Tarroque

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For the sake of seeing the real-world situation that Paradox had to work with, this is a chart I found after a quick search detailing the per capita economies of interwar Europe, including the Baltic states:
interwar baltic economies chart.png


They did see some progress between '29 and '38 though perhaps not as much as the in-game focus trees would have liked.
 
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Fulmen

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As it stands, the current shared Baltic industrial focus tree is extremely overpowered.

What, you never heard of the Estonian economic miracle where they increased their heavy industrial base by 125% in two months, putting the German and Japanese economic miracles to shame? Don't worry, me neither.
 
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Leducky

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It's probably meant to allow the players to actually be able to do something.
This is what I am thinking, it makes them playable for those who want to play in this geographic area and has no impact on historical mode.

The beauty of these alternate trees is that they bring diversity to those who want to experience different countries in single player. I am all for it.
 
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TalyonUngol

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This is what I am thinking, it makes them playable for those who want to play in this geographic area and has no impact on historical mode.

The beauty of these alternate trees is that they bring diversity to those who want to experience different countries in single player. I am all for it.

I do understand why people are upset about it in terms of realism, but they also do not actually -want- true realism. They may think they do, but they don't.
 
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Eltener

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It's probably meant to allow the players to actually be able to do something.
yeah, let's give Bhutan 20 extra factories and 2000 weekly manpower as well. While we're at it, Liberia should be able to core all of Africa, Tannu Tuva should be able to reverse uno the USSR and annex them instead and Mengkukuo should be able to peacefully unify all of China with 10 pp decisions.
 
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cotne22

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I do understand why people are upset about it in terms of realism, but they also do not actually -want- true realism. They may think they do, but they don't.
I understand that everyone has a different definition of what is playable, but this is getting ridiculous. The devs already made minors more powerful than they were historically, which is understandable from a gameplay perspective, but this goes too far. If your definition of playable means being able to 1v1 a major, then just play on civilian.
 
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qer

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I do understand why people are upset about it in terms of realism, but they also do not actually -want- true realism. They may think they do, but they don't.
Well, one thing is some buffs, and another thing entirely is to give nations the power of the ancient aliens because if not they aren't "fun". I know that I'am in a minority here, but I wouldn't mind if the Baltic countries were "unplayable" with historical focus on, because that was the problem they were facing: they simply didn't have the manpower nor the industry to be able to stay independent.
 
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Bandua_of_Gallaecia

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For the sake of seeing the real-world situation that Paradox had to work with, this is a chart I found after a quick search detailing the per capita economies of interwar Europe, including the Baltic states:
View attachment 778190

They did see some progress between '29 and '38 though perhaps not as much as the in-game focus trees would have liked.
F for sPain
 

Leducky

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Even so, 40 factories for a Baltic nation is a it much.
Maybe just reduce it to ~20 and call it a day. It's still highly OP but it isn't "entirely new Belgian Industry" OP.
Out of context it feels like a bit much, but considering that this Baltic nation is sandwiched between the USSR, Germany, and Poland, I feel that it is appropriate.
 
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Rashie

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For the sake of seeing the real-world situation that Paradox had to work with, this is a chart I found after a quick search detailing the per capita economies of interwar Europe, including the Baltic states:
View attachment 778190

They did see some progress between '29 and '38 though perhaps not as much as the in-game focus trees would have liked.
The GDP of the nation as a whole would be more useful data here as it pertains to the amount of industry on a national level specifically, per capita doesn’t take into account that Estonia has a much smaller population than some of the other countries, which in the real world drastically impacts overall production output.
 
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TalyonUngol

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That is better done via formable nations, not via so ahistorical factory increases

and some formable nations are utter garbage, like the United Balkans one doesn't do a damn thing. You get maybe, one full army with the united balkans. Its not much at all.

yeah, let's give Bhutan 20 extra factories and 2000 weekly manpower as well. While we're at it, Liberia should be able to core all of Africa, Tannu Tuva should be able to reverse uno the USSR and annex them instead and Mengkukuo should be able to peacefully unify all of China with 10 pp decisions.

Yikes. Nice fallacy there pal.

I understand that everyone has a different definition of what is playable, but this is getting ridiculous. The devs already made minors more powerful than they were historically, which is understandable from a gameplay perspective, but this goes too far. If your definition of playable means being able to 1v1 a major, then just play on civilian.

1 v 1 a major... What major will they be able to 1 v 1 with the little manpower they have? Are you talking about in the end game where they can form the Nordic Union and maybe fight Britain or France? Sorry, but I dont see how the Baltics can 1 v 1 a major at all, considering their manpower is absolutely garbage.

Well, one thing is some buffs, and another thing entirely is to give nations the power of the ancient aliens because if not they aren't "fun". I know that I'am in a minority here, but I wouldn't mind if the Baltic countries were "unplayable" with historical focus on, because that was the problem they were facing: they simply didn't have the manpower nor the industry to be able to stay independent.

I'd think the AI should be useless with historical focus on, sure, but not the player.
 
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Tarroque

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The GDP of the nation as a whole would be more useful data here as it pertains to the amount of industry on a national level specifically, per capita doesn’t take into account that Estonia has a much smaller population than some of the other countries, which in the real world drastically impacts overall production output.

I know it's not ideal (and do share if you have a better one) but it does contain the key data that I feel should guide the design team's efforts, namely the relative increase between '29 and '38 of the GDP per capita. Knowing that, it should then be easy to look at a given nation's starting industry and know "what is the reasonable relative increase that we should keep within sight of?" While the Baltic states clearly did see an improvement, it was clearly not the economic miracle that plays out with the current focus tree design.