Please fix this game.

[afghanrabbit]

I haven't been on here in a while but I felt I needed to come vent my frustrations. The last three games I have tried to play have ended in a rage quit at the complete lack of AI intelligence both in my division command and the AI. I will not go into the opponent AI control as this is a well documented issue. However, in each of my last three games the AI has failed to properly position my troops on the front I assign. And before you ask no I am not over extending them. It seems to get worse once the fighting kicks off as multiple divisions will just leave gaps in my lines to go join battles or constantly reposition themselves. It has made the game unplayable for me. I expected things to get better with the patches and DLCs but it has only gotten worse. Please fix this game. It is my favorite but it is quickly becoming unbearable.

Also has something changed with unit org? My previously good German divisions were just getting melted by Polish and Lithuanian divisions this last go round.

 

[Dalwin]

I haven't been on here in a while but I felt I needed to come vent my frustrations. The last three games I have tried to play have ended in a rage quit at the complete lack of AI intelligence both in my division command and the AI. I will not go into the opponent AI control as this is a well documented issue. However, in each of my last three games the AI has failed to properly position my troops on the front I assign. And before you ask no I am not over extending them. It seems to get worse once the fighting kicks off as multiple divisions will just leave gaps in my lines to go join battles or constantly reposition themselves. It has made the game unplayable for me. I expected things to get better with the patches and DLCs but it has only gotten worse. Please fix this game. It is my favorite but it is quickly becoming unbearable.

Also has something changed with unit org? My previously good German divisions were just getting melted by Polish and Lithuanian divisions this last go round.

You need to slow down and take a breath.

Also if you had been around and reading the dev comments for the last couple of weeks, you'd have noticed the AI programmer saying there is major improvement to the battle plan shuffle problem coming in 1.4. It is apparently a noticeable enough improvement that when he plays with other people using the current version that you and I have, he misses the improvement.

And no, nothing has changed with org. What you are noticing is that the AI is now using better division templates against you than it used to.

 

[KruppSteel]

Hopefully they will preview it next week during the 'World War Wednesday' episode. For now I find the best thing to do is micro your advances. It may be tedious for many players but it's the current reality. Perhaps select the least aggressive option as well, for the battle plan advance, gives you some more time to pick and choose where to advance as your units are slightly more passive (in my experience).

*Note that when I use the battle plan(s) it seems to work fine, just never use it when you are garrisoning say the Maginot line - utilize the 'guard/garrison mode' ability with only the forts option ticked.

 

[Misaka_Complex]

There has been minor improvements to the AI but overall the AI is still quite bad. Perhaps its gonna see bigger improvements such as the Japanese AI being able to take the DEI and British Malaya when they join WW2 eventually but its probably gonna take a few more years.

 

[Gefallener_Held]

I haven't been on here in a while but I felt I needed to come vent my frustrations. The last three games I have tried to play have ended in a rage quit at the complete lack of AI intelligence both in my division command and the AI. I will not go into the opponent AI control as this is a well documented issue. However, in each of my last three games the AI has failed to properly position my troops on the front I assign. And before you ask no I am not over extending them. It seems to get worse once the fighting kicks off as multiple divisions will just leave gaps in my lines to go join battles or constantly reposition themselves. It has made the game unplayable for me. I expected things to get better with the patches and DLCs but it has only gotten worse. Please fix this game. It is my favorite but it is quickly becoming unbearable.

Also has something changed with unit org? My previously good German divisions were just getting melted by Polish and Lithuanian divisions this last go round.

I must say I have the same feeling. I spent a bit of time learning to play the game, before learning that I really do need Expert AI because the British left Suez canal undefended. With Expert AI, it was left lightly defended but I took France in March 40 so maybe it was historical.

I really want to like this game, and there are things I love. I love that you cannot just upgrade earlier equipment but have to produce newer technologies and build production efficiency to a point where you can cancel the old stuff. Its great that instead of having militia units, you modify units by selecting what equipment they receive and the training leve. And I love having synthetic plants. I am not sure what else this game gets right though Aside from the AI (I never used batleplanner except for paradrops and amphibious landings), problems include:

--whacked naval warfare. Naval battles last weeks not just days, and that is just one of the problems. Battle of Atlantic and submarine warfare seems so bad I have even more doubts it can be fixed at all.

-- erroneous tech trees. Bismarck and Typve VII, Stuka 87 G are 1940, when they are not. THere are many other inaccuracies, eg panzerfaust in 1940.

--no order of battle. so that Manstein or Model command a 24 corp of infantry divisions, Rommel commands a corp of panzer divisions even in 1940. Losing all those great generals really takes away from the immersion. I have the extra general pack and try to break down into corp levels for panzers, mot, mountaineers etc levels but then I have to many generals in one theatre.


