Playing through... WW1 to WW2

[21oliver]

If HOI3 was a more accurate representation of WW2 it might be a boring game as well. Consider Hitler attacked Poland in 39, France in 40, Soviet Union in 41...no world conquering, likewise no taking Albania and conquering the world, or playing Turkey and doing so with only Militia and so on... War is often long periods of nothing but planning and re-organization, boring to most gamers. You want accurate? One of the first flight simulators my brother had. Taking say 20 hours real time to fly to Australia. Fun? not a chance.

I would find the game interesting starting say in 1930 but the truth is the typical gamer wouldnt. Those of here who consider ourselves wargame enthusiasts and amateur historians and what not love to be immersed in the details and the history, but we are the minority. The average gamer wants to sit down and conquer the world in a few hours.

 

[Dalwin]

If HOI3 was a more accurate representation of WW2 it might be a boring game as well. Consider Hitler attacked Poland in 39, France in 40, Soviet Union in 41...no world conquering, likewise no taking Albania and conquering the world, or playing Turkey and doing so with only Militia and so on... War is often long periods of nothing but planning and re-organization, boring to most gamers. You want accurate? One of the first flight simulators my brother had. Taking say 20 hours real time to fly to Australia. Fun? not a chance.

I would find the game interesting starting say in 1930 but the truth is the typical gamer wouldnt. Those of here who consider ourselves wargame enthusiasts and amateur historians and what not love to be immersed in the details and the history, but we are the minority. The average gamer wants to sit down and conquer the world in a few hours.

I think that if it was a better simulation then it would be less boring rather than more. The reason I say that is that the invasion of the Su would more often than not lead to a few years of desparately trying to hold on instead of Bitter Peace. Even in games where the Axis collapse is all but inevitable it can still be fun and challenging to do significantly better than history.

However, I don't think the nature of HOI and its mechanics lends itself well to being a truly balanced simulation. To get that one would have to simplify many mechanics to the point where the AI can then be competent. Many players prize HOI for its level of detail compared to other WWII grand strategy games, even though ironically it is this very level of detail that prevents it from being a good simulation or even a challenging single player game.

 

[Snozzle91]

You can do that by modifying the save or starting files for the country you want to play. Want more IC, give it to yourself. Want more leadership change it. Want more money, presto add it. Problem solved.

Just don't expect the rest of us to have to play a game where country X is ahistorical because you wanted to make an empire with it.

LOL... not sure if you dont read English or u r just trolling. I dont feel the need to reply to that.

Never asked for better... I asked for a time frame that allowed a degree of 'customization' for the country I choose to play with. If u want to follow history 100% of the way, watch a documentary - the whole point of these games is changing history, or re-enacting it differently. Muppet.

Love!

 

[Axe99]

I would find the game interesting starting say in 1930 but the truth is the typical gamer wouldnt. Those of here who consider ourselves wargame enthusiasts and amateur historians and what not love to be immersed in the details and the history, but we are the minority. The average gamer wants to sit down and conquer the world in a few hours.

HoI has _never_ been a game about conquering the world in a few hours! If that's what people are looking for, they need to look at Civ (on easy, sped up) or Risk, or similar. As for war being nothing but long periods of planning and re-organisation, that was absolutely not the case for the majors in WW2 - Germany was almost always involved in a naval, air or land that would involve unit sizes that are used in HoI, and generally multiple. Same goes for Japan, US, UK and France (until Vichy at least ).

LOL... not sure if you dont read English or u r just trolling. I dont feel the need to reply to that.

Never asked for better... I asked for a time frame that allowed a degree of 'customization' for the country I choose to play with. If u want to follow history 100% of the way, watch a documentary - the whole point of these games is changing history, or re-enacting it differently. Muppet.

Love!

I'm not sure if you can call someone a muppet and then say love in the next line and it works . As for what you're asking, it's important to note that there were constraints in all countries (as there always are and have been) to going for full-bore industrialisation (presumably with an armaments focus in your case) in all games. In most situations, the smaller countries wouldn't be able to industrialise any quicker without getting ahistorical, you'd just have a few extra years to vary your force mix, noting that most minor countries weren't building up their armed forces and so in most cases you wouldn't have much to play around with at all. If you want historical, what your proposing would be a lot of time sitting on fastest speed waiting for nothing to happen for the vast majority of nations. If what you want is ahistorical, then jump into a 1936 file and mod away .

 

[21oliver]

My point is that the average gamer doesnt care about the level of detail most of us here do, they simply want a good playable game. Then there are those like my brother who will complain when watching a WW2 movie and notice that the Germans are using American rifles and so on!

 

[ringhloth]

you guys dont get my point - or may be I didnt explain myself well! Ofc all countries are playable... What bugs me is having to enter the conflict with the exact same units I begin with - because the countries I tend to play with have very outdated divisions that take ages to update. Also... given the time, is building IC even worthwhile? I'd really much like a scenario that gave you the possibility to beef up whichever country you are playing a bit - which is not to say it will ever be as powerful as Germany...

ultimately this is a game people play so that they may to some extent modify history, it is only fair that the player is given a chance to do so!

