Petition regarding the Republic of Florence

[Tacticus101]

I suspect it'll be more of a case of "forever Duchy", at least for now.

Live in hope

 

[Distinct]

Switching Tuscany for Florence would take a little more time than you might think. It's not just about adding a new country in the common/country files and history files with an attributed color and so on. You would also need to modify all events and decision, everything flavor to work for both Tuscany and Florence and also create a flag.

Instead of having a new thread being created each week in favor of adding the republic of Florence, how about just making the mod (3 hours of work basically) and sending it to paradox.

 

[Galaahd]

Switching Tuscany for Florence would take a little more time than you might think. It's not just about adding a new country in the common/country files and history files with an attributed color and so on. You would also need to modify all events and decision, everything flavor to work for both Tuscany and Florence and also create a flag.

Instead of having a new thread being created each week in favor of adding the republic of Florence, how about just making the mod (3 hours of work basically) and sending it to paradox.

It wouldn't take long as there is currently only one event for Tuscany.

 

[Oyubi]

I liked Serinisma Italia's approach to this. It starts out as Florence with a load of Medici bank events and then you can form Tuscany later on. I believe the point of the Tag change is that you switch from a republic to a monarchy

 

[neondt]

I strongly support the addition of Florence. Also, FLO/TUS needs more flavour events. Here's a Bonfire of the Vanities event I posted in an earlier thread (note that it assumes Florence is a tag):

# bonfire of the vanities
country_event = {
   id = flavor_tus.5
   title = "flavor_tus.EVTNAME5"
   desc = "flavor_tus.EVTDESC5"
   picture = ANGRY_MOB_eventPicture

   fire_only_once = yes

   trigger = {
     religion = catholic
     OR = {
       tag = FLO
       tag = TUS
     }
     owns = 116
     116 = {
       religion = catholic
     }
     is_year = 1495
     NOT = { is_year = 1500 }
   }
   mean_time_to_happen = {
     months = 36
   }
   option = {
     name = "flavor_tus.EVTOPTA5"
     add_country_modifier = {
       name = narrowminded_modifier
       duration = 3650
     }
     reverse_add_opinion = { who = PAP modifier = opinion_disappointed_pope }
   }
   option = {
     name = "flavor_tus.EVTOPTB5"
     116 = {
       spawn_rebels = {
         type = heretic_rebels
         size = 2
         leader = "Girolamo Savonarola"
       }
     }
     add_stability = -1
   }
   option = {
     name = "flavor_tus.EVTOPTC5"
     change_government = theocratic_government
     add_stability = -2
     define_ruler = {
       name = "Girolamo Savonarola"
       adm = 5  
       dip = 5
       mil = 3
     }
   }
}

flavor_tus.EVTNAME5: "Bonfire of the Vanities"
flavor_tus.EVTDESC5: "Friar Girolamo Savonarola was a Dominican priest who was assigned to work in Florence in 1490, largely thanks to the request of Lorenzo de' Medici- an irony, considering that within a few years Savonarola would become one of the foremost enemies of the Medici house and helped to bring about their downfall in 1494. Savonarola campaigned against what he considered to be the artistic and social excesses of Renaissance Italy, preaching with great vigor against any sort of luxury. His power and influence grew so that with time he became the effective ruler of Florence, and even had soldiers for his protection following him around everywhere. Starting in the February of 1495, during the time that would normally have hosted the festival known as Carnival, Savonarola began to host his regular “Bonfire of the Vanities.” He collected various objects that he considered to be objectionable; irreplaceable manuscripts, ancient sculptures, antique and modern paintings, priceless tapestries, and many other valuable works of art, as well as mirrors, musical instruments, books of divination, astrology, and magic. He destroyed the works of Ovid, Propertius, Dante, as well as Boccaccio. So great was his influence that he even managed to obtain the cooperation of major contemporary artists such as Sandro Botticelli and Lorenzo di Credi, who reluctantly consigned some of their own works to his bonfires. Anyone who tried to object found their hands being forced by teams of ardent Savonarola supporters. These supporters called themselves Piagnoni (Weepers) after a public nickname that was originally intended as an insult."
flavor_tus.EVTOPTA5: "Leave them to it."
flavor_tus.EVTOPTB5: "Not my tapestries! Stop them at once!"
flavor_tus.EVTOPTC5: "He walks with God. Let him rule Florence."

