It's based around being a character-driven medieval politics simulator, name not withstanding. As the early middle ages are still part of the medieval time frame I see no reason it would be inappropriate.
Petition for a 395AD Early Middle Ages expansion
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It's based around being a character-driven medieval politics simulator, name not withstanding. As the early middle ages are still part of the medieval time frame I see no reason it would be inappropriate.
Any timeframe which was heavily person based with a decentralised power structure and it's great at representing it. It lacks the economics to do the Victorian era or later well, but earlier than that people were always important, governments in the eu3 timeframe were perhaps a bit too centralised for it however.
Don't forget, we're talking about the game engine here, and half of what makes any paradox game is the events (which are always 100% moddable).
Replace moddable with easily changeable/cheap to change by the devs and it still applies.
Don't forget, we're talking about the game engine here, and half of what makes any paradox game is the events (which are always 100% moddable).
Replace moddable with easily changeable/cheap to change by the devs and it still applies.
600 years is pushing the timeline a bit too far for my taste. But, as others have mentioned, a pagan focused DLC that push back the timeline a few hundred years (maybe starting in about year 800 when Charlemagne started his reign), would be pretty great imo. 
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There should be a separate game called "Great Invasions and Migrations" set from around 400 AD to 1000 AD. It should be character driven and you should be leading different European people into different homelands with a view of establishing your family as the great dynasty. The game will naturally lead into CKII.
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All I ever want is playable pagans and start date 100 years earlier, right before Baptism of Poland.
Pagan Poland "uniting" Europe FTW!
Pagan Poland "uniting" Europe FTW!
It would take a lot of work to model the Great Migrations. Would certainly merit a new game, just on that basis. Not to mention all the hours of research for a completely sketchy time period.
I like the idea of a dark ages game and a Rome sequel, I think CKII could benefit from being pushed back 100-200 years if for no other reason than it would make a pagan DLC more worthwhile
The 600 year extension may be pushing it somewhat, but from 395 to 1066 you see the same trend in history - cultural individuality coming from Roman homogeneity.
The reason I believe this should be done on the CK2 engine is that it allows for 1000 years of continuous play (game could continue past 1066) and has the potential to model horde nations well (which is what the early Ostrogoths/Visigoths could be modelled as). I think the only thing which CK2 can't model well is complex democratic systems with true equality, where urban noble families don't dominate.
As I said, this would be advertised as a new game, whereas in reality it would be a standalone expansion. This allows Paradox to save time on developing too many new mechanics or trying to make the game seem unique by using what they already have in CK2 and accepting that they are two parts to the same game (complete Middle Ages).
The core new feature which this game would have is the rise of distinct cultures and population migrations. If Paradox can think of a way to add both to CK2, then I see no reason why not to go ahead and implement them as part of an early start date expansion.
To be fair, the reason I put the start date so far back is the appeal of trying to save the Western Roman Empire and it's nice continuity from EU:Rome
The reason I believe this should be done on the CK2 engine is that it allows for 1000 years of continuous play (game could continue past 1066) and has the potential to model horde nations well (which is what the early Ostrogoths/Visigoths could be modelled as). I think the only thing which CK2 can't model well is complex democratic systems with true equality, where urban noble families don't dominate.
As I said, this would be advertised as a new game, whereas in reality it would be a standalone expansion. This allows Paradox to save time on developing too many new mechanics or trying to make the game seem unique by using what they already have in CK2 and accepting that they are two parts to the same game (complete Middle Ages).
The core new feature which this game would have is the rise of distinct cultures and population migrations. If Paradox can think of a way to add both to CK2, then I see no reason why not to go ahead and implement them as part of an early start date expansion.
To be fair, the reason I put the start date so far back is the appeal of trying to save the Western Roman Empire and it's nice continuity from EU:Rome
Early migrations period when no stable kingdom survived for longer than a generation or two is pretty much impossible to do. The migrations themselves, as opposed to expansions, are the whole point of the period.
Once stuff began getting somewhat more stable in 600s and large-scale migration invasions ceased, this can be doable with current mechanics, providing pagans are being worked upon. The only issue is the magyars (oh noes, another attrition-free doomstack on the horizon).
Once stuff began getting somewhat more stable in 600s and large-scale migration invasions ceased, this can be doable with current mechanics, providing pagans are being worked upon. The only issue is the magyars (oh noes, another attrition-free doomstack on the horizon).
