Wyvern said:
The thing is we want them survive a longer war without killing themselves with war exhaustion.
I really wonder how fast alien progress will be; I'll edit them to 20 MP for now though. Does it sound better?-
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The thing is we want them survive a longer war without killing themselves with war exhaustion.
I really wonder how fast alien progress will be; I'll edit them to 20 MP for now though. Does it sound better?
Bah, manpower! Everyone knows it's completely irrelevant even in "normal" MP games. Here more than ever navies will rule: if I were Alien my policy would be simple: the country that dares building a navy is DOWed with a primary goal to force her to disband it :wacko:
it's completely irrelevant even in "normal" MP games. Here more than ever navies will rule: if I were Alien my policy would be simple: the country that dares building a navy is DOWed with a primary goal to force her to disband it :wacko:
Barnius said:Bah, manpower! Everyone knows
Why are the aliens sailing anyway? unless they want to appear as if not being offworld to humans anyhow.
Chaingun said:The thing is we want them survive a longer war without killing themselves with war exhaustion.
Just give the starting province like +10 manpower. They can work the rest by them selves
I think its a good rule to go that they would assimilate the provinces they conquer making them their own culture.
RedPhoenix said:Just give the starting province like +10 manpower. They can work the rest by them selves
I just put them to 10 even before reading this. The reason is, once I finally figured out how to edit out the whiteman penalty (yay I succeeded), those fleets explored the seas outside SA very quickly. I think they could attempt an early landing on Europe if they would have enough manpower.
The other second thing I learnt is that aliens have micromanagement hell coordinating their fleets sailing everywhere etc. (no surprise really). However, on BN it should be playable.
Quick how to start as alien list:
1. Build maxium number of cavalry or infantry (infantry might to better in the long run due to much better stats at land tech 60).
2. When troops finish, start building maximum number of warships or transports (which ever is faster for exploration).
3. Meanwhile you wait, start exploring with those troops (use very small concentrations).
I think you over-estimate the likelyhood of wars of war exhaustion early on. Seriously - who is going to want to make themselves an early target of the aliens? Let us assume the Aliens fight Spain in the colonies. The Alien aim to begin with is to take the colonies and gain a peace deal. If Spain doesn't give a reasonable one the aliens will be sailing to mainland spain pretty shortly and will be able to stab hit spain anyway. Now a good player can survive stab hits for a very long time I'll grant you, but will Spain want to risk being totally overrun and losing mainland provinces when giving a few colonies will gain her peace? I think not. Consider also that most fortresses will be minimal for a long time and the aliens will be able to assault and conquer these fairly rapidly.Chaingun said:The thing is we want them survive a longer war without killing themselves with war exhaustion.
I think with the culture assimilation the Aliens will be fine for MP and that the big wars won't start for quite a while. The culture assimilation will also reduce the micro management of revolts which can only be a good thing.
I really don't know who will be good enough to manage playing Aliens against 10 human players. For one, every war could easily destroy Alien trade.
How about let's say 3 players playing Aliens? Perhaps starting from the same region with different colonisation/conquest areas...
How about let's say 3 players playing Aliens? Perhaps starting from the same region with different colonisation/conquest areas...
Beta version 001 is temporarily available for download here:
Link
Unzip and extract into EU2 dir.
I would be happy if you could play test the aliens to 1500 or something to see how much you have time to explore.
Link
Unzip and extract into EU2 dir.
I would be happy if you could play test the aliens to 1500 or something to see how much you have time to explore.
Lets say you have 8 humans v 1 alien. I dont think fighting like this would be too hard. You just need to take them 1 at a time. I suppose a large alien empire may be tricky to manage in some ways but with total naval superiority (which they will have) its unlickely they will be attacked at home. Playing against lots of humans is never really hard as long as they are all concentrated in a small area. Its harder imo to coordinate alliances as you have to use the chat and play atst.
cheech said:
I agree with you if your condition that fighting is concentrated in a small area is met. However, with the country setup that is suggested (European, African, Middle East, Indian and Chinese human countries) that will not be the case.