- no supply, no need for fuel. This really bothers me and makes it feel more like Axis and Allies or something much simpler than what a Hearts of Iron 4 game should be. This is yet another problem that, given the structure of the game, I do not think can be corrected. Same goes for stockpiles, instead of reducing cap to half of what it was in hoi3, this coupled with no supply no fuel just takes too much away from a real hoi 4 game.

So because of this I am thinking of going back to HOI3 with historical progression mod or maybe giving Darkest Hour a try if it will run on windows 10. Or maybe just step away from a fit of paradox binging altogether for the benefit of my health and well being.

 

[jaredstanko]

no order of battle and the battle planner were both massive, massive failures for paradox. they were done to make the barrier to entry on the series lower, but they have absolutely crippled the AI in ways i did not see coming. the systems in place are so damn cumbersome the game is barely playable. REALLY? the OOB is THAT bad? its THAT terrible? try having the AI shuffle your front so hard the ai could win the war in days, if they EVEN BOTHERED PUTTING TROOPS IN THEIR FRONT.

all the crap people had to say about the OOB before HOI4 launched is a bad meme, the new system is 10 times worse, not only becuase the ai they have written cant handle it, but becuase its actually harder to organize your fronts in HOI4 than it is in HOI3. sure, it took an hour to make the OOB look sexy enough, but once it was made, i could micro a front for days and have a blast of a time, even as soviets. now ill be lucky if the ai will even use its engineer brigades properly.

dont even get me started on the idiocy of "planning bonus" something i have never even used, although i try in every game i play.

gone are he days of fortifying a front so that its maximum frontage is covered all across a front, and then reacting as you will once the war begins. now you just slap 40 divisions on 10 or so provinces and let them handle it. only to find germany has encircled your whole front becuase 25 divisions are stuck in a single province for some god forsaken reason.

 

[stjern]

You need to slow down and take a breath.

Also if you had been around and reading the dev comments for the last couple of weeks, you'd have noticed the AI programmer saying there is major improvement to the battle plan shuffle problem coming in 1.4. It is apparently a noticeable enough improvement that when he plays with other people using the current version that you and I have, he misses the improvement.

And no, nothing has changed with org. What you are noticing is that the AI is now using better division templates against you than it used to.

Please, that has been said now before every patch. It has only gotten worse!

 

[lihp]

no order of battle and the battle planner were both massive, massive failures for paradox. they were done to make the barrier to entry on the series lower, but they have absolutely crippled the AI in ways i did not see coming. the systems in place are so damn cumbersome the game is barely playable. REALLY? the OOB is THAT bad? its THAT terrible? try having the AI shuffle your front so hard the ai could win the war in days, if they EVEN BOTHERED PUTTING TROOPS IN THEIR FRONT.
<snip>

Since I am one of those who massively criticize PDX for the AI, I still can not fully agree to your post. I had my time with the battle planner and I actually do consider it sexy - very.

Would you ask me, my "wet dream HOI5" for sure includes the battle planner. Preferably also including improved order of battle (I love the HOI3 style, if only there was much more for air and naval units as well as easier handling,... without the semi-intelligent theatre AI from HOI3 but the battle planner AI from HOI4) and definitly without AI shuffling .

 

[NightKev]

I love that you cannot just upgrade earlier equipment but have to produce newer technologies and build production efficiency to a point where you can cancel the old stuff.

Huh? Yes you can (though I can't comment on whether it's better to in-place upgrade production lines or use your mentioned method).

 

[Kadanz]

no order of battle and the battle planner were both massive, massive failures for paradox. they were done to make the barrier to entry on the series lower, but they have absolutely crippled the AI in ways i did not see coming. the systems in place are so damn cumbersome the game is barely playable. REALLY? the OOB is THAT bad? its THAT terrible? try having the AI shuffle your front so hard the ai could win the war in days, if they EVEN BOTHERED PUTTING TROOPS IN THEIR FRONT.

all the crap people had to say about the OOB before HOI4 launched is a bad meme, the new system is 10 times worse, not only becuase the ai they have written cant handle it, but becuase its actually harder to organize your fronts in HOI4 than it is in HOI3. sure, it took an hour to make the OOB look sexy enough, but once it was made, i could micro a front for days and have a blast of a time, even as soviets. now ill be lucky if the ai will even use its engineer brigades properly.

dont even get me started on the idiocy of "planning bonus" something i have never even used, although i try in every game i play.

gone are he days of fortifying a front so that its maximum frontage is covered all across a front, and then reacting as you will once the war begins. now you just slap 40 divisions on 10 or so provinces and let them handle it. only to find germany has encircled your whole front becuase 25 divisions are stuck in a single province for some god forsaken reason.

