So I'm playing Ironman as Otto. It's 1520 and as a proper kebab I've been at war about 90% of the time. I'm winning battles left and right. Sieging every province and generally having a nice kebab.
But here I am at 1520 and my Army Tradition is at 28. TWENTY EIGHT! Basically my army has ben fighting for nearly 80 years straight but they have learned nothing from it. My leaders are worthless with none having more than a total of 6 stats combined.
Now I'm looking over at european nations... 2 star, 3 star generals here and there some of which have 6 pips in a single stat. I fought Milan recently and they had better morale than me despite being behind in tech and me having a +10% morale advisor. (me at 3.7, them at 4.4)
Obviously the difference in morale and leader quality comes from Army Tradition. AI gets boosted like hell through ArmyTrad because of their handicap.(they get way more army trad than players, even if they get absolutely crushed)
This wasn't a problem before Common Sense though. Because winning a siege gave you 1 Trad flat. This meant you could easily keep up with the AI by just sieging enough. With Common Sense they reworked how sieges work and this meant winning non-fort sieges doesn't give you any tradition anymore.
Now this makes sense of course. A fortless province is basically just a city/town your army walks through raping and pillaging as they see fit. No tradition to gain there.
But this means the players have lost their biggest gain of Army Tradition, which gives the AI a huge quality advantage in leaders/army because they still gain their massive amounts of traditions through battles.
A side effect of this is that idea groups which give you tradition or less tradition decay have become much stronger than the groups that don't. Quality, Defensive, Aristocratic are super important now if you aim to keep your tradition high enough.
While perma 100 tradition Prussia was ridiculously overpowered I feel like the players need a way to gain Army Tradition easier. Playing a warmongering Ottoman Empire and fighting for nearly 80 years should bring you to 100 tradition without the help of ideas. I've crushed the Mamluks, Byzantium, Serbia, Wallachia, Crimea, Georgia, Golden Horde, Nogai, Kazan, Uzbek, Qara Qoyunlu, Hejaz, Alodia, Papal States, Milan, Venice and Bavaria. All between 1444 and 1520 and without losing more than maybe 5 individual battles. I find it hard to believe a nation who dominates that much in such a short timespan wouldn't be regarded as having the best army in the world.
Possible fixes?
-In my opinion the player should gain more from battles. Not as much as the AI so they can still have their handicap, but much more than we're getting now. I've seen too many battles where my enemy gets 2-5 trad and I get 0 for crushing their army. The most I've got so far in this run is 0.4 from a single big fight against the Mamluks.
-Sieges. Either winning non-fort sieges should give a small amount (0.25 perhaps) for the first time you siege it in a war. That way you can't just siege a province under fort influence over and over for Army Trad. Or maybe winning for sieges should give you way more tradition than it does now. Many famous real world generals are famous for being great siege commanders. This would make wining fort sieges more rewarding and lucrative.
-Giving leaders a chance to get better. A general who has been victoriously leading my armies for 20 years shouldn't be as good at the end as he was when he first got command. He's sure to have learned something during his battles and sieges. Winning for sieges could have a chance to increase the siege skill of the general leading the siege. Winning battles would have a chance to increase Shock/Fire and just moving about at war could increase maneuver. This might make the system a bit more complicated but it would at least mean you're rewarded for fighting. It could also make badly rolled leaders less frustrating because you know you can improve him. It would also make gaining and losing leaders a more significant event.
Bit of a wall of text but I just felt like writing down my thoughts while drinking my coffee.
But here I am at 1520 and my Army Tradition is at 28. TWENTY EIGHT! Basically my army has ben fighting for nearly 80 years straight but they have learned nothing from it. My leaders are worthless with none having more than a total of 6 stats combined.
Now I'm looking over at european nations... 2 star, 3 star generals here and there some of which have 6 pips in a single stat. I fought Milan recently and they had better morale than me despite being behind in tech and me having a +10% morale advisor. (me at 3.7, them at 4.4)
Obviously the difference in morale and leader quality comes from Army Tradition. AI gets boosted like hell through ArmyTrad because of their handicap.(they get way more army trad than players, even if they get absolutely crushed)
This wasn't a problem before Common Sense though. Because winning a siege gave you 1 Trad flat. This meant you could easily keep up with the AI by just sieging enough. With Common Sense they reworked how sieges work and this meant winning non-fort sieges doesn't give you any tradition anymore.
Now this makes sense of course. A fortless province is basically just a city/town your army walks through raping and pillaging as they see fit. No tradition to gain there.
But this means the players have lost their biggest gain of Army Tradition, which gives the AI a huge quality advantage in leaders/army because they still gain their massive amounts of traditions through battles.
A side effect of this is that idea groups which give you tradition or less tradition decay have become much stronger than the groups that don't. Quality, Defensive, Aristocratic are super important now if you aim to keep your tradition high enough.
While perma 100 tradition Prussia was ridiculously overpowered I feel like the players need a way to gain Army Tradition easier. Playing a warmongering Ottoman Empire and fighting for nearly 80 years should bring you to 100 tradition without the help of ideas. I've crushed the Mamluks, Byzantium, Serbia, Wallachia, Crimea, Georgia, Golden Horde, Nogai, Kazan, Uzbek, Qara Qoyunlu, Hejaz, Alodia, Papal States, Milan, Venice and Bavaria. All between 1444 and 1520 and without losing more than maybe 5 individual battles. I find it hard to believe a nation who dominates that much in such a short timespan wouldn't be regarded as having the best army in the world.
Possible fixes?
-In my opinion the player should gain more from battles. Not as much as the AI so they can still have their handicap, but much more than we're getting now. I've seen too many battles where my enemy gets 2-5 trad and I get 0 for crushing their army. The most I've got so far in this run is 0.4 from a single big fight against the Mamluks.
-Sieges. Either winning non-fort sieges should give a small amount (0.25 perhaps) for the first time you siege it in a war. That way you can't just siege a province under fort influence over and over for Army Trad. Or maybe winning for sieges should give you way more tradition than it does now. Many famous real world generals are famous for being great siege commanders. This would make wining fort sieges more rewarding and lucrative.
-Giving leaders a chance to get better. A general who has been victoriously leading my armies for 20 years shouldn't be as good at the end as he was when he first got command. He's sure to have learned something during his battles and sieges. Winning for sieges could have a chance to increase the siege skill of the general leading the siege. Winning battles would have a chance to increase Shock/Fire and just moving about at war could increase maneuver. This might make the system a bit more complicated but it would at least mean you're rewarded for fighting. It could also make badly rolled leaders less frustrating because you know you can improve him. It would also make gaining and losing leaders a more significant event.
Bit of a wall of text but I just felt like writing down my thoughts while drinking my coffee.
Last edited:
- 4
- 1
Upvote
0
I agree though it should be easier to get army tradition.