I assume we can agree that aliens can forget 1 on 1 wars.
My point is why would the alien lets say invade china, russia, spain at the same time. More likely they would invade maybe spain and work their way up the coast while blockading everyone. This would be a fairly simply afair with high tech.
Things I got to add to the scenario that is not included in that download:
1. Eternal great monarch.
2. Some leaders maybe? Evently distributed with 10 years apart?
3. More country slots.
Additinal suggestions about what to add would be welcome.
As for cultural assimilation, I'm afraid that it'd be difficult to track how long each province was owned. I think a more simple rule would be better, like "let the aliens convert 3 provinces of their choice to their culture every ten years between sessions, but no accumulation is allowed except for cases where a session saw multiple decades".
I don't think micromanagement will be too bad IF we can get the revolts to stay at a low rate. Like Cheech said, it would be fairly unsmart by the aliens to take on simultaneous fronts at the same time.
One little question from an anti-admiral (I never liked navies in EU2 and I prefer land powers), do ships at naval tech 60 receive any attrition? I think someone mentioned they don't. It would be very good for the aliens in terms of killing micromanagement if they could just place a small detachment of ships on certain locations when at war to continously block them.
1. Eternal great monarch.
2. Some leaders maybe? Evently distributed with 10 years apart?
3. More country slots.
Additinal suggestions about what to add would be welcome.
As for cultural assimilation, I'm afraid that it'd be difficult to track how long each province was owned. I think a more simple rule would be better, like "let the aliens convert 3 provinces of their choice to their culture every ten years between sessions, but no accumulation is allowed except for cases where a session saw multiple decades".
I don't think micromanagement will be too bad IF we can get the revolts to stay at a low rate. Like Cheech said, it would be fairly unsmart by the aliens to take on simultaneous fronts at the same time.
One little question from an anti-admiral (I never liked navies in EU2 and I prefer land powers), do ships at naval tech 60 receive any attrition? I think someone mentioned they don't. It would be very good for the aliens in terms of killing micromanagement if they could just place a small detachment of ships on certain locations when at war to continously block them.
Chaingun said:
One word - nationalism. Simply use the inbulit 30 year nationalism (assimilation?) rule to change the culture to alien. Can be easily worked out after each session.
Why do you assume only aliens would DOW or be active party in deciding when and where the war will take place?
No infact they dont get attrition before that. Cant remember when though. You should give them CB against all humans. I think you mentioned giving them cores everywhere anyway right? Also i think humans should be allowd to change their capitols at will.
Ah yes 1 more thing.. I think that the humans should get CB on the aliens
PJL said:
I never cease to be a newbie
. I thought nationalism was 10 years. I guess some of it remain then. Do you know where in the save file this will show up? I assume it is in the province = {} sections and not in the city = {} sections?Barnius said:
I don't, but the aliens can decide at what land fronts they want to fight at. If for example China decides to land a fleet in SA it risks to fail for several reasons. First is that the aliens' fleets rock, at least initially. Secondly I assume the aliens' fort will be incredibly hard to assault because of the CRT difference. All of this means I do not think any big human counter-invasions efforts will take place until in the late game where tech levels have evened out.
cheech said:Ah yes 1 more thing.. I think that the humans should get CB on the aliens
They will once the aliens capture their cores.
I do believe the most efficient way among humans will be to make one big alliance.---------------------------------------------
I am in favour of enabling map sharing among the humans, but of course no sharing between the aliens or anyone else. The reason is I think it'd be hell annoying for Sweden if it did not know any alien territory when it tried to help Spain.
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It has definitelly been too long since I played EU2!
There is a great guide to everything naval in FAQ section. Apparently even at naval technology=1 one can avoid attrition completely .
Aliens certainly can blockade all human navies in ports with enough ships and not be concerned with attrition, especially if they have time to plan their movements.
