Please change the name of the religion "Protestantism" and "Reformed"

[HMS Renown]

From the new development journal, we will have Anglicanism as a new religion for England. Is it suitable to call the previous "Protestantism" Protestantism? Because Anglican and Reformed(Calvinism) belong to Protestantism, the "Protestantism" in EU4 actually is Lutheranism.

The father (Protestantism) has three sons, Lutheranism,Calvinism and Anglicanism. It's very weird to put the father (Protestantism), one son (Anglicanism) and Tom (Reformed) in the same level.

I strongly recommend we change the "Protestantism" to "Lutheranism", "Reformed" to "Calvinism". I am really obsessive about the name! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Vetgirig]

Where does Hussites and Unitarians fit in ?

 

[aaronlaw97]

It's very weird to put the father (Protestantism), one son (Anglicanism) and Tom (Reformed) in the same level.

That's basically the Trinity: Father, Son and some other guy

 

[HMS Renown]

Where does Hussites and Unitarians fit in ?

Then just make the unique system for Hussites and Unitarian，which can combine with the government ability of Bohemia,Poland and Hungary.

 

[HMS Renown]

That's basically the Trinity: Father, Son and some other guy

Holy Spirit: Dislike

 

[Hugus]

Fair point. I wonder why they picked the names they did. Even with just Protestantism and Reformed being used before, Protestantism would actually be the name to cover both of them.

I don't care so much tough, I defend the old faiths and always stomp out as much of this radical nonsense as I can

 

[ChloePech]

They separate protestants and reformed by the major doctrine differences (and appeal differences) of the groups, which is reasonable. No other name is any better to reflect the difference- protestant believes that faith in God and Jesus will save you, Reformed believes in predestination. Protestantism appealed to the more centralized, independent-minded states (with more secret police, hello Prussians) and reformed appealed to peoples who were crushed under the boot of other nations, like the Scots or the Hungarians. The Anglican church has serious differences in theology with both Protestant and Reformed, and many people consider those 3 categories separate. The names as-is are fine.

The scale of Calvin's break was large enough for the protestants of the day and the reformed? of the day to see eachother as separate. Indeed, they often opposed eachother.

 

[cuendillar]

I would assume another reason to use Protestant and Reformed instead of ie Lutheranism and Calvinism is an explicit intent to avoid naming religions after persons in a game of alternate/sandbox history. More generic names, or dynamic names based on where the religions spawn, is more in line with that spirit. The latter, however, would be unnecessarily confusing.

Note that the event spawning Protestantism says "a monk in (national capital) has for some time expressed deep concerns", quite clearly indicating Martin Luther while intentionally avoiding to actually name him.

 

[Kapitalisti]

Those religions can spawn anywhere in Europe so it wouldn't make sense to use a person's name with them. Generic names are better.

 

[iquabakaner]

Where does Hussites and Unitarians fit in ?

Hussites were closer to the Reformed faith and shouldn't be represented by Protestantism anyway.

 

[ChloePech]

The Hussites were more akin to earlier Christian heresies than anything produced by the reformation

 

[Dominion]

Where does Hussites and Unitarians fit in ?

Poland. Where they can get rounded up and eradicated more efficiently.

 

[ChloePech]

They just never had the traction to be represented as separate. Like, yes, they were radical and powerful (though localized as all hell) but no more than say, the alltogether more radical and powerful cathars. EU4 just doesn't really represent heresies all that well tho

 

[iquabakaner]

The Hussites were more akin to earlier Christian heresies than anything produced by the reformation

Hussitism was an early Christian heresy. What I was saying was that it was close to Reformed in terms of the teachings, and that was one of the reasons why the Hussites chose the Calvinist Frederick V, Elector Palatine as King of Bohemia in 1618.

 

[Dominion]

Hussitism was an early Christian heresy. What I was saying was that it was close to Reformed in terms of the teachings, and that was one of the reasons why the Hussites chose the Calvinist Frederick V, Elector Palatine as King of Bohemia in 1618.

Their impact was undeniable, but most of their impact was limited to Bohemia for the bigger part.
Try implementing that in a way that makes sense in a sandbox game.
Best approach would probably a school-like mechanic. Similar to what Muslims got.

I'm actually disappointed with the design choice behind the newest patch.
Was hoping for a full blown "Christian Heresies" minigame, more fleshed out than Islamic schools and with more flavor events.
Especially considering how Europe is their most played continent.

 

[Ketilsen]

The actual reason it's "Protestant" and "Reformed" is probably that they had Protestant in the game from the start and added Reformed later, and not changing "Protestant" because it would seem awkward (I'm not sure if this was during the timeframe of EUIV or in earlier games).

 

[Dutchman251]

The real problem is that 'Protestant' is an anachronism, which is used to denote mergers of Reformed and Lutheran churches (which first started on the orders of Frederick William, king of Prussia). As a result, it is very unclear what it is representing in-game, though it most probably represents Lutheranism.

Reformed is fine. That's how the Calvinists call themselves.

 

[Chamboozer]

Reformed is fine. "Protestant" is problematic though, but if we want to avoid naming it after a person who wasn't born yet by the start of the game, we can follow the German model and call it "Evangelical."

 

[hewhoispale]

Reformed is fine. "Protestant" is problematic though, but if we want to avoid naming it after a person who wasn't born yet by the start of the game, we can follow the German model and call it "Evangelical."

I've familiar with Evangelical only in reference to the contemporary American Christian "denomination", which is very specifically not what the current Protestant is meant to represent.

 

[Dakka]

Protestantism doesn’t just refer to Lutheranism, but also Ananaptists, Menonites, the Hussites, etc. It’san abstraction of the Protestant movement in general and extends to cover the “minor” denominations as well as a catch-all term.

Reformed is the same, though it is referring more the Calvinists and Presbyterians.

Anglicanism is different from these two. Though it came to be around the same time as Luther’s movement, it was a lot closer (almost identical) to Catholicism proper. The primary difference being that it replaced the Pope with the King as he head of the church. In reality “Anglicanism” just began as a power play against the Pope and as a way for Henry VIII to be able to divorce Catherine of Aragon without the Pope’s consent, a thing unheard of at the time. If anything (if we really want to make the argument of redundancy), Anglicanism should supersede “The Statute Of Restraint Of Appeals”, since they exist for the same purpose. However, Anglicanism grew to be a bit more unique than just the deposing of the pope, so I can see it holding a place in the game for flavor purposes.