We do not know how many complaints are sent to Paradox via Steam or other ways and not via this forum
Paradox... please ...
- Thread starter Apollyonna
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I remember standing in line in the cold for 2 hours and getting my hands on the last 3 copies while fighting a fat pig, and then getting home and standing for three days crying in front of the monitor while pressing F5. But I still got suckered into buying their expansion and playing EU4 instead.
yes we have literally no way of know if there are more or less there could be 10 thousand more complaints that just don't come through here or there could literally be 0, but since we can't possibly know I'm gonna assume the more or less random assortment of people on this forum fill out a reasonably balanced sample size of different computer set ups to serve as a basis for data on what percentage of the community are suffering these issues
Remember when Paradox released the 1.13 beta and the forums were filled with complaints about how the beta had a lot of bugs? Because I do.
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Was the game bug-free before launch? Was the game EVER truly bug free? If no amount of mass play cures all the possible ails, then logically, one has to realize that no amount of beta testing and QA work will either. It's just one of those things I tend to expect when I play a complex game. I assume all MMOs will have bugs always, and I expect as much from the bigger GSGs like these ones. I have no doubt it could be done better, but this idea of a perfect or nearly bug free game just doesn't hold up. It's kind of sucky but it is totally par for the course across the board. I mean shit, my friends are trying to talk me back to an Everquest server next week, and they apparently can't get that 2 decade old game's classic server bug-free.
Having white knighted last paragraph, let's be totally honest here man - Diablo III's launch was remembered for the queues and server BS, yes, but also for record-breaking sales. It's a completely apples and oranges comparison to Cossacks. The lingering bugs and issues post-beta for D3 would have probably been ignored if not for the horrendous server crashes and queues.
Having white knighted last paragraph, let's be totally honest here man - Diablo III's launch was remembered for the queues and server BS, yes, but also for record-breaking sales. It's a completely apples and oranges comparison to Cossacks. The lingering bugs and issues post-beta for D3 would have probably been ignored if not for the horrendous server crashes and queues.
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I'm at the moment studying IT, as a System Developer and Programmer, and one of the big problems we always have, is that when we got a huge system, with a lot of features, if we want this system to run the same each time, then the environment(the computes it will be running on) have to be nearly the same for each run.
And here is the problem for Paradox: They make a game thats run on thousands of different system setups. So even if they have like 1000 different environments then we would still see a LOT of craches that they wouldn't even have a chance to test out in any possible way.
Paradox games have ALOT of features, and more is added with each DLC and major patch, this make it so we can enjoy a game thats different each time, and we can play over and over again, without it ever becoming the boring or dull.
But.. it make it very hard for Paradox to test it, or even let it be tested. Because, even if you have 2000 beta testers playing the game, then you would still have the problem that those 2000 people wouldn't get every possible feature tested for every possible nation, situation, or environment. The system and amount of features is simply to big.
What Paradox can do, with the limited time, and cash, it have available, is to take care of the biggest and most frequent bugs/crashes, and then look up the bug reports when they come in.
Its not the best scenario. But without unlimited cash, time and testers, its the only thing you can do. And from time to time its a ungrateful job to be a developer or publisher when sending out a game or system that you feel is great, but a few hours later you have like 5 full forum pages of threads with bug reports: Back to work.
What we players can do, is to take this as a chance for us to help the team make this game even better.
If we post bug reports, we help the team makes it easier for them to fix the crashes and bugs, and maybe.. maybe, it can free up a bit of time for the developers to add new stuff to a great game.
And here is the problem for Paradox: They make a game thats run on thousands of different system setups. So even if they have like 1000 different environments then we would still see a LOT of craches that they wouldn't even have a chance to test out in any possible way.
Paradox games have ALOT of features, and more is added with each DLC and major patch, this make it so we can enjoy a game thats different each time, and we can play over and over again, without it ever becoming the boring or dull.
But.. it make it very hard for Paradox to test it, or even let it be tested. Because, even if you have 2000 beta testers playing the game, then you would still have the problem that those 2000 people wouldn't get every possible feature tested for every possible nation, situation, or environment. The system and amount of features is simply to big.
What Paradox can do, with the limited time, and cash, it have available, is to take care of the biggest and most frequent bugs/crashes, and then look up the bug reports when they come in.
Its not the best scenario. But without unlimited cash, time and testers, its the only thing you can do. And from time to time its a ungrateful job to be a developer or publisher when sending out a game or system that you feel is great, but a few hours later you have like 5 full forum pages of threads with bug reports: Back to work.
What we players can do, is to take this as a chance for us to help the team make this game even better.
If we post bug reports, we help the team makes it easier for them to fix the crashes and bugs, and maybe.. maybe, it can free up a bit of time for the developers to add new stuff to a great game.
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No one expects bug free release - only people that believe in Santa Claus do or those that never work on IT project. BUT big butt - we have here some really major problems (i`m excluding those small UI bugs or random ruler into general) we are talking about CTD which is for sure introduced with this version, we are talking about non working saves, broken ironman games and new environment with the estates that is very tedious to menage. Personally i will stick to republics till some fixes on estates are done.
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...How is that last one even a bug? Now you're just complaining about "things in the game I personally don't like". The other two are damned pertinent, sure, but I'd also be willing to bet dollars to donuts that Paradox is actively working on fixing those pertinent bugs.
