Portuguese Focus Tree changes & in depth focuses and mechanics

[LORDoflisbon]

Well in the past few days we have gained additional information in the for of a twitch stream by Da9l (Daniel Sjöberg) and Manuel (Content Designer) ( https://www.twitch.tv/videos/547212207 ) has well as 2 youtube videos one of the after mention stream ( A ) and of of the Feature Highlight ( B ).
A -

B -

So I took some prints of the focuses effects (somewhere complicated to read so I won't put them here, the quality isn't the best either) and some other information.

Disclaimer things might change

1 - Differences between Portugal now and Portugal in La Resistance at game start.
- Now Portugal starts with 3 research slots in, La Resistance it starts with 2 (can go up to 5)
- Factories Now

10,

2,

2, La Resistance

11,

2,

3
- Resources Now

0,

0,

0,

2,

0,

302, La Resistance

0,

32,

0,

2,

2,

290
- Military stays the same

2- Starting national spirits and leader

So Salazar counters the Unstable Republic and you only end up losing some political power which isn't that bad
And the army as some penalties but nothing major

3 - With that out of the way we can now talk about the Focus Tree

3.1 - The Army Branch

The Army Branch was expanded

The Field Maneuvers , Tropas Paraqueidistas (correct spelling = Tropas Paraquedistas) and Regimento de Comandos are the focuses that were added in this branch.
The focus effects for the Army Reorganization and Metropolitan Army are as followed

3.2- The Ultramar Branch (Colonial Branch)

I Still belive that the Colonial branch should only be acessable after the Army Reorganization focus do to the historical fact that wen Salazar rose to power the assimilation policy was only reinvigorated after the army was Reorganized and the reason for that was to avoid complications with the ultramarin (colonial) forces.

The focus effects for the Ultramar Branch (Colonial Branch) are as followed

The Integrate Angola and Integrate Mozambique decisions most likely adds cores to the region.
Note that Angola has been divided in two states north and south
With this colonial investments portugal has access to all resources (though in small amounts)

3.3- Industrial Branch

It's possible that the Military Research Facilities may need a certain amount of

so that you can gain an additional research slot like in the Naval Research Institute focus.

The focus effects for the Industrial Branch are as followed

Industrial Modernization and A new Industry focuses give long term bonus (reasherd bonus and construction speed ) while the Food Industries and Textile Industries give a short term bonus (civilian factories)

3.4- Naval Branch

The focus effects for the Naval Branch are as followed

One thing that I'm curious about is if the AI will build up to 15

so it can unlock an additional research slot.

3.5- Political Branches

- Communist Branch

The focus effects for the Communist Branch are as followed

The focuses above can be taken by the Democratic path, but they lead to incresd communist support.
So you can join the Comintern and have recised helped from the british or you can join the allies after natiolazin your industry and unifying the left wings wich adds some replayability.

Low Stability leads to a civil war, this happens to all the paths when trying to remove Unstable Republic, the historical path is the only exception.

- Democratic Branch

Note portuguese Democrats weren't that big on the british do to the pink map and ww1 (which were relatively recent incident, 40 years prior) so they siding with them is do to necessity instead of friendship

The focus effects for the Democratic Branch are as followed

The focuses above can be taken by the Communist path, but they lead to decreased communist support in the short term.
More

(

is love

is life)
A little weird that the British Guns focus only allows to purchase Anti-Air and Anti-Tank (It makes sense economically do to portugal huge

reserves but still portugal purchased and add licenses from many other british (and american) weapons like planes and tanks).

YES CIVIL WAR BECAUSE FREE ELECTIONS ARE BAD (i'm being sarcastic it makes sense why a civil war would happen if the nation wasn't stable i just wanted to write that phrase)

The Iberian Summit should have Proposals to join other European Factions Like The Pact of Rome or The Little Entente

- Historical Branch

The focus effects for the Historical Branch are as followed

The focuses above are also from the fascist path

Wow portugal actually receives a bonus to espionage Cool

Historical path YES FINALLY
Interestingly the Honor Anglo-Portuguese Alliance does not remove the Unstable Republic but because Proudly Alone Let's you go to war against Japan and Japan will probably be fighting the Allies so you can probably join them (Allies) anyway because of that war and you can later declare war on the USSR while the Honor only let's you fight the Axis and join the Research charing bonus.

