Petition to Introduce the Opium Trade

[Kurblius]

As a Chinese-Canadian, I resent the fact I can't sell opium to my compatriots in the Motherland. The British monopoly of the opium trade is entirely within the time frame of EU3 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_Wars), though admittedly the actual opium wars occurred just past the end of EU3's timeframe. For example, rather than producing useless naval supplies, Pandua - a province in the historical opium-producing region of Bengal - could instead produce the far more lucrative opium. Paradox has already demonstrated it has no more qualms about the slave or tobacco trade, so why not a healing drug for the sick? Price modifiers could be some form of compromise between those which apply to exotic goods like tobacco and naval supplies (to simulate gunboat diplomacy).

For example, demand for naval supplies currently has this modifier:
Province is a capital AND province owner is at war AND has ≥ 50 big ships AND has Land/Naval ≥ 2: +3900%

Access to 33% of the world's opium could grant a 10% trade income modifier.

And of course all kinds of fun events and decisions could be built around it. Let's hear some ideas, people!

(Aside for the trolls: Yes, yes, I know, a new trade good in EU3 isn't likely to happen. I'm also aware that Victoria and a few EU3 mods have toyed with the idea. This thread is more for fun than anything else).

 

[DanubianCossak]

Have Paradox add more trade goods?

I sign and support the idea no matter what trade good were talking about.

 

[anubisfike]

/signed

You should post it in the beta section as well.

 

[DanubianCossak]

You should post it in the beta section as well.

A very good idea.

 

[Eh up me duck]

Considering they already have Opium as a trade good in Vicky, there's probably a reason they didn't include it in EU3 - it's only really a factor in the last 50 years or so of the game. And really, who cares?

 

[ywhtptgtfo]

I think opium trade is a wonderful idea and I've love to strangle those backward Chinese with addiction and take their money. However, the current trade system doesn't really allow a good simulation of the related events. For example, it's impossible to ban a certain type of goods and hard to specifically force other countries to import particular trade goods.

 

[DeSean]

/signed

 

[ByzCrusader]

More trade goods is always a good thing.

/signed

 

[Kurblius]

I think opium trade is a wonderful idea and I've love to strangle those backward Chinese with addiction and take their money. However, the current trade system doesn't really allow a good simulation of the related events. For example, it's impossible to ban a certain type of goods and hard to specifically force other countries to import particular trade goods.

I think something along the lines of the existing "Abolition of Slavery Act" decision would be sufficient. On the European end, it would turn all opium-producing provinces into a different good, it could add modifiers such as Infamy: -0.02, +50 relations with Confucian nations, +1 prestige, -4% trade income modifier. On the Chinese end, I think all it needs is a tweak to the "Close Foreign Trade" decisions they already have.

 

[ywhtptgtfo]

I think something along the lines of the existing "Abolition of Slavery Act" decision would be sufficient. On the European end, it would turn all opium-producing provinces into a different good, it could add modifiers such as Infamy: -0.02, +50 relations with Confucian nations, +1 prestige, -4% trade income modifier. On the Chinese end, I think all it needs is a tweak to the "Close Foreign Trade" decisions they already have.

It's a very dirty and hardcoded mechanic. As I've said, the flow of trade goods must be reworked for this to be a viable feature because there are so many things that are simply not doable with the current game engine (the Opium War, closing of opium trade, etc).

 

[CMTSChesscom]

/signed

 

[Trin Tragula]

The problem with Opium being added to the game is it'd be produced in quite few provinces during this era. Malwa was the primary source of Opium in the world for most of the period and as such would produce it. In Bengal I'd say the Bangala province is closer to where the Opium was produced than Pandua (imho Naval Supplies is indeed a wierd trade good for Pandua though, cotton or Cloth would make more sense but Indian trade goods are a mess anyway).

Apart from those two I can't really see any provinces outside of China where it'd make sense to have Opium as the primary trade good. What you could do is have an event or decision switch trade goods of existing provinces but this isn't something paradox have been known to do in EU3. This kind of mechanic would also make sense for the quite anachronistic Indian tea production in the game (it only became popular and produced in any great quantities during the British rule there).

In order to properly simulate the opium trade you'd have to add quite a few decisions and events as well. So it's not a small change you're suggesting.

Still I'm all for it, but it seems an unlikely addition to me

 

[Buladelu]

How do you plan to make opium as significant as it was without some hardcoded events? Also, as somebody's mentioned, opium is significant only in a very late game. And most player don't even play to the end. And all this stuff with imperialism and revolutions is very basic, so why go into complex and relatively insignificant mechanics of opium trade?

/antisigned

 

[ajsciri4]

I think it's a good idea. A lot of people are saying it won't happen because it'll be too complex and such. Well, I think this is a good idea:

I think something along the lines of the existing "Abolition of Slavery Act" decision would be sufficient. On the European end, it would turn all opium-producing provinces into a different good, it could add modifiers such as Infamy: -0.02, +50 relations with Confucian nations, +1 prestige, -4% trade income modifier. On the Chinese end, I think all it needs is a tweak to the "Close Foreign Trade" decisions they already have.

Adding that in couldn't be too difficult. If you keep the idea small scale, it might just be added. signed

 

[magitsu]

At this point it's totally pointless to swap around trade goods.
Leave this to mods like MEIOU which add much more with them.

 

[DanubianCossak]

At this point it's totally pointless to swap around trade goods.
Leave this to mods like MEIOU which add much more with them.

If paradox was to add more stuff to vanilla, it would make vanilla more rich and would provide other modders, who are not part of MEIOU more things to play with. I disagree that Paradox should leave this sort of things to mods, lest of all individual ones, if anything they should add more trade goods, religions and so on.

 

[Serzis]

I don't really see the point of introducing opium as a trade good. Firstly, medical and recreational opium use surely existed during the better part of the EU3 time-frame, but it's political and economical importance belongs to the age of Imperialism (Victoria 2), not the Age of Colonialism (EU3). Both Opium wars take place after the game has ended, in 1839 ans 1858. Thus, the use of opium really doesn't fit with the game.

Secondly, to warrant the position of trade good, opium would have to be an important part of a province's production output. Opium was not grown on a large (industrial) scale until the very late 18th century, requiring provinces to flip to opium at the very, very end of the game. Likewise, the increasing consumption of opium in China is entirely a 19th century phenomenon, booming after the Opium Wars and peaking in China maybe as late as 1905.

Thirdly, the trade system in EU3 cannot really reflect neither import/export nor the circumstances leading to growing of opium. I would love to see a better mod for Vicky 2, but for EU3, I think its pretty pointless. Expansions and patches have a tendency to introduce things that had their context in a different era (Horde, Byzantium missions, colonization in the early 1400s) and although they're usually great fun, it somewhat dilutes the historical frame-work.

 

[DDRJake]

There's Opium in Meiou and that's pretty much all I play now. No special events about it as far as I'm aware; late game in EU3 rarely gets much love.

 

[unmerged(80402)]

Well i think opium trade should have some attention, but does not mean it realy need be a trade good - it could be just a modifire, that add some trade income(i don't think it was most produced good in those times... maybe i am wrong? But tell me if i am).