I am not asking for an ahistorical game... just the chance to build up my country a tad, before I am thrown into WW2. In this respect there could be 2 starting points, one in let's say 1933 and another in 1939 - so everybody is happy! no!?

You can do a lot of nation improvement in HoI3. Sure, it's pretty heavily weighted towards the majors. But not as much as you say so, and I'm sure you could build a fairly useful army, especially as Italy. Your understanding, as others has mentioned, seems to be coming entirely from Darkest Hour, which in no way reflects how HoI3 plays out in its current patches. Hell, in HoI3, it's probably too easy to build up your IC. Japan can get up to German, Soviet, and US levels of IC pretty easily.

 

[21oliver]

Italy is a Major.

 

[NapoleonComple]

I would point out that you can easily be decisive with France and Italy. Hell, someone managed to decide Barbarossa as Hungary (skillful tactical maneuvers).

 

[21oliver]

If the timeline was expanded as far back as WWI the game would never resemble WW2 by the time 1939 rolled around, and if it did it likely wouldnt be something we would want to play because that would mean we played alot of years and had little impact on the prewar setup.

 

[safe-keeper]

You can do that by modifying the save or starting files for the country you want to play. Want more IC, give it to yourself. Want more leadership change it. Want more money, presto add it. Problem solved.

Just don't expect the rest of us to have to play a game where country X is ahistorical because you wanted to make an empire with it.

Putting words in other peoples' mouths, much?

 

[aruon]

personally i think that a flaw with the HOI games is that there were never enough flavor and filler events. just the little things that make you take notice to break up the monotony, even if they serve no purpose other than to distract you from the rest of the game.

look at 1936 alone, here's a bunch of small/tertiary interesting things worth having ingame (some seen internationally or just for specific country), whether they have any impact of not:

Feb 4th - 1st radioactive substance produced synthetically (Radium E)
Feb 15th - Hitler announces building of Volkswagen (yeah! the friggin VW beetle is Hitler's brainchild! how screwed up is that!!!)
Feb 29th - FDR signs 2nd neutrality act (there were 4 + these could actually be real events, with modifiers attached for signing or vetoing)
Mar 1st - The Hoover Dam is completed.
Mar 11th - British Prime Minister Stanley Baldwin pardons five convicted Irish militants who promise to join growing conflict with Germany. (could turn into a manpower+ event)
May 24th - Dutch bishops forbid membership of Nazi party
May 28th - Alan Turing submits "On Computable Numbers" for publication, in which he set out the theoretical basis for modern computers
Jul 26th - The Axis Powers decide to intervene in the Spanish Civil War. (though we all know this will remain optional)
Jul 31st - Tokyo Japan is awarded the 1940 Olympics (later cancelled)
Aug 24th - FDR gives FBI authority to pursuit fascists & communists (could be true event)
Nov 16th - German air force begins bombing of Madrid (ingame meaning would actually suggest german DOWing or being called into war against R. Spain, OR German-named units appearing under N. Spain control)
Nov 30th - London's Crystal Palace (built 1851), destroyed by fire
Dec 25th - Belgian bishops condemn fascism & communism

having numerous events like these would cut down on the monotony and make an EvW-length (AKA longer than 12 years) playthrough more feasible.

 

[21oliver]

Read any and all of my posts, ive been screaming for them for months on end. Historical and fictional ones, but i prefer when they actually have an impact on the game, even if its minor then simply the ones that tell us so-and-so died etc...

 

[Snozzle91]

Putting words in other peoples' mouths, much?

+1

 

[21oliver]

Ive never been a fan of the events that had no impact on the game and just were for eye candy, i prefer additional historical and fictional events that do have some small impact on the game as well as add to the flavor. For example if you pop a decision that King George of the Uk has died perhaps the Brits take a -2 NU penalty for a month etc...

 

[jju_57]

Putting words in other peoples' mouths, much?

I've been around these boards for way longer and yes, most of us don't want to play a game that just fits your desires anymore then you would want to play a game that fits my desires and wants.

Bottom line is if you don't like it then change or mod it.

And Snozzle go play with your sock puppet or learn to mod.

OH

 

[21oliver]

 

[Mamluke]

XD

LOL ahaha

that jju and 12 oliver post reminded me of scary movie! (its randam- ness)

made my day! :happy:

 

[21oliver]

 

[Snozzle91]

I've been around these boards for way longer and yes, most of us don't want to play a game that just fits your desires anymore then you would want to play a game that fits my desires and wants.

Bottom line is if you don't like it then change or mod it.

And Snozzle go play with your sock puppet or learn to mod.

OH

-.-'

...r u for real? if so, u r too funny man!!!

I <3 how you arbitrarily decide that what you want is what most players want!

As for your suggestion... I would be happy to play with a puppet. Just come over when you'r free! :rofl:

 

[ringhloth]

I <3 how you arbitrarily decide that what you want is what most players want!

That's not what arbitrary means. I don't really care about this discussion. Just that that's not what arbitrary means.