- Fascist Branch

The focus effects for the Fascist Branch are as followed

The Fifth Empire focus should probably rename portugal to simply The Fifth Empire the way it currently changes the name can lead to some people (Da9l) to think that portugal was in their fifth attempt to EMPIRE, like the french are to REPUBLIC

- Monarchist Branch

The focus effects for the Monarchist Branch are as followed

I have a couple of problams with the monarchist path

1º-

The fact that because there isn't a monachist ideolagy you need to have Brasil turn facist and name it Integralist Brazil while Vargas is in power, the man that eradicated the movement (Integralism) makes no sense.

Add a Monarchist Ideology let's be honest theres a lot of monarchist in Hoi4 that can reemerge
Other solotions, make vargas stop being in power, or change the name of Integralist Brazil to The Brazilian Republic or The Third Brazilian Republic

2º-

Why is the capital of the UKPB still Lisbon and not Rio de Janeiro It makes no sense why the people of brazil would be okay with basically being annexed after just "losing" a war ,I say "losing" because guerilla warfare would be the most likely outcome even if the army had surrendered, but with the capital in Rio de Janeiro the people might eventually be more willing to accept the new status quo

3º-

Why is the Colour scheme of The Portuguese Empire in the color of the Republic instead of the blue and white from the portuguese monarchy or green and yellow from the brazilian monarchy.

---

4 - Political Advisors

More and different (AKA not having 4 captains of industry for every ideology) political advisors

5 - Collaboration Governments

So some people didn't really understand how collaborative governments work

1º- Any nation owns a state but doesn't have cores in that state while another nation does have cores in sed state can create a Collaboration Governments, like Portuguese China based in Macau or Italian Greece based on Rhodes

2º- Collaboration Governments are created when Compliance is high enough (80% if I'm not mistaken)

3º- They have cores in all states that the former has like chinese Collaboration Governments have cores in all of china

And that's the basic of Collaboration Governments

Now my problem is this, there are regions that are only owned and not cored by no one wish means no Collaboration Governments can be created the majority of them are island no problem but since the tags for the pacific were added one extra tag that could be added would de West Timor or you could add an indonesian core to the state of West Timor but I don't recommend it do to the indonesian occupation of the nation in recent history.

6 - Art work

Portugal will apperintly have no unique generals or unique unit sprites

Which is a little disappointing, I hope that a patch will add some after La Resistance comes out

 

[pvt.conners]

Nice work compiling all of this.
Seems like a solid tree overall.

 

[Enriador]

Great analysis, loved the commentary.

A few things:

Add a Monarchist Ideology let's be honest theres a lot of monarchist in Hoi4

I prefer the tried-and-true Victoria 2 terminology, "Reactionary". Including monarchists and republicans.

the man that eradicated the movement (Integralism) makes no sense.

Vargas wasn't fascist, but I can see him taking on a more hardline stance if he saw his grip on power challenged. Though to be honest a monarchist uprising in 1930s Brazil is utterly bizarre to begin with.

Why is the capital of the UKPB still Lisbon and not Rio de Janeiro It makes no sense why the people of brazil would be okay with basically being annexed after just "losing" a war ,I say "losing" because guerilla warfare would be the most likely out came even if the army had surrendered, but with the capital in Rio de Janeiro the people might eventually be more willing to accept the new status quo

That's a pretty good point! It bugs me how the Brazilian emperor just leaves his throne and Brazil bows down to the much smaller and weaker Portuguese in exchange for... nothing?

Changing the capital to Rio de Janeiro would make perfect sense not only because it *was* their capital last time Portugal-Brazil was a thing, but also due to it being closer to the Portuguese colonial empire. Also pretty flavorful!

 

[Duke_Dave]

I'd like to be able to choose make it an interesting choice (choose Rio for higher stability and war support or Lisbon for extra factories or something), same with Austria Hungary I would like to choose where to put my capital.

