Paradox Office Multiplayer Campaign V

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Viperswhip

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This is understandable, but the problem is that Johan(Mughals) is basically giving the game away to Yonaz(Bahmanis). And nobody is trying to stop it.

We don't know the relationship between the two at the office heh

The Mughals have not had the power to take out Bahamanis ever, Ming at the start was AI. The Ottos were on the far side of him, allied with everyone, and the Mamluks also bordered him and the Ottos would want revenge and the Russians had already been attacked by them in the past. It was an evolving story and you are missing the context.
 

MCBC6

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We don't know the relationship between the two at the office heh

The Mughals have not had the power to take out Bahamanis ever, Ming at the start was AI. The Ottos were on the far side of him, allied with everyone, and the Mamluks also bordered him and the Ottos would want revenge and the Russians had already been attacked by them in the past. It was an evolving story and you are missing the context.
Not to sound rude, but I do in fact know the context. But you figure that somebody would want to do something about it, instead of an exchange of victory cards. Hopefully (although obviously it's never this simple) people can put aside any past transgressions and put a stop to Bahmanid dominance.
 
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blackchoas

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Mughals and Bahamanis can likely both get a trophy so long as they work together, the real question now is will everyone else allow GB to be the other winner or will other people agree to stop GB maybe still a hope for Italy or a last minute surge from Mamelukes
 

Frogbait

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Bit off topic to the current train of thought, but does anyone else really miss Wiz in the after game talks?
 
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wingren013

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Not to sound rude, but I do in fact know the context. But you figure that somebody would want to do something about it, instead of an exchange of victory cards. Hopefully (although obviously it's never this simple) people can put aside any past transgressions and put a stop to Bahmanid dominance.

If the Mughals beat up Bahmanis then they will rise to number1 when they grab their victory cards. That's pretty much the only reason they would betray them and a that point you are just trading one winner for another.
 

Dagda

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This is understandable, but the problem is that Johan(Mughals) is basically giving the game away to Yonaz(Bahmanis). And nobody is trying to stop it.

More like Yonaz is the only reason Johan is still in play for top 3. He could have easily crushed the Mughals by now tbh.

Johan played it smart by trying to ride the Bahmanis coattails to top 3.
 

Serpent

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I understand what you are saying here, but umm, you are forgetting there is more than 3 people playing. Bahmanis never did anything to create waves, which means there was no animosity, which means not everyone, ie Russia, Bohemia, or anyone who was not in the top 4 at the time, would get on board, and if France sent the 100k men down there to actually make a difference, they would come back to a fully sieged country.

That's the reality of a large multiplayer game, if you go to fight in a distant land, you will suffer. Even England can't really do it, Bahamanis has too many ships, if there is a significant naval battle, or there ever was one since Bahamanis was in first, England's fleet would be damaged to the point that France and Italy's fleets (once they were significant), would be able to land troops on the now vacant England.

In single player the AI is not great at figuring out that nobody is home, players don't really have that problem.

Well, the Mamluks, Mughals and Bahmanis could easily march their armies over to Europe to fight in the British war against France, and they hardly suffered for that. Now, rather than a grand coalition against the Bahmanis or another one-sided beat-down