preresearched german 1936 planes

[Bugnr01]

I saw in the first part of www that the most 1936 plan techs are allready researched for germany.

And there are ome questions blopping up in my mind:

Does any of these planes are researched with the bonuses of a "manufactorer"?

If yes which plane with what manufactorer?

If no, is this not a disadvantage for a german player?
You will be able to use your 1940 tech planes by about 1939-1940 (you have to research them with penalties, set a production line and wait till you have produced enougth of them to be able to really make a use of it).
So you will have to start the war with inferior tech compared to nations how are allowed to use manufactorers.

Are Im wrong?
What do you think about that?
Maybe some clarification from the devs?

 

[Premu]

As far as I understand the research is not tied to the manufacturer. You can switch the manufacturer after researching a technology.

 

[Bugnr01]

Yeah, but you are not able to research the Ju87 Stuka with the Junkers manufacturer because the tech is allready researched at the start of the game. So no bonuses for the worlds most famous dive bomber? Thats the thing im not happy with.

 

[jaredstanko]

Yeah, but you are not able to research the Ju87 Stuka with the Junkers manufacturer because the tech is allready researched at the start of the game. So no bonuses for the worlds most famous dive bomber? Thats the thing im not happy with.

i wasnt expecting to come into this thread leaving with something to complain about, but you have made a very compelling point. rabble rabble indeed...

parhaps germany should have no air manufacturer at game start, but the proper company bonuses on pre researched tech

 

[Dieder]

I'm guessing that the "to far ahead" penalty plays a large part in when to research 1940s planes. Not sure though. The www streams shows Johan and Jakob/Troy being reluctant to research to far ahead, so even as Jakob chose the CAS manufacturer he wasn't researching the new Stuka.


Also, and I'm definitely not sure about this, I think manufacturers give bonuses to characteristics and not production?!

 

[LordOfWar16]

Those bonuses only apply to vehicles you researched with those companies active. That means you could have messerschmitt researched fighters, Junkers researched dive bombers and Heinkel researched strategic bombers for example. Swapping those out will cost you alot of political points of course.

Vehicles you start with wont have any of those bonuses or will have them preset to their historical designers, but you still can use your land/sea/air experience to upgrade them of course. Those bonuses arent too drastic aswell and uprading them via the variant system and doctrines will affect their fighting capabilites alot more.

Germany certainly wont start with outdated tech into the war. Overall, you have the Bf-109 and Ju-87 researched, which are capable fighters. You can use your experience you gained from lend-lease to upgrade them prior to the war and during the war extent their lifespan by keeping upgrading them. That of course is capped, so you wont end up with an bf109 that has better stats than an ho.229 for example.

Besides that, you can produce alot more bf109 than newly researched fw190 for example, so you wont suddenly see only the newest stuff flying around. I am pretty certain that you will see hurricanes and bf-109 being produced through the entirety of the war.

 

[Zaku]

Companies give a permanent bonuses until they are the active one. I think the bonus applies to your pre existing techs, but the tooltip can be interpreted in either way. Clarification from a dev would be nice.
Source: 2nd livestream video, at 10:20 look at the tooltip.

 

[GsusNSV]

Companies give a permanent bonuses until they are the active one. I think the bonus applies to your pre existing techs, but the tooltip can be interpreted in either way. Clarification from a dev would be nice.
Source: 2nd livestream video, at 10:20 look at the tooltip.

From the Stream:
By selecting this Design Company they will permanently affect capabillities on all equipment researched while they are hired.

So I interpret it like this. New researched equipment will get the bonus from the designer, which is active when the research is finished. (Something like this was, i think, said by Podcat in one of the old DDs)

 

[Bugnr01]

Besides that, you can produce alot more bf109 than newly researched fw190 for example, so you wont suddenly see only the newest stuff flying around. I am pretty certain that you will see hurricanes and bf-109 being produced through the entirety of the war.