 

[UlulvarCape]

The fact that because there isn't a monachist ideolagy you need to have Brasil turn facist and name it Integralist Brazil while Vargas is in power, the man that eradicated the movement (Integralism) makes no sense.

Honestly, they just need to add in a monarchist ideology next dlc. Badly. At this point, it doesn't make sense now considering they are forced to turn a non-aligned country to FASCIST in order to even work it. (Except I do get what Enriador says, but it doesn't change my opinion.)

Why is the capital of the UKPB still Lisbon and not Rio de Janeiro It makes no sense why the people of brazil would be okay with basically being annexed after just "losing" a war ,I say "losing" because guerilla warfare would be the most likely out came even if the army had surrendered, but with the capital in Rio de Janeiro the people might eventually be more willing to accept the new status quo

Duarte II marries Maria Francisca of Orléans-Braganza, Portuguese King marries Brazilian Princess. Just going to be real here, I don't think that's still a good idea for that, but alright.[/QUOTE]

 

[DystopianAlphaOmega]

Well Lisbon was technically the last capital of Portugal-Brazil. Of course moving it back to Lisbon was part of the inciting events that kicked off Brazil’s separation, but still. The option to choose either sounds like a good idea.

As an aside, I hope that a player playing Brazil gets some options on how to respond to these Portuguese focuses. For example, supporting the monarchist cause or refusing annexation later.

 

[LORDoflisbon]

Great analysis, loved the commentary.

A few things:



I prefer the tried-and-true Victoria 2 terminology, "Reactionary". Including monarchists and republicans.



Vargas wasn't fascist, but I can see him taking on a more hardline stance if he saw his grip on power challenged. Though to be honest a monarchist uprising in 1930s Brazil is utterly bizarre to begin with.



That's a pretty good point! It bugs me how the Brazilian emperor just leaves his throne and Brazil bows down to the much smaller and weaker Portuguese in exchange for... nothing?

Changing the capital to Rio de Janeiro would make perfect sense not only because it *was* their capital last time Portugal-Brazil was a thing, but also due to it being closer to the Portuguese colonial empire. Also pretty flavorful!

1- I just used the term "Monarchist Ideology" because it would be a short term solution, the devs have said repeatedly that they want to change how the ideology mechanics work

2- Your statement is correct, my only problem is the name of the faction that Vargas becomes in charge and the name of the nation itself.
AIB stands for Ação Integralista Brasileira witch means Brazilian Integralist Action and Brazil is called Integralist Brazil, this is my problem it's simply the name of the faction and the nation or they change the name of both or they take Vargas out, the former being the better option

3- Technically he would realistically still have quite a bit of influence in new nation most likely being a importante figure in brazil, while brazil it self would gain access to the portuguese ultramarin possession (colonies) with the brazilian economy could invest in.
Note the UKPB would be far more influential in global politics if it existed.
So there are some benefits for merging the two nations, not many but some, if the nation had as a national spirit related to Pedro Henrique of Orléans-Braganza or the Brazilian Influence it would make it more realistic

 

[LORDoflisbon]

Honestly, they just need to add in a monarchist ideology next dlc. Badly. At this point, it doesn't make sense now considering they are forced to turn a non-aligned country to FASCIST in order to even work it. (Except I do get what Enriador says, but it doesn't change my opinion.)



Duarte II marries Maria Francisca of Orléans-Braganza, Portuguese King marries Brazilian Princess. Just going to be real here, I don't think that's still a good idea for that, but alright.

1-At this point you can basically turn half of the world monarchist if it was an ideology it would be easier to deal with.
They could even separate Non-Aligned into Monarchies, Authoritarian and Republican has that is basically all of the "ideologies" that Non-Aligned covers.

2- It's just an idea if you have any suggestion of how to change it please do let me know.

 

[LORDoflisbon]

Well Lisbon was technically the last capital of Portugal-Brazil. Of course moving it back to Lisbon was part of the inciting events that kicked off Brazil’s separation, but still. The option to choose either sounds like a good idea.

As an aside, I hope that a player playing Brazil gets some options on how to respond to these Portuguese focuses. For example, supporting the monarchist cause or refusing annexation later.

