Europe will tremble before the mighty forces of Shiite Japan!
(...once I consolidate these darned islands and westernize.)
Lol how did you mange that in 1474?
Post your Europa Universalis 4 Empire
- Thread starter calvinhobbeslik
- Start date
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Lol how did you mange that in 1474?
Day 1 DoW on Brunei with no CB. Annexed all but one province. This gave me a Sunni majority of about 52%. Sent a missionary to the most rebellious Brunei province to get religious rebels. Accepted demands once they occupied the province and became Sunni. Vassalized Brunei and gave them the provinces back. Immediately afterwards, another DoW with no CB against Shiite Gujarat. I occupied all their provinces and conceded "defeat" by force-converting myself to Shiite in the peace deal.
It actually only works very early on. If you have many provinces at all, the peace cost for force-converting yourself will be above 100%. Also, beware annoying Brunei Nationalists preventing the Sunni Zealot rebels. Harsh treatment for all!
Now my religious unity is tanked, and I am getting Shinto rebels constantly back home. It's going to take a while to convert thanks to the stupid missionary strength malus on Shinto provinces. (What's the historical rationale for that? The Japanese pretty eagerly ate up foreign religions IRL). I assumed the missionary bonus from Piety would be enough, but nope, each province takes 47-100 months. Have to decide now whether to get Religious ideas and wait on Exploration... gotta get those New World gold mines while they're hot (and cheap animist)!
Spain couldn't resist our offer of vassilisation
. For all practical purposes, the game was finished in 1740.The hardest bit was getting to 190 relations with -200 border friction! We had to pull off a bunch of relations tricks to get it that high.
Damn, that looks pretty scary. A Shi'ite Japan. Thanks, I'll definitely try it.
EDIT: Tried and failed. Gujarat somehow became too big early on. Tried again and it worked, thanks to Gujarat being smaller this time.
ATM I'm just persisting with 0 religious unity and striving to get religious ideas. 0 religious unity makes the stability too expensive but I'm almost there to unlock the first idea group... I don't think I'll even bother teching up ADM until I get missionary strength +3%.
Btw, 47-100 months? I can't convert anything at full piety atm... Do you also have +3 stability?
Last edited:
A Shiite Japan does sound fearsome, but the amount of work to get there seems way too much. But still, I'll give it a shot later!
I deciced to play my first EUIV game as a Byzantium on Iroman mode. Then I, not suprisingly, got obliterated at first. And again. And again. Finally, after 15 hours of trying different approaches I overcame starting obstacles, bringing my first war against the Ottomans to a fruitful final. However, that attempt was not the one I was hoping for. I was successful for a long time, too successful for my own good. For details regarding that calamitous chain of events, follow the link (post #9).
From that moment onwards, I've never been truly defeated. I set myself a goal of regaining territories of the Roman Empire in its prime, but due to my insufficient knowledge about the game I wasn't able to achieve it. As to point it out:
1. First 150 years kept me focused on the Ottomans and other countries that mattered in the region, therefore I overlooked France getting PU over Aragon and Portugal getting PU over Castille. Furthermore France acquired some territorries in Italy, so by the time I was able to succesfully DOW them, I had to snatch these provinces in the first place. All these events effectively prevented me from recreating Gaul.
2. Complete lack of knowlegde about the fact, if you sell your vassal a province, then diplo-annex him, you'll gain cores on all his provinces (thanks to the forum, I know now that it is called "vassal feeding).
3. Severe loss of ADM points owing to #2.
4. This is most likely the dumbest one: I had lost a PU over GB once because I didn't bother to maitain positive relations with them (I managed to reestablish it later, but I still have no idea on what premises I based my opinion about PU being unbreakable).
I don't feel about the list above being complete, but those are mine most obvious mistakes. I do plan to start once again in the future in order to finally achieve my goal and given my increased understaning of the game, I firmly believe it's within my reach.
Last edited:
If Gujarat is too big or disappears, there are a few other Shiite Indian minors.
Conversion starts slow, but I eventually have got it up to just 30 or so months per province with just +1 stability and without the +2% missionary Inquisitor advisor. Make sure you hire a theologian even if just for a moment so you can get the Muslim decision with +1% missionary (Establish Sheikh ul-Islam Office). Stay at full piety, get stability out of the negative, and try to get an Inquisitor. My guess is that your stability is deep in the negative from those two wars with no CB.
It gets easier after the first few conversions. Better religious unity > cheaper stability > better missionaries > better religious unity...
I'm around 1485 now and have about 8 Shiite provinces. The tricky part is that my religious unity still stinks because I keep getting more Shinto provinces by annexing vassals.
One possible strategy would be to get some provinces from SE Asian minors, Korea, or Manchu with cores. They will be much easier to convert because they won't have the -2% missionary malus from Shinto/Islam, and you can increase your religious unity more easily.