And thats a problem in my eyes. You are going to produce bf-109s over a very long time of the war and the hurricanes will allways be a little bit better (if right done; manufacturer + the same upgrades -> faster and more agile if the brits have simillar bonuses).

 

[Zaku]

From the Stream:
By selecting this Design Company they will permanently affect capabillities on all equipment researched while they are hired.

So I interpret it like this. New researched equipment will get the bonus from the designer, which is active when the research is finished. (Something like this was, i think, said by Podcat in one of the old DDs)

Maybe you're right, but it can be still interpeted the other way. Anyways the best bonus they give is the 10% research speed. The rest is just minor stuff, you won't loose or win the war if your 36 tech has 10% less/more in one or two stats.

I would still love to get clarification from a dev.

 

[LordOfWar16]

Companies give a permanent bonuses until they are the active one. I think the bonus applies to your pre existing techs, but the tooltip can be interpreted in either way. Clarification from a dev would be nice.
Source: 2nd livestream video, at 10:20 look at the tooltip.

If you research the PzIII while Porsche is active it and then switch to to henschel to research the pzIV, the panzer III will have the Porsche bonus and the PzIV the Henschel bonus. The devs actually mentioned it several times during the earlier streams and on the forum somewhere.

And thats a problem in my eyes. You are going to produce bf-109s over a very long time of the war and the hurricanes will allways be a little bit better (if right done; manufacturer + the same upgrades -> faster and more agile if the brits have simillar bonuses).

They most likely start with their historical designer anyway, so that wouldnt be an problem. Besides that it is not that likely that the british for example already have an company selected when they research the hurricane for example.

 

[Zaku]

If you research the PzIII while Porsche is active it and then switch to to henschel to research the pzIV, the panzer III will have the Porsche bonus and the PzIV the Henschel bonus.

Do you have a source on that please?

 

[Bugnr01]

From the Stream:
By selecting this Design Company they will permanently affect capabillities on all equipment researched while they are hired.

So I interpret it like this. New researched equipment will get the bonus from the designer, which is active when the research is finished. (Something like this was, i think, said by Podcat in one of the old DDs)

Thats also what i had in mind. the question is just wahts with the researched tech at the start of the game? Are these techs all without manufacturer bonuses or are there manufacturer settings for some techs (Junkers for the Ju87 and Messerschmitt for the Bf-109)

 

[LordOfWar16]

Do you have a source on that please?

Here you go.

we have set up companies so that you pick based on who you want designing and researching, rather than producer, which as you see above, matters a lot less.

 

[Zaku]

Here you go.

Thanks!

 

[LordOfWar16]

Thats also what i had in mind. the question is just wahts with the researched tech at the start of the game? Are these techs all without manufacturer bonuses or are there manufacturer settings for some techs (Junkers for the Ju87 and Messerschmitt for the Bf-109)

You need to keep in mind that it is unlikely that the british for example will research the Hurricane with an company anyway. They dont gain as much political power as germany, which gains significantly more than most other countries, so they get their advisors and companies faster. Johan for example in the World War Wednesday stream researches planes without an company selected. The bonuses arent that crucial that it justifies delaying the research for a couple of months, especially since you can always upgrade planes with your air experience.

It is really unhealthy for you to wait with your 1936 fighter tech until mid 1937. By that time germany would already have an significantly larger number of bf-109 that would negate any slight advantage you'd had over them.

 

[henzington]

I had the same thought with the tanks as well. Germany only had a small amount of Panzer III at the start of ww2.

 

[LordOfWar16]

I had the same thought with the tanks as well. Germany only had a small amount of Panzer III at the start of ww2.

well, thats the good thing about the new system. Either you crank out alot of older stuff and improve on that with variants or convert them into TD/SP-AA/-SPG or you slowly start producing the newer better stuff.

With the molotov-ribbentrop pact germany gets an 100% reduction on the ahead of time penalty or an 50% research bonus if there isnt an ahead of time penalty, tho.