Well perhaps 600AD is a better start date. This would at least allow more scope for modding the game a couple of hundred years back while giving us the large part of the dark ages to play through. I still feel that earlier kingdoms can be modelled through historical events though.
Wow... what a mixed set of reactions. Congrats on making such a great case... you almost bought me in.
NO. I would have to disagree, unfortunately, for my own reasons, as everybody else did!
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RANT: the OP shown some classical western european pre-conception: not much is known(?), yeah right maybe about the politics in Europe!! (as state level forms of manifestations were probably inexisting until after the 800 - so you basically have a lot of tribal/gang like warbands kicking ass - SO NO, THE MAP IS NOT COMPATIBLE, for western europe city states are more recommendable than regional powers like counties/duchies); otherwise, muslim world was flourishing at that time and the byzantine had a continuous existence. Sure, some information got lost and IMO is not enough to make a game about this...
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I subscribe to those who thought that such a request is best suited for a remake of ROME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
PLS remake ROME first (the work done on CK2 and the new EU4 should help Pdox get great new ideas to add to Rome as well... would definitely want to play the improved version). The Dark Ages proposed here would fit so well into Rome (we can have stuff like people's migrations and how the BE coped with it, the formation of new states with the effect of barbarian migrations and MAYBE migration of people that didn't do so in history - under the fear of barbarians migrating to their own lands :d)... whatever. lot of ideas, but I would like to play an improved Rome much sooner than just this.
Also CK2 is not compatible with the Dark Ages in terms of armies and units, but a Rome continuation would be close to it (at least for states that survived the fall of the roman empire).
NO. I would have to disagree, unfortunately, for my own reasons, as everybody else did!
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RANT: the OP shown some classical western european pre-conception: not much is known(?), yeah right maybe about the politics in Europe!! (as state level forms of manifestations were probably inexisting until after the 800 - so you basically have a lot of tribal/gang like warbands kicking ass - SO NO, THE MAP IS NOT COMPATIBLE, for western europe city states are more recommendable than regional powers like counties/duchies); otherwise, muslim world was flourishing at that time and the byzantine had a continuous existence. Sure, some information got lost and IMO is not enough to make a game about this...
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I subscribe to those who thought that such a request is best suited for a remake of ROME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
PLS remake ROME first (the work done on CK2 and the new EU4 should help Pdox get great new ideas to add to Rome as well... would definitely want to play the improved version). The Dark Ages proposed here would fit so well into Rome (we can have stuff like people's migrations and how the BE coped with it, the formation of new states with the effect of barbarian migrations and MAYBE migration of people that didn't do so in history - under the fear of barbarians migrating to their own lands :d)... whatever. lot of ideas, but I would like to play an improved Rome much sooner than just this.
Also CK2 is not compatible with the Dark Ages in terms of armies and units, but a Rome continuation would be close to it (at least for states that survived the fall of the roman empire).
I'd like to see two new Paradox games, one for 200-600, and one for 600-1000. With the former you start in the 3rd Century crisis and so Rome has a chance to fall earlier or later than historically. The latter game would begin basically with the Islamic conquests which are so important that it merits splitting the timeframe in half.
Sigh. The world has like a thousand games about Rome, but aside the King Arthur fairytales with dragons and wizards, only one about Dark Ages. And pretty awful one at that.
I would like a Rome sequel, as I though they were doing it when they announced EUIV. It would also certainly be possible to make something interesting of a Rome game, and then the Dark Ages need love. They should however make a mechanic for the Byzantine Empire since feudalism wouldn't do in that case.
I really think you shouldn't fear the fear of Islam. Rome 1 finished some years after the birth of Jesus, and I think a game during the lifespan of Muhammad shouldn't be excluded because some people would take offend of it.
I really think you shouldn't fear the fear of Islam. Rome 1 finished some years after the birth of Jesus, and I think a game during the lifespan of Muhammad shouldn't be excluded because some people would take offend of it.
I'd rather have a full game such as EU Rome 2 which should span from the Roman Kingdom to the Arab Conquests.
That would be ridiculous. 395 would need a completely different game, it can't be anything like Crusader Kings 2. That's like asking for a 1066 start for EU3 or a 1796 start for HoI:III.