 

[neondt]

Since people want it, here's some events that'll help Florence/Tuscany on its way towards monarchy.

# The Pazzi Conspiracy
country_event = {
   id = flavor_tus.4
   title = "flavor_tus.EVTNAME4"
   desc = "flavor_tus.EVTDESC4"
   picture = ANGRY_MOB_eventPicture

   fire_only_once = yes

   trigger = {
     OR = {
       tag = FLO
       tag = TUS
     }
     government = repubic
     is_year = 1475
     NOT = { is_year = 1485 }
   }
   mean_time_to_happen = {
     months = 60
   }
   option = { # the Medici rule Florence
     name = "flavor_tus.EVTOPTA4"
     add_stability = -1
     add_years_of_income = 0.5
     add_republican_tradition = -0.35
   }
}

flavor_tus.EVTNAME4: "The Pazzi Conspiracy"
flavor_tus.EVTDESC4: "The Pazzi conspiracy was a plot by members of the Pazzi family and others to displace the de' Medici family as rulers of Renaissance Florence. On 26 April 1478 there was an attempt to assassinate Lorenzo de' Medici and his brother Giuliano de' Medici. Lorenzo was wounded but survived; Giuliano was killed. The failure of the plot served to strengthen the position of the de' Medici. The Pazzi were banished from Florence."
flavor_tus.EVTOPTA4: "Seize their assets, imprison their families, execute the ringleaders.

# Duchy from the Pope
country_event = {
   id = flavor_tus.2
   title = "flavor_tus.EVTNAME2"
   desc = "flavor_tus.EVTDESC2"
   picture = POPE_PREACHING_eventPicture
 
   fire_only_once = yes
 
   trigger = {
     OR = {
       tag = FLO
       flag = TUS
     }
     government = republic
     NOT = {
       republican_tradition = 0.5
     }
     PAP = {
       has_opinion = {
         who = ROOT
         value = 100
       }
     }
   }
   mean_time_to_happen = {
     months = 6
   }
   option = { # accept
     name = "flavor_tus.EVTOPTA2"
     change_government = despotic_monarchy
     add_legitimacy = 50
     add_stability = -1
   }
   option = { # refuse
     name = "flavor_tus.EVTOPTB2"
     add_republican_tradition = 0.25
     add_stability = 1
   }
}

flavor_tus.EVTNAME2: "The Grand Duchy of Tuscany"
flavor_tus.EVTDESC2: "The Florentine Republic has become a contradiction. Nominally, it is ruled by its citizens. In practice, it is ruled by a small number of wealthy banking families. The institutions of the Republic are being eroded by corruption and nepotism, the current ruler a dictator in all but name. Fortunately His Holiness the Pope offers a solution to the confusion. Through secret channels, he has offered to grant our ruler the title of Grand Duke of Tuscany, and to support the nation in its institution of a new monarchy."
flavor_tus.EVTOPTA2: "The Republic has failed. Accept the offer."
flavor_tus.EVTOPTB2: "Refuse the crown"

 

[Gemellus]

Reasonable, and since Italy is getting an overhaul, super reasonable.

 

[Brodacious]

Just something fancier for my Savoy to annex.

 

[vfmikey]

I agree with the changes in provinces and introduction of new countries, but having Tuscany as a formable nation wouldn't really benefit EU4 in terms of gameplay, because players in that region will almost always form Italy instead.

But you can form the Savoia-Piedmonte whatever, so why not Tuscany?
Also, are the Two Sicilies formable?

 

[Sunspawn]

But you can form the Savoia-Piedmonte whatever, so why not Tuscany?
Also, are the Two Sicilies formable?

IIRC, no. VeF and M&T have it though.

 

[PiriReis]

IIRC, no. VeF and M&T have it though.

Two Sicilies are not formable in EU4.

 

[Sunspawn]

Two Sicilies are not formable in EU4.

You're quoting the wrong guy.

 

[lecobra92]

There are mechanics already in place to simulate the..."fall" of republics to monarchies. But it seems there may be context for a special event chain this place. However, perhaps instead of another potentially railroading event chain, maybe we can talk about looking into expanding papal mechanics and their interactions with secular princes, like say of a prince gets their dynastic line on the papacy they get a government upgrade or something. This would probably require expanded dynastic mechanics as well.

