http://www.gks.ru/wps/wcm/connect/rosstat_main/rosstat/ru/). Keep in mind, this is goverment stats (they always try to put things better that reality is -- like they give prices for lower-quality goods and so on). And "average salary" always tricky thing too (in reality its average is lower for most people). Anyway. Lets just assume this is more o less shows us overall dynamics. Another thing - with industrial/hi-tech goods everything far worse (more import).

Food here. Table basicly about "how much of this or that food you can buy for average salary". Everyone wants to eat, right? I added some amateurish translations for for broader comminity, hope it will be suffice for understanding and without too much mistakes.

Anyone sees magical 100% rise or even 50% of russian people since 2010 purchasing power? Mmm? Its even droped from 2014 and recovering very slowly in some areas.

I think stats in other poor (or somewhat poor) devepoping countries punished with recent price-rising, same or worse in real economic dynamics.

So, conclusion is, that argument about "matching purchasing power in different regions" have no solid ground under it. FACTS TELL AS COMPLETLY DIFFERENT STORY.

 

[Groogy]

Also I couldn't speel good.

Oh, hey, join the club

can I join?

 

[Liandri]

As you state the Russian rouble dropped in worth compared to the usd. Therefore in order for paradox to get the same amount of money as they were charging upon release they have to ask for more roubles.

I wanted to reply to exactly this: it is not logical. You are missing the whole point of digital goods and regional pricing. Regional prices, frequent discounts and sales in digital markets like Steam exist exactly because the goods are digital. There are no real regional pricing for physical goods. There is no way you can increase the profit if you'd be selling physical goods for 30%-80% cheaper in poor countries. It's only possible in digital world. And I think this is one of major instruments that helped digital outlets to increase profits and accelerate the growth of PC gaming market.

"A regional currency dropped in worth compared to the usd. So a seller needs to increase the regional price, to get the same amount of money."
Really? I can only tell this - trying to get the same amount of money is not how you do regional pricing of digital goods. You set adequate regional price to increase sales in poor countries. By increasing regional prices while corresponding regional salaries only drop in worth compared to major currencies you are making them far less adequate.

 

[Augustus93]

They are not even brave enough to tell the truth to us customers. The purchasing power story is an outright lie, the same with the apologist lie that it is because of inflation. The truth is that they are increasingly greedy, oh but their DLC practices wouldn't be like the evil AAA titles they said. Yes, they turned out to be much worse. It is so funny, they are becoming the caricature of the king in their crusader kings 2 trailer who says something like "tax this dude into space". In addition to that they decide to do this before the biggest sale of the year. They obviously want to take part in the summer sale but how could you do it without actually giving it away "too cheaply"? Easy, you raise the base price and then you can still have that -75% and -50% sale tag while in reality you are selling it for more or less the original pricetag. I have seen this exact same strategy from other swedish businesses.

 

[MegaVat]

Isn't refraining from buying a thing for a price which seems too high for you a natural thing to do?

I never said that. You refuse from buying something that you don't want and this is OK. But you can do it an adult way like just stop buying it. Paradox will see in statistics that in some regions sales are dropped and they will do something about it if they are interesting. There is no need for everybody to spam the same thing.

By which means writing a bad review for something you've purchased and not enjoyed the price/quaity ratio does seem toxic for you?

I see some broken logic in your message. Since you are already bought this game that means that this prise is OK for you. The only people who have bought the game can write a review, and for me, that looks like they just blackmailing developers with the reviews to buy DLC's at old prices.
Also if you buy something and didn't enjoy it's price/quality ratio you can make a refund.

I have nothing aginst regional policy and every county should have an ability to buy games and join the community. But now in Russian Steam, there are some games that are more expensive and people buy them with no problems.

The price increase is inevitable. The only problem with this price change is that the developers make them too sudden and too high at one time. I think that's what makes RU community so frustrating.

If developers have made an annulment (i don't know if they did) and divided price change into a couple of steps then, in my opinion, it shouldn't be so painful for Russians.

 

[le_souriceau]

Upping prices up to +100% almost overnight and just 1 m before sales (most interested ppl have plans and waited especialy) was complete un-ethical, cruel, greedy, [other bad words] backstab.

It is pure and simple disrespect for community, no matter nationality, in grand scale of things.

 

[hadaev]

I see some broken logic in your message. Since you are already bought this game that means that this prise is OK for you.

Review in steam asks me I recommend the game or not.
The old price was OK, I recommended the game.
The new price is not OK, I don't recommend the game.
Very simple logic.
Publisher have the right to raise the price.
I have the right to write my recomendation to other users.

Good luck on the summer sale with this price and such recent reviews.
I hope pdx marketers take into account such consequences of this decision, or they are simply incompetent.