1- True but the capital was originally change back to portugal to avoid a rebellion/civil war in portugal (Liberal Revolution of 1820).

2- A player playing as Brazil will probably have the option, they are events after all.

 

[Iskulya]

Honestly, they just need to add in a monarchist ideology next dlc. Badly. At this point, it doesn't make sense now considering they are forced to turn a non-aligned country to FASCIST in order to even work it. (Except I do get what Enriador says, but it doesn't change my opinion.)

Nah, monarchism isn't an ideology.

There have been liberal-democratic monarchies. There have been fascist monarchies. Medieval monarchies. Ancient monarchies. Even Ferdinand Lassalle(whose ADAV provided the organizational basis of the German SPD) proposed a socialist monarchy. Monarchism is always a subordinate aspect of a really total and holistic ideological system. This is why it has existed across thousands of years of history in radically different forms and contexts. By itself, it is not, and cannot be, a complete ideological system.

This idea that monarchism itself is a fully fledged ideology mostly comes from, I think, teenagers whose main knowledge of history comes from Kaiserreich memes. I think it's great that even a video game can make kids interested in history, but we also really need to distinguish actual history from fiction that exists in video games. What you pick up from a video game should only ever be the starting point of an interest in history. You have to pick up some actual history books to really learn, and I encourage that.

Most non-aligned monarchies in Hearts of Iron 4 represent what I would call a fascistic(as opposed to fascist) movement. A reactionary ideology based on corporatism rooted in the upper classes in alliance with the middle classes that adopts elements of a fascist political program to pre-empt a threat to the upper class from both genuine fascist and communist movements. Others were outright fascist, like the French and Brazilian integralists. Of course not even professional historians can actually agree on what fascism is because there is no consistent framework for understanding political ideology that all or even most historians can agree upon, but that is another story.

 

[Duarte]

Well Lisbon was technically the last capital of Portugal-Brazil. Of course moving it back to Lisbon was part of the inciting events that kicked off Brazil’s separation, but still. The option to choose either sounds like a good idea.

As an aside, I hope that a player playing Brazil gets some options on how to respond to these Portuguese focuses. For example, supporting the monarchist cause or refusing annexation later.

the question of the capital was one of the more irrelevant ones at the time, the fact that Portugal wanted to reduce Brazil to the status of a colony and deprive it of important state functions(courts of law) and freedom of trade was waht made the OG united kingdom untenable

 

[Duarte]

snip

for my money considering the potential situation in brazil, the new united kingdom is allmost feudal in nature, with the coroneis and empowered federal states, being actually in support of the new capital being in Lisbon, since that means less oversight, in reality the new united kingdom would be federal with each sate being almost a law onto it'self, so a national spirit to represent this highly decentralized nature would not go a miss

 

[LORDoflisbon]

Nah, monarchism isn't an ideology.

There have been liberal-democratic monarchies. There have been fascist monarchies. Medieval monarchies. Ancient monarchies. Even Ferdinand Lassalle(whose ADAV provided the organizational basis of the German SPD) proposed a socialist monarchy. Monarchism is always a subordinate aspect of a really total and holistic ideological system. This is why it has existed across thousands of years of history in radically different forms and contexts. By itself, it is not, and cannot be, a complete ideological system.

This idea that monarchism itself is a fully fledged ideology mostly comes from, I think, teenagers whose main knowledge of history comes from Kaiserreich memes. I think it's great that even a video game can make kids interested in history, but we also really need to distinguish actual history from fiction that exists in video games. What you pick up from a video game should only ever be the starting point of an interest in history. You have to pick up some actual history books to really learn, and I encourage that.

Most non-aligned monarchies in Hearts of Iron 4 represent what I would call a fascistic(as opposed to fascist) movement. A reactionary ideology based on corporatism rooted in the upper classes in alliance with the middle classes that adopts elements of a fascist political program to pre-empt a threat to the upper class from both genuine fascist and communist movements. Others were outright fascist, like the French and Brazilian integralists. Of course not even professional historians can actually agree on what fascism is because there is no consistent framework for understanding political ideology that all or even most historians can agree upon, but that is another story.

1- You are correct Monarchies are simply a form of ruling a country where one individual is the head of state until death (or abdication).