There is a great guide to everything naval in FAQ section. Apparently even at naval technology=1 one can avoid attrition completely
.Aliens certainly can blockade all human navies in ports with enough ships and not be concerned with attrition, especially if they have time to plan their movements.
Yesterday I tested the initial scenario till 1500. It is really easy even for me, a well known eternal failure in land combat
By the end of 1495 Incas were annexed, Aztecs could have been in a matter of months, but I waited them to annex Zapotek. Till 1497 Incas, Aztec, Zapotek and Maya were incorporated in Alien Earth. If fast conquest was the goal, I believe all American natives could be annexed by 1502 at normal speed in MP. Most likely before any Europeans could annex one of them.
BB could be the problem though, almost over the limit already .
Casualties? No more than total 10 k I believe.
The initial "manpower" was 16, gone to 26. The initial manpower/year was, if I remember correctly, about 13, and after the conquests and culture edit it increased to about 24. Anyway, manpower is not a problem at all. And if one bothers to try to spare 20 k enemy army which than ends up as first class Alien Space Troopers – sky is the limit.
Navies basically don't suffer attrition. In 8 years I researched a lot, but it was SP and with a lot of pausing. I discovered most of the COTs, all the American mainland coast, European coast, Asian coast except Indonesian islands. With more dedication to that I believe all the coast could be mapped in 10 years even in MP.
If it is that simple, why torture the poor player with it? I would give Aliens maps of the whole world.
If you are concerned about them spamming all the COTs, your concern is justified, but not influenced much by exploration. Pretty soon I reached merchant/year limit (12) and it will take some time to get 5 merchants in all COTs. Monopolies in Alien COTs Cuzco and Zacateces are easy to keep, but as long as Zacateces was still Aztec even Alien monopoly was challenged every year or so by those backwards American cultures. So I suppose Aliens will not have monopolies everywhere, but will have 5 merchants in every COT in a few decades. Unless embargoed by humans. Which would be extremely unhealthy for those particular humans .
Monthly income was about 220. I paid for tax collectors and governors in all annexed provinces and the initial treasury never dropped below 5000 d.
By the end of 1495 Incas were annexed, Aztecs could have been in a matter of months, but I waited them to annex Zapotek. Till 1497 Incas, Aztec, Zapotek and Maya were incorporated in Alien Earth. If fast conquest was the goal, I believe all American natives could be annexed by 1502 at normal speed in MP. Most likely before any Europeans could annex one of them.
BB could be the problem though, almost over the limit already
. Casualties? No more than total 10 k I believe.
The initial "manpower" was 16, gone to 26. The initial manpower/year was, if I remember correctly, about 13, and after the conquests and culture edit it increased to about 24. Anyway, manpower is not a problem at all. And if one bothers to try to spare 20 k enemy army which than ends up as first class Alien Space Troopers
– sky is the limit.Navies basically don't suffer attrition. In 8 years I researched a lot, but it was SP and with a lot of pausing. I discovered most of the COTs, all the American mainland coast, European coast, Asian coast except Indonesian islands. With more dedication to that I believe all the coast could be mapped in 10 years even in MP.
If it is that simple, why torture the poor player with it? I would give Aliens maps of the whole world.
If you are concerned about them spamming all the COTs, your concern is justified, but not influenced much by exploration. Pretty soon I reached merchant/year limit (12) and it will take some time to get 5 merchants in all COTs. Monopolies in Alien COTs Cuzco and Zacateces are easy to keep, but as long as Zacateces was still Aztec even Alien monopoly was challenged every year or so by those backwards American cultures. So I suppose Aliens will not have monopolies everywhere, but will have 5 merchants in every COT in a few decades. Unless embargoed by humans. Which would be extremely unhealthy for those particular humans
.Monthly income was about 220. I paid for tax collectors and governors in all annexed provinces and the initial treasury never dropped below 5000 d.
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Barnius said:BB could be the problem though, almost over the limit already
Indeed, the aliens will acquire bb if they annex pagans. I guess their badboy needs to be lowered after each session, otherwise a world conquest will become very, very difficult for them...