People who think that we need events, CORE or other hardcodings.

[Maximilian I]

Uhm, to perhaps try a little "what if", as in let my try to play a "kinder" Germany and see what happenes. My plan was to perhaps get the allies to attack Soviet or something, unfortunatly it didn't go that far before I was DOW'ed.

Anyway, I can't believe you would use that as a counter-argument. I used it as an example of the shortcomings of HoI. Nothing more.

well, it was already mentioned that diplomacy got a huge overhaul. I wouldn´t know what would hinder you to play a peacefull germany in hoi2. you´re arguing about hoi1 problems.

 

[Maximilian I]

What is my ultimate goal? That when the year 1943 rolls in, I as Germany after a succesfull Sealöwe and Barbarossa can diplomatically annex Austria, which I failed in 1938 as they were locked in a war with Yogoslavia. I want to be able to play Turkey and join WWII, I want to be able to play Ireland and unify the Emerald Isle under a fascist banner.

please have a look at the developer interviews:

1) there will be internal policy, so you might eventually turn ireland into a fascist state over time . however it will not be completely free: johan said turning the soviet union into a democracy will take longer than the game time.

2) as you have more control over interior policy you will be able to move towards your preferred allegiance and e.g. as turkey join the fascist or communist cause.

3) there will be minor alliances which may , if lead correctly evolve to a major power.


all this has been posted in the confirmed info thread, so I absolutely don´t understand what all this yelling is about.

 

[Galleblære]

well, it was already mentioned that diplomacy got a huge overhaul. I wouldn´t know what would hinder you to play a peacefull germany in hoi2. you´re arguing about hoi1 problems.

Well, I don't have HoI2 now do I? I was pointing out faults in HoI and hoping this would be improved in the sequal. So there way you shrug off the problem is not appreciated. It was a problem in HoI. It could still be a problem in HoI2 untill we are (hopefully) told otherwise.

My arguement: A HoI2 game that takes into account the actions of the players, so that if the player behaves ahistorically, the AI will have playsible ahistorical reactions to it. (IE if the player goes for a democratic Germany, the allies shouldn't attack.)

Your argument: I "I vehemently disagree".

I never said I wanted an unhistoric WWII, I said I wanted a WWII grand strategic game/simulation that is dynamic enough to be innovative when given unhistoric situations, and not have events that "force" things back on track just for the sake of it.

 

[Maximilian I]

My arguement: A HoI2 game that takes into account the actions of the players, so that if the player behaves ahistorically, the AI will have playsible ahistorical reactions to it. (IE if the player goes for a democratic Germany, the allies shouldn't attack.)

Your argument: I "I vehemently disagree".

no, sorry to correct you: but this was not I what I quoted in my reply... you argued that the game engine should be able to simulate complex siuations:

I believe the original poster and I agree on one thing, that we wish a dynamic engine that can handle complex situations without constant events to guide them along historic paths.

with this I disagree, and this is what I quoted. even if the diplo engine is now more dynamic, it won´t be able to handle stuff like the M-R pact or the Munich treaty. it is not possible to handle those things with a gameengine alone. my question how a "dynamic engine" could handle those very complex situations remained unanswered.

have a look at developer interviews and you´ll see that you´ll receive a much more dynamic engine.

 

[unmerged(25612)]

please have a look at the developer interviews:

1) there will be internal policy, so you might eventually turn ireland into a fascist state over time . however it will not be completely free: johan said turning the soviet union into a democracy will take longer than the game time.

2) as you have more control over interior policy you will be able to move towards your preferred allegiance and e.g. as turkey join the fascist or communist cause.

3) there will be minor alliances which may , if lead correctly evolve to a major power.


all this has been posted in the confirmed info thread, so I absolutely don´t understand what all this yelling is about.

Two notes:

1.Note the dates on the old posts. Back in June with no screenies or anything it was a bit different.

2.All that still does not mean that I can diplo-annex, have civilwars or anything of the sort.



But to have something more agreeable: I, too, do not understand what all this yelling is about. Back in June it had more importance. BACK IN JUNE (Note, note, note).