2-True but no ideology in Hoi4 is a true ideology they are just a group of similar political ideals, what I mean is that in the game there a radically different political parties ideals being grouped in one category.

3- The problem with history books is that the history tends to be twisted by the victors, and some specific world events don't have a wide translation range (asian history books come to mind they are pretty rare in english or simple in another language different than the language said nation speeches).
Note: Kaiserreich is a really good mod I do recommend it.

4-In the time period the game is seth the monarchies were or authoritarian regimes or constitutional regimes and in game the majority of monarchies that can be imposed tend to be the former, so while saying that monarchism is an ideology is incorrect in the real world, in game it could pass has the majority of them are ideologically similar to one another (authoritarian regimes).

So what I'm trying to say is that you are correct and I don't know why I wrote this.

 

[Enriador]

Well Lisbon was technically the last capital of Portugal-Brazil. Of course moving it back to Lisbon was part of the inciting events that kicked off Brazil’s separation, but still.

De jure yes, but not de facto. By the time the Cortes moved the capital back to Lisbon tensions were quite high, to the point Brazilians didn't recognize the Cortes' authority in the first place.

AIB stands for Ação Integralista Brasileira witch means Brazilian Integralist Action and Brazil is called Integralist Brazil, this is my problem it's simply the name of the faction and the nation or they change the name of both or they take Vargas out, the former being the better option

I understand now. Indeed, Integralist Vargas doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

Technically he would realistically still have quite a bit of influence in new nation most likely being a importante figure in brazil, while brazil it self would gain access to the portuguese ultramarin possession (colonies) with the brazilian economy could invest in.
Note the UKPB would be far more influential in global politics if it existed.
So there are some benefits for merging the two nations, not many but some, if the nation had as a national spirit related to Pedro Henrique of Orléans-Braganza or the Brazilian Influence it would make it more realistic

He could be Emperor. Having "influence" in a larger empire can't match that.

I will headcanon that Duarte will recognize Pedro as his heir, an arrangement seem elsewhere in history (such as the English Anarchy). Duarte didn't have any heirs until 1945.

 

[LORDoflisbon]

for my money considering the potential situation in brazil, the new united kingdom is allmost feudal in nature, with the coroneis and empowered federal states, being actually in support of the new capital being in Lisbon, since that means less oversight, in reality the new united kingdom would be federal with each sate being almost a law onto it'self, so a national spirit to represent this highly decentralized nature would not go a miss

So what you are saying is a national spirit like for example Organic Kingdom.

 

[Duarte]

De jure yes, but not de facto. By the time the Cortes moved the capital back to Lisbon tensions were quite high, to the point Brazilians didn't recognize the Cortes' authority in the first place.

exaggeration, the brazillians where initially quite happy with the new cortes, to the point they sent a delegation to participate in the constitutional process, the issue is that delegation was laughed out of the room by the liberals, thought true tensions were high by that point and escalted further when the demands of the liberals where made public

 

[Duarte]

So what you are saying is a national spirit like for example Organic Kingdom.

considering the restoration of the united kingdom was a "out there" goal of both the brazilain and lusitanian integralists that is the perfect name
(to add to this the fact that the anti monarchist brazill is called integralist is confusing to all hell to me)

 

[Enriador]

the brazillians where initially quite happy with the new cortes

Naturally, as they too wished for a liberal arrangement in the United Kingdom. But as you said, disagreements soon became too apparent and their authority to rule over Brazil's provinces was then considered null and void.

 

[Duarte]

Naturally, as they too wished for a liberal arrangement in the United Kingdom. But as you said, disagreements soon became too apparent and their authority to rule over Brazil's provinces was then considered null and void.

boy the insomnia is really keeping me up today. What yuo say is true I was not disagreeing with you in that regard merely with the "by the time the cortes moved the capital" part, the cortes had moved the capital before the union became untenable, it absolute terms what killed the union where the liberals plans for Brazil, fun fact the absolutists where ok with brazillian autonomy, yet for some reason most assume it was the other way around

 

[Vicar of Christ]

Would the Fifth Empire national focus break puppet status of protugal?