The AI couldn't handle the OOB in HoI 3 either. Divisions constantly out of range to receive any boni, anyone? I find it actually easier to organize my divisions in 4 than I did in 3. However, the immersion I got in 3 I'm missing in 4.

The game is perfectly playable, imho. But I guess that's rather subjective. The expert AI mod is a must have. It improves quite a lot of stuff and the soviets actually gave me a good fight the other day.

 

[Gefallener_Held]

Huh? Yes you can (though I can't comment on whether it's better to in-place upgrade production lines or use your mentioned method).

No, what I mean is that you cannot just upgrade stuff abstractly the way you did in hoi3 and before, magically converting panzer iiis to ivs etc.

 

[redrum68]

Well the battle planner doesn't work well in 1.3 period. I think there is a pretty strong consensus on that and supposedly they are going to make major fixes to it for 1.4. If you don't want the frustration of it failing you then just micro your divisions.

 

[Lumpy]

No, what I mean is that you cannot just upgrade stuff abstractly the way you did in hoi3 and before, magically converting panzer iiis to ivs etc.

Which is a good thing, right?

 

[lihp]

Well the battle planner doesn't work well in 1.3 period. I think there is a pretty strong consensus on that and supposedly they are going to make major fixes to it for 1.4. If you don't want the frustration of it failing you then just micro your divisions.

Sorry there are quite a lot of hours in HOI4 n my shoulders, even though I slacked the past 3 months. Please point at te issues with the battle planer - which do you refer to?

 

[Lumpy]

Sorry there are quite a lot of hours in HOI4 n my shoulders, even though I slacked the past 3 months. Please point at te issues with the battle planer - which do you refer to?

The AI basically has nothing but frustrating shenannigans in mind. It will leave wide areas of a front uncovered, while amassing dozens of divisions in single provinces, ready to be encircled. It constantly shuffles around divisions from one end of the front to another, thus forfeiting planning and entrenchment bonuses of the divisions in question. For me, it actually feels as if the true enemy is the battle planer AI, not the (somehow) even more horrendously incompetent enemy AI.

 

[redrum68]

The AI basically has nothing but frustrating shenannigans in mind. It will leave wide areas of a front uncovered, while amassing dozens of divisions in single provinces, ready to be encircled. It constantly shuffles around divisions from one end of the front to another, thus forfeiting planning and entrenchment bonuses of the divisions in question. For me, it actually feels as if the true enemy is the battle planer AI, not the (somehow) even more horrendously incompetent enemy AI.

^^^

Essentially division shuffle is the biggest issue but also leaving holes in the front. Kind of wish the AI didn't use the battle planner then it might be a bit more challenging

 

[lihp]

The AI basically has nothing but frustrating shenannigans in mind. It will leave wide areas of a front uncovered, while amassing dozens of divisions in single provinces, ready to be encircled. It constantly shuffles around divisions from one end of the front to another, thus forfeiting planning and entrenchment bonuses of the divisions in question. For me, it actually feels as if the true enemy is the battle planer AI, not the (somehow) even more horrendously incompetent enemy AI.

Exactly the AI issue. Its not a battle planner issue at all. Its just two different topics, even though they happen after each other.

 

[RisingSun]

Well not only that, I have seen many unit paths is terrible, going through mountain, etc. They also need to work on it some more I guess, they still haven't touch the installations, units and other things in the Japan as well around it. Wish they polish it some more, but guess they have better things to do.

 

[lihp]

Sorry gals and guys: you can even smack me around, but... I actually feel comfortable in handling my own armies with the battle planner...

There are oddities I need to take care of, but since I know which,... it works. Examples:

• Keeping tank armies in their own armies beneath the theatre. As a result, the Ai supply sensor fails, but I can easily rearrange tank movement to fit my intended goal.
• Keeping special forces in their own army to make sure they are deployed in their preferred terrain, eg Mountaineers in mountains or arctic, marines over rivers,...
• Keeping garrison seperate in its own theatre.
• Having AI handle difficult situations with the garrison order instead of a normal battle planner (UK invasion works pretty well with garrisson isntead of a battle plan.)
• Still sometimes armies stray, but those I just push back in line - and it happens seldomly to me...
  
• ...

 

[lihp]

What I do believe needs fixing is the battle AI esspecially for AI nations. This is what bothers me most: Gibraltar unguarded, AI Germany shuffling armies from east to west front right before Barbarossa, AI UK suiciding navy,...