Please note I am not saying Tuscany/Florence does not deserve extra flavor. I personally think there should be an entire network of event chains tied to central and northern Italian states regarding he renaissance and the rise of humanism. This Could then be incorporated into a revamped tech system too that simulates the spread of these Ideals throughout Europe and the spread of which would be slowed by differing cultures and religions (revamped cultures and religions too wohoo).

But I digress. Of course Florence/ Tuscany deserves more attention as such an important center of this revolutionary movement, but let's also try and implement mechanics that place this awesome idea in context too.

Just my two cents

 

[Tacticus101]

But you can form the Savoia-Piedmonte whatever, so why not Tuscany?

Sardinia-Piedmont.

The biggest difference is that Sardinia-Piedmont is a full on tag switch, formable with multiple nations, whilst the Grand Duchy of Florence just adds a "grand" into the name, something that should be simulated within the new government ranks mechanic rather than an event.

 

[Golladan]

I think wiz said a while ago in a similar thread that their won't be two diffeent tags for Tuscany and fForence

Yeah. Wiz said it wasn't going to happen.

How I wish we had dynamic tags and flags.

Me too. Florence/Tuscany weren't the only ones that went through a name change. But Captain Gars said no.

"Vassals, Marches and non-Elector members of the HRE are always Duchy rank" (the Dev Diary)

I assumed that makes it possible to become a Grand Duchy (or Arch Duchy like Austria) considering that was historically the upgraded rank of a Duchy and being unable to become a kingdom when going up ranks. If not then at the very least is will remain a duchy, though I hope a future expansion of the system will add Grand Dutchies.

The are only three ranks. Duchy, Kingdom, and Empire. The localisations for the ranks and titles can be set for each country/culture/whatever if you want (for example, Byzantium Emperor would be Basileus while Ming's would probably be Emperor). But it's still just those 3 ranks.

Vassals, Marches, and non-Elector members of the HRE will be locked to Duchy rank. That just means that they won't be able to upgrade to Kingdom rank. That doesn't mean they are getting a new form of goverment that has 3 duchy ranks.

 

[Metz]

Sardinia-Piedmont.

The biggest difference is that Sardinia-Piedmont is a full on tag switch, formable with multiple nations, whilst the Grand Duchy of Florence just adds a "grand" into the name, something that should be simulated within the new government ranks mechanic rather than an event.

Duchy of Florence is a government switch from republic. Grand Duchy of Tuscany would be a tag switch.

 

[Tacticus101]

The are only three ranks. Duchy, Kingdom, and Empire. The localisations for the ranks and titles can be set for each country/culture/whatever if you want (for example, Byzantium Emperor would be Basileus while Ming's would probably be Emperor). But it's still just those 3 ranks.

Vassals, Marches, and non-Elector members of the HRE will be locked to Duchy rank. That just means that they won't be able to upgrade to Kingdom rank. That doesn't mean they are getting a new form of goverment that has 3 duchy ranks.

And like I said, I hope the system is expanded at some point.

But it still doesn't mean there should be an event for it, it should be something that, if it happens at all, is part of the mechanics.

 

[Metz]

There should also be County level governments. Counts as vassals will be Counts. Counts who are independent and in the HRE should be Landgraves, and Counts within the HRE with independent march status should be Margraves (arguable though, it could just be counts who are in the border of HRE touching non HRE provinces of rivals of Austria or whomever is the Emperor at the time and therefore get granted Margrave status.

 

[Wizzington]

For it to be worth the performance cost of another tag, there would have to be a substantial enough difference between Florence and Tuscany that isn't just 'gain one province, hit decision.' I also question whether anyone besides the AI would use the decision at all, considering it'd turn you into another monarchy.

 

[Metz]

For it to be worth the performance cost of another tag, there would have to be a substantial enough difference between Florence and Tuscany that isn't just 'gain one province, hit decision.'

Administrative tech level 10/14?

Or Florence controlling the Papal Curia?

Tuscany could also be formed by Siena and Pisa and whoever is of Tuscan culture. However if not possible then Tuscany should start and be Florence at game start.

What about those 4 Karelian revolters that gained tags?