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1.13: came after Common Sense (which in itself Paradox consider smaller than Cossacks, even only considered paid for features.) 1.14 came on Cossacks. Youtubers were allowed to play the Cossacks a week before, and the devs tried the game themselves a lot. Also, a beta for a major expansion with DLC could work really weirdly. Would they release the free patch as a beta a week before (so the Cossacks would come even later,) then perhaps fix a lot of bugs, just to gain many new ones at the expansion release? This just seems like too much work and restriction for too small an amount of good. Then the Cossack players would have to wait yet another week? I'd prefer to be able to play the expansion, even with a few bugs. Most of them seems to only ruin ironman games, either because of directly disabling achievements, or because they can be fixed with a simple command in normal games. In my opinion, the best thing to do would to have two expansion releases, both costing the same amount of money. The first would warn people of bugs, while the other, a week or two after, would have far less bugs. While the problem stands, I'd recommend either playing without ironman, or go backwards to before the update.
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And one more thing for me then I will let it rest
major bugs are different for each player.
I consider major bugs either those that break the game (i.e. crashes), or severely impact the fun I am having in playing a game. If I have no longer any fun due to new but badly implemented mechanics then I will stop playing. Someone might consider the new zone of control (in 1.14) to be a major issue, I can work around that in the meantime. But rebels galore, debt ridden nations left and right, including myself at times, estate whack-a-mole-pop-ups, ottomans killing everything around them with a 20k stack are just a few but on the top of my head enough to stop enjoying game-play for now (as I said, for me).
You cannot generalise 'major bugs', you may not have game crashes but those that do are, I am quite sure, very frustrated after buying the DLC, and rightfully so. Whether or not they can test it on all configurations, obviously not. But I have a feeling that a lot of these crashes have nothing to do with configurations of PCs but rather poor coding/poorly implemented features
major bugs are different for each player.
I consider major bugs either those that break the game (i.e. crashes), or severely impact the fun I am having in playing a game. If I have no longer any fun due to new but badly implemented mechanics then I will stop playing. Someone might consider the new zone of control (in 1.14) to be a major issue, I can work around that in the meantime. But rebels galore, debt ridden nations left and right, including myself at times, estate whack-a-mole-pop-ups, ottomans killing everything around them with a 20k stack are just a few but on the top of my head enough to stop enjoying game-play for now (as I said, for me).
You cannot generalise 'major bugs', you may not have game crashes but those that do are, I am quite sure, very frustrated after buying the DLC, and rightfully so. Whether or not they can test it on all configurations, obviously not. But I have a feeling that a lot of these crashes have nothing to do with configurations of PCs but rather poor coding/poorly implemented features
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I've had 2 bugs, 1 I myself classify as minor (invisible UI background on provinces, but the functionality is still there; just hard to see), and 1 more major (all the buttons disappeared from the country panel - navigation and otherwise). I can play with the first, while the second - not so much.
However, I expect bugs with EP patches, and especially major ones, and I trust Paradox to fix things as soon as they can. I can wait.
However, I expect bugs with EP patches, and especially major ones, and I trust Paradox to fix things as soon as they can. I can wait.
I asked the CK2 team this, they said they "don't do a lot of automated testing" which kind of explains a lot.
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...he-qa-team-on-ck2.887625/page-4#post-20113280
So, four hours ago, Paradox released the SECOND hotfix in three days for the 1.14 patch. So where exactly is everyone getting off saying they don't fix bugs, or demanding the hotfix now now now?
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They are doing great work hotfixing and are working and listening to the forums till late at night. That's great and awesome.
Still, that week of havoc could have been avoided by some weeks of beta testing. Less pressure for Paradox, since there's no need to fix asap, less frustration for players because less bugs once it's released. I still fail to see the disadvantage of this...
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IRC main problems with D3 where server capacity and Desing flaws not Actuall bugs - but it has been a long time maybe i am missremembering.
They have a closed beta process already. This means that a significant number of experienced players were playing this game and reporting bugs but they obviously got unlucky and didn't come across the crash to desktop issue because I doubt they would have gone live if they had found that during the beta testing.
The memory leak with the UI is different. They clearly knew about that before they went live because some of the pre-streams from @DDRJake and others showed that problem happening. The decision was taken to go live with that problem in game because a reload tended to fix it but they should probably have warned people about it when releasing the patch.
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Not everyone has the same bugs which is very frustrating.
For the developers to try and figure out why and fix them, but also for users, especially here on the forum. People who are simply lucky enough only to have minor bugs do not always understand the frustration of others when the game does not do what it is supposed to.
Nobody is saying that they do not fix bugs.
Deleted saves, repeated CTDs, no backup saves as 'promised', etc... even after the midnight hotfix... if you don't get them, good for you. But don't dismiss the concerns of others please
Frankly fixing the ZOC 'problem' which for some people was the major bug, to me would have been low on the list of things to fix right away.
For the developers to try and figure out why and fix them, but also for users, especially here on the forum. People who are simply lucky enough only to have minor bugs do not always understand the frustration of others when the game does not do what it is supposed to.
Nobody is saying that they do not fix bugs.
Deleted saves, repeated CTDs, no backup saves as 'promised', etc... even after the midnight hotfix... if you don't get them, good for you. But don't dismiss the concerns of others please
Frankly fixing the ZOC 'problem' which for some people was the major bug, to me would have been low on the list of things to fix right away.
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