At first I thought: "Wow my old thread back in action" then when I saw the replies and posted my first reply I was all: "Oh my, oh my not this again".... But now I am more of a "FFS please please all shut the duck up and please let this thread die, like it did two months ago!!!"


What did I do wrong on this thread? I was offensive, one-minded and populist. It made people react. That was my goal back then. As for now, I and the AhA is in the phase of building reputation and respect as a true community of like minded people voicing their concerns.


The resurrection of this thread.... It is something like bringing up the jail-institution back round up in a "Hail Australia" - convenction.




So as one whole plea, I would like to see this thread as a part of HOI2 history, and not as a still-living peace of hostility.



And on top of all things I`ve got the flue, tons of homework to do and gazillions of other things going around... So I don`t wish to come back here and say "Read the dates" each time a person posts something countering my arguments here.


Why was there not a new thread formed? Perhaps someone took the "Search before posting" to the limit.... I don`t know.... It is not that I do not wish to stop this discussion from taking place, but I do not wish to be turned into the scapegoat for all the possible insultation.


I don`t know if I wanted this closed or something, preferrably yes. Or just everyone respecting it as a part of history that a meaning back then, instead of a new thread...




Maybe I am taking this too seriously... Another twist in the neverending rollercoaster of life passing the slippery slopes of teenagerism?


Oh well I`ll just be quiet now, self-cencor myself out and go play with some other thread...

 

[coreymas]

Idealist,

Thank you for your honest and very forthcoming comments. It takes alot of guts to say what you have just said. Hats off to you.

Since you were the birthmother of this thread, and you would like it to go into Oblivion, my suggestion is to send a private message to Vulture or Maximilian I requesting that they close this thread.

I hope that you feel better, that all of your homework gets done soon so that you can rejoin us here with your more than worthy and well thought of ideas.

Corey

 

[Galleblære]

This will be my last post on the subject, but just to clear up some stuff here:

My arguement: A HoI2 game that takes into account the actions of the players, so that if the player behaves ahistorically, the AI will have playsible ahistorical reactions to it. (IE if the player goes for a democratic Germany, the allies shouldn't attack.)

Your argument: I "I vehemently disagree"..

no, sorry to correct you: but this was not I what I quoted in my reply... you argued that the game engine should be able to simulate complex siuations:.

Uhm...this is my original post:

....I believe the original poster and I agree on one thing, that we wish a dynamic engine that can handle complex situations without constant events to guide them along historic paths. Said dynamic engine should also then compensate if the player does something really unhistoric, like giving the power back to the people of germany. If Germany doesn't do any agressive moves or acts, the west shouldn't react. But in HoI it does.

Similarly, it is annoying to see Germany declare war on Norway in the "Great War" mod....a WWI mod! Probably due to some hardcoded stuff.

So you DID in fact disagree with my notion that a peaceful Germany should not be attacked like it was in HoI, which caused some confusion on my part.

with this I disagree, and this is what I quoted. even if the diplo engine is now more dynamic, it won´t be able to handle stuff like the M-R pact or the Munich treaty. it is not possible to handle those things with a gameengine alone. my question how a "dynamic engine" could handle those very complex situations remained unanswered.

have a look at developer interviews and you´ll see that you´ll receive a much more dynamic engine.

I see no reason why "complex stuff" like the MR pact couldn't be handeled with an engine with a well scripted AI for instance. But MR aside, again, hopefully those events and the game can be advanced enough to not trigger if certain conditions are not met etc.

If the AI remains "static" in response to innovative human moves (on the grand scale), it will loose out big time in the end.

A human player turning the US into a fascist state? Should trigger some alarming actions in the democratic world etc.

 

[Sera]

I'm very much for some events atleasts. Wouldn't Japan be severely disadvantaged if they were unable to do a repeat of Pearl Harbor for instance?

 

[J.J.E.]

I'm very much for some events atleasts. Wouldn't Japan be severely disadvantaged if they were unable to do a repeat of Pearl Harbor for instance?

Actually there were no Pearl Harbor event in HoI.