I did decide I will take Exploration instead of Religious as my first idea group. I am converting at a decent rate for now, and I really want to conquer the Native Americans before Europe does. Plus their animist provinces are super easy to convert and will give more cheap religious unity. Religious will be my #2 idea.
Another good idea would be to take a few provinces in India and SE Asia that can be released as vassals. The vassals will be Shiite, and you can feed them provinces that they will help you convert before being annexed.
A Shiite Japan does sound fearsome, but the amount of work to get there seems way too much. But still, I'll give it a shot later!
A little gamey, yes, but not that hard. I converted to Shiite around 1470 and waited a few more years before taking the image. The only hard part really is getting the initial Sunni rebels in Brunei and making sure there is still a Shiite nation in India that is small enough but hasn't been eaten by Hindus/Timurids.
Last edited:
It did get easier over time, though Shinto rebels made it pretty tough. I just went for religious ideas at the expense of delayed colonization and westernization. Since I have quite a bit of free time these days, I played straight for a while and I'm past 1550. I converted all of Japan and Brunei now.
A funny thing that I noticed is that as long as I'm Shogunate, all my vassals follow the Daimyo rules even if they aren't. Malacca declared war on Aceh, Dai Viet delared war on Khmer. All four are my vassals. I have a bad habit to go over my diplo limit pretty much constantly in all my games, and I think I'll stay Shogunate for the rest of the campaign. It's going to be quite a lot of fun.
One thing I found out weird was that: when I released Daimyos as vassals, they somehow just became independent and I got CB to annex Daimyos (though this didn't happen when I released Khmer.) I did this to culture shift to Malay so that I could form Shi'ite Shogunate of Malaya, but I guess it's just not going to work. I couldn't culture shift even when I made Malay the dominant culture with the capital in Pattani (culturally Malay) and I looked up the decision file and found out Japan wasn't allowed to culture shift. Damn. I had to load the last autosave.
Nifty. I haven't got to play much, so I hope to get further in my game this weekend.
1550 and you haven't annexed all the daimyos? Makes sense if you are hoping to culture shift I suppose. In my game, all the daimyos ate eachother in the first few decades so that there were really only about 4 big ones and 2 or 3 OPMs. It hasn't taken very long to annex them. I think I have 2 scheduled to be annexed in 1491, and then I will own all of Japan minus maybe two provinces. Not sure if I want to do the Unite Japan decision or not--the Shogun government type is actually pretty nice, with the +4 relations for lots of fun with Asian vassals. Feudal monarchy is pretty bland.
That sucks about not getting Malaysia. You could unite Japan and then do it once you change the government type.
Japan is a pretty crappy trade node, so my plan is eventually to move my capital to somewhere in the Ceylon trade node. That way I can collect trade from Japan, China, India, Malaysia, and western Americas in my capital. Then if I put a merchant in the Samarkand node, I will control all the trade from Asia to the western Americas. Then all I have to do is steal trade from Caribbean and Chesapeake to bleed Europe dry before I stomp them.
The plan to culture shift failed as it turned out that I'm not allowed to as Japan. I annexed the Daimyos already, but I wanted to release a few back as vassals to culture shift... they became independents rather than remaining as my vassals, and I couldn't culture convert - completely unexpected. The Shogunate government +4 relationships is awesome, except... I just found out that this happens:
Malacca DoW'd Aceh and Dai Viet DoW'd Khmer. All four are my vassals. It turns out that as long as you're Shogunate, all vassals - regardless of the government type, whether they're Daimyo or not - get the Daimyo rights to declare wars against each other. Take this into consideration as you play with Asian vassals.. Don't make them too near into claim-fabricable-range with each other unless you don't mind vassals fighting a few wars here and there.
Wow, that's a mind-blower. I can't believe it works that way for all vassals. Although I suppose that could be exploited to an extent. If you have one uber-vassal who you feed, he could conquer your other vassals so you have less to diplo-annex and less relations slots...
But how do you make them declare war? And can you join any of those wars?
My Aymara Empire (homo sapiens mod)
Pretty early (~1500) westernization. I took a province from Navarra, cored it, westernized, converted to catholic then sold it back to Navarra (who I made a vassal in the same war I took their land from, Labourd I believe it was)
95% religious unity... doing pretty well, 5 military techs behind the Europeans, but I'll catch up.
My custom ideas are shown, I make sure they are not too OP (Prussia level)
I make them more in between Prussia and Muscovy. Moderately good.
First idea: "Knowledge of the Andes" +1.50 attrition for enemies, -25% attrition for yourself
Second idea: "Spread of Aymara language" -25% core creation cost (I wanted to make it -25% cultural conversion cost, but I couldn't locate a modifier for it)
Third idea: "Aymara Independence Movement" +50% better relations over time
Fourth idea: "Five Thousand Years of Heritage" - +1 yearly prestige
Fifth idea: "Guerilla fighters" +20% manpower recovery speed
Sixth idea: "Leftism" -10% tech cost
Seventh idea: "Developed Socialism" +15% Production efficiency
Final bonus: 25%+ Land forcelimits modifier
Inherent bonuses: -25% stability cost modifier (due to common Aymara language, Aymara dialect being one of the languages spoken by Incan nobility, etc etc)
-1.50 National Revolt risk (see above reasons)
Vassals: Navarra, Alencon (I want to move my capital to Europe eventually) Caete, Querandi, and the pink blob just north of Peru.
