Poland ideas

[Riekopo]

I just watched this video about Poland in WW2. Makes you understand how screwed they were. Completely surrounded on all sides by stronger enemies.

Apparently the Vistula river was dried up from a drought when they were invaded. So maybe during that time period it shouldn't give the normal defense bonuses of a river. Also, we need Armored Trains. Apparently they fought in like 90 or so battles in Poland. Guess we need a Rail network for that though.

Also, a Mobilization mechanic really needs to be added. It's really bizarre that the Devs made a WW2 grand strategy game and didn't include a realistic Mobilization mechanic. The way they have the game now with huge armies just standing around all over the country all the time is total fantasy.

Once the war was going on yes, but not before and not in the beginning stages. Soldiers were at home as civilians doing civilian work. They had to be called up and mobilized. Which could take weeks if not months. And after all the reservists were mobilized new men had to be trained.

Countries that could mobilize faster had an advantage. Countries with large reserves of trained men had an advantage.

 

[CantGetNoSleep]

Also, a Mobilization mechanic really needs to be added. It's really bizarre that the Devs made a WW2 grand strategy game and didn't include a realistic Mobilization mechanic. The way they have the game now with huge armies just standing around all over the country all the time is total fantasy.

Agreed. Most countries mobilized pretty quickly once things started to kick off. Sure, the units where "green", but France had 2.5mm front-line troops in days, Belgium fielded 600,000 men in a couple of months in late 1939, Poland did the same, etc. Even Switzerland mobilized 850,000 men at the peak.

In the game, you get 0.01% increase in manpower a day when you have 100% war support, so to go from 2.5% manpower to 5% manpower will take you 250 days, which is daft. And as a democracy, you can't mobilize at all until you're actually at war - them justifying isn't enough. It's ridiculous.

 

[KDEstroy]

Agreed. Most countries mobilized pretty quickly once things started to kick off. Sure, the units where "green", but France had 2.5mm front-line troops in days, Belgium fielded 600,000 men in a couple of months in late 1939, Poland did the same, etc. Even Switzerland mobilized 850,000 men at the peak.

In the game, you get 0.01% increase in manpower a day when you have 100% war support, so to go from 2.5% manpower to 5% manpower will take you 250 days, which is daft. And as a democracy, you can't mobilize at all until you're actually at war - them justifying isn't enough. It's ridiculous.

Actually, it only takes about 194 days to mobilize at 100% war support. You get 0.012 % increase in manpower per day. Also, this represents mobilizing 2.5% of your country's entire population, in addition to another 2.5% of population who were presumably already soldiers. In the case of France, this would represent mobilizing 1.1 million people, in addition to 1.1 million troops already trained. That's still a bit slower than RL, but the numbers aren't off by that much, and either way it wouldn't have made a difference because Dunkirk happened more than 8 months after France went to war.

 

[CantGetNoSleep]

Actually, it only takes about 194 days to mobilize at 100% war support. You get 0.012 % increase in manpower per day. Also, this represents mobilizing 2.5% of your country's entire population, in addition to another 2.5% of population who were presumably already soldiers. In the case of France, this would represent mobilizing 1.1 million people, in addition to 1.1 million troops already trained. That's still a bit slower than RL, but the numbers aren't off by that much, and either way it wouldn't have made a difference because Dunkirk happened more than 8 months after France went to war.

Point granted on the 0.012%, not - 0.01% - it makes a difference - but then you also need to add back training time which even if you're a guru of training and deploy at 20% trained, will likely take you back to something over 200 days for your entire army to be fielded. And if you're talking about France, the war support on loading a 1939 "historical" game, is only 56% so you're back to 250 days or so, and with all the debuffs paradox has given it now, it can't actually mobilize anything like the forces it had in real life.

That being said, it's neither here not there. The point @Riekopo is making, and I am agreeing with, is that mobilization, if you have a conscription army, takes days - a couple of weeks at most - not 6 months. There's little doubt Dunkirk would have happened in December if France had taken 6 months to mobilise.

I think done properly it could actually work well from a game perspective - a conscription army should be green, so easily defeated by well trained troops - that's exactly what happened in real life. When German elite spearheads broke through the Ardennes, they faced France's worst troops and smashed through them with ease.

 

[Fulmen]

The way they have the game now with huge armies just standing around all over the country all the time is total fantasy.

And in some cases this was fantasy even during the war. E.g. Finland was partially demobilised 1942-44, and I recall reading Germany also demobilised a bit after the Fall of France, until Barbarossa drew closer.

 

[DukofDeth]

They used to have a mobilization mechanic in HoI3 - don't know about the earlier editions. You had the option of building full-strength units, gobbling up your current manpower or building mobilization units, where one to two thirds would be called up, so then it was a trick as to when to mobilize, as that sent a signal to one's neighbors. IRL, Germany is said ot have called its army out for annual summer training, and then not sent them home, thus reducing the time Poland had to get ready once they knew what was coming.