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CatilinamSum

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Judaism is one of the most bare-bones religions in the game, having few unique features outside of the ability to restore Israel. Because its holy sites are held by powerful Muslim rulers in almost every start date, Jews struggle with Moral Authority and are plagued by ongoing religious and heretic revolts. And because Jews (understandably) don't have a monastic society, they have no way to effectively convert their provinces.

My small suggestion - the decision to Celebrate Passover should grant a small amount of Moral Authority every time it is taken by a Jewish ruler of Count or higher rank. Think +1% for 5 years. Over time, this would allow Moral Authority to reach the 40-50% necessary for reliable conversion. Large Jewish empires, even distant from their holy sites, could use this to cultivate high moral authority.

If necessary, this change could be fine-tuned by removing the Moral Authority gain once Israel has been restored.
 
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Tryvenyal

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I think all organised religions should have different flavorful ways to bundle up a minimum of 30% MA from holy sites and this mechanic combined. That, together with "Organized Religion" + 20 MA% modifier would give a bottom base of 50% MA if maximum used. For each holy site the religion controls, the less bonus can be stacked with these features - as the max from them combined is 30. So when holding having +30 or more from Holy Sites, this mechanism is not giving MA. If Religion has +20 from holy sites and +10 from this mechanic and conquer a 3rd holy site, it directly loses the +10 from this mechanism. And these modifiers should ofc be timeboxed and need to be renewed.

It should not be too easy ofc. Nor cheep. Nor should the actual MA% be considered, just the base bonus from holy sites. Though cost could maybe go down with higher MA%.

OP suggestion could definatly be the Jewish way of doing this. Support :)
 

Metanetwork

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A button to boost morale authority does nothing to make a religion less boring (in fact I'd say it's even more boring). As a jewish ruler, your holy war casus belli is valid against the entire world, for +3% each time. Restoring Israel is easy even at ridiculously low morale authority (which mechanically is a compensation for conquering lots of provinces. Isolated religions should have low morale authority).

In regard to province conversion, it's normal that the Israelite religion group had a hard time to convert provinces because historically it did. It was never a proselytic religion unlike Christianity and Islam. However, they actually should have a monastic order (the Nazirites) after building the Third Temple. A Nazirite is a jewish ascetic who abstains from alcohol, grapes, and cutting their hair. In the middle age, this lifestyle was disapproved and some of its ritual obligations couldn't be fulfilled since they required the Temple, but it fits the scope of a CK2 society. A current alternative is to adopt an heresy, secretly convert to the parent religion and use a secret religious cult to convert your provinces. Gamey, but less boring than clicking a button once per year.
 

CatilinamSum

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A button to boost morale authority does nothing to make a religion less boring (in fact I'd say it's even more boring). As a jewish ruler, your holy war casus belli is valid against the entire world, for +3% each time. Restoring Israel is easy even at ridiculously low morale authority (which mechanically is a compensation for conquering lots of provinces. Isolated religions should have low morale authority).

In regard to province conversion, it's normal that the Israelite religion group had a hard time to convert provinces because historically it did. It was never a proselytic religion unlike Christianity and Islam. However, they actually should have a monastic order (the Nazirites) after building the Third Temple. A Nazirite is a jewish ascetic who abstains from alcohol, grapes, and cutting their hair. In the middle age, this lifestyle was disapproved and some of its ritual obligations couldn't be fulfilled since they required the Temple, but it fits the scope of a CK2 society. A current alternative is to adopt an heresy, secretly convert to the parent religion and use a secret religious cult to convert your provinces. Gamey, but less boring than clicking a button once per year.

It might not do anything to make Judaism less boring, but it'd at least be something. Anyone can get high MA by the method you describe, but if you're roleplaying as opposed to powergaming, you won't be mindlessly declaring holy wars at every opportunity you get. Sometimes, I just don't want to expand to a certain area or or ruin my clean borders.

I disagree - isolated religions should NOT necessarily have low moral authority. There are many historical examples of religions which have survived and thrived far from their "holy land." If we're using the logic Judaism does, then all of Christianity's biggest holy sites should be places of biblical significance in the Levant. They're understandably not, because there are plenty of holy christian places outside of the Middle East. But by the same logic, look at Russian Orthodoxy; it didn't devolve into random heresies or revert to paganism after the Byzantines were gone. Buddhism had great success far from India long after it had already been supplanted in its place of origin. Manichaeism, too, even found converts many miles from Persia.

The whole concept of moral authority is kinda broken. I get what you're saying about the religion's non-proselytizing nature, but this is already reflected in the Jewish AI's unwillingness to select the "convert province" mission. Ironically, I've already done what you mentioned in regards to secret conversion; I did it with pre-reformable Bon paganism, too. It's gamey as hell and not really satisfying for that reason. I just wish there was a way to reliably, legitimately convert provinces.

On that note, I can definitely get behind a Jewish monastic society. Honestly, if all religions had one, I wouldn't raise any objections about the current moral authority system; the ability to build at least a few coreligionist provinces would be enough for me.
 

Blk82

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Holding an commanded annual religious festival is hardly a reason to give a moral authority bonus. Christian rulers would be celebrating Easter and Christmas, and other religions would be celebrating their holidays.
 

Silversweeeper

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I doubt it would be balanced to have Passover give any meaningful amount of MA. Sure, the Jewish religion isn't in a strong position in any start, but if it grows to become a bigger player (which probably will happen if the human player is playing a Jewish game and doesn't lose early (and isn't intentionally playing tall)) it suddenly becomes possible for many different rulers to apply the MA boost, which effectively would mean that base MA is higher. For example, using the proposed +1 % MA for 5 years boost, a Jewish realm with 10 count+ vassals (which would be achievable without blobbing particularly much; just the de jure of k_abyssinia is 22 counties) where the average vassal celebrates passover roughly once per 5 years would contribute an average +10 % MA boost (which is comparable to the boost from winning a GHW), and if a single ruler can apply the MA boost more than once the boost from those 10 rulers could reach +50 % MA.

Sure, you could add some limit like "The Passover MA boost can only happen if MA is below X %", but it would also be rather arbitrary if only Passover gave such boosts. Why would Jewish MA improve from Passover when various Muslim faiths don't get an MA boost from Ramadan (and when Christians don't even get to celebrate their main religious holidays)? I don't think "The Jewish faith starts weak and doesn't have a lot of flavour" is sufficient justification for making their holiday celebration more holy than someone else's, since the weak starting position is historically accurate and an MA boost doesn't add flavour.