Strange happenings: Castille ate Portugal, and Achea resurged after a huge coalition ahniliated the Ottomans, who once reached the Baltic.
Pretty early (~1500) westernization. I took a province from Navarra, cored it, westernized, converted to catholic then sold it back to Navarra (who I made a vassal in the same war I took their land from, Labourd I believe it was)
95% religious unity... doing pretty well, 5 military techs behind the Europeans, but I'll catch up.
My custom ideas are shown, I make sure they are not too OP (Prussia level)
I make them more in between Prussia and Muscovy. Moderately good.
First idea: "Knowledge of the Andes" +1.50 attrition for enemies, -25% attrition for yourself
Second idea: "Spread of Aymara language" -25% core creation cost (I wanted to make it -25% cultural conversion cost, but I couldn't locate a modifier for it)
Third idea: "Aymara Independence Movement" +50% better relations over time
Fourth idea: "Five Thousand Years of Heritage" - +1 yearly prestige
Fifth idea: "Guerilla fighters" +20% manpower recovery speed
Sixth idea: "Leftism" -10% tech cost
Seventh idea: "Developed Socialism" +15% Production efficiency
Final bonus: 25%+ Land forcelimits modifier
Inherent bonuses: -25% stability cost modifier (due to common Aymara language, Aymara dialect being one of the languages spoken by Incan nobility, etc etc)
-1.50 National Revolt risk (see above reasons)
Vassals: Navarra, Alencon (I want to move my capital to Europe eventually) Caete, Querandi, and the pink blob just north of Peru.
Strange happenings: Castille ate Portugal, and Achea resurged after a huge coalition ahniliated the Ottomans, who once reached the Baltic.
Uhh, those are all pretty much straight better than the best anyone else has for any category.
Because I, unlike Paradox, design things into my game with fun in mind.
Next on the chopping block - The Peseant's War. LOL, deleted.
I really shouldn't play France because...France. I mean...France. Well nobody's perfect.
Seriously though, those are some pretty borders.
Time to head off to asia and reform the mongol empire as the one true mongol khanate.
Seriously though, those are some pretty borders.
Time to head off to asia and reform the mongol empire as the one true mongol khanate.
That's one badass Zhou/Shun/Xia/whatever in china. Also Britannia in North america must be one though sunavabirch.
I finished my first game from start to finish.
The last thing I did before the game was over was taking Macau and feeding a puppet Korea its cores for fun.
The last thing I did before the game was over was taking Macau and feeding a puppet Korea its cores for fun.
They will just declare wars on their own if they can. If the normal Daimyo rules are applying to them, they can't declare wars against non-vasals. That is, not only that Dai Viet won't DoW much bigger Ayutthya on their own, they'd be incapable of doing so. So, if you leave two uneven sized vassals next to each other, the big one will eventually eat up the smaller one because that will be the only war they can declare (other than independence against the Shogunate).
You can use enforce peace option to join the war on the defensive side, but that will make you lose vassalage over the larger one. Again, assuming full Daimyo rules are in place. A Daimyo gets fully independent if they fight a war with the Shogunate and the Shogunate gets 'Annex Daimyo' CB againt them either to conquer them directly or vassalize them, assuming they aren't too big to do so. I'm checking the game data, 'Annex Daimyo' requires them to be a Daimyo. So, if you join the war on one side, and enforce white peace, the attacker will probably be left independent and you're not going to get a special Shogunate CB to get them back. If you fed a vassal too much that their warscore goes over 100%, then there's nothing you can do since you won't be able to bring them back under vassalage in one war.
So.. the problem might be that if a vassal may get too big for your comfort. As far as I can see, my non-Daimyo vassals don't have the 'Overthrow Shogunate' CB yet and this requires them to be Daimyo and the target Shogunate. So, I'm still assuming that there is a low risk even if I end up creating a mega vassal and I just need to be careful that I'm still bigger than them if I want to be able to annex them properly.
So maybe there isn't much of a problem, except: you cannot initiate annexation while the subject is at war. I can go to Ming right now and start feeding Zhou, Xi and Shun. The problem: in 2-3 wars the vassals will get big and likely border each other or other vassals (Tibet or Dai Viet). I wouldn't really mind if Zhou wants to take Dai Viet, but a prolonged war between Shun and Zhou might just drag on and deplete them while I could use their armies for something more useful. Remaining as a Shogunate certainly adds more things to consider...
I really shouldn't play France because...France. I mean...France. Well nobody's perfect.
Seriously though, those are some pretty borders.
Time to head off to asia and reform the mongol empire as the one true mongol khanate.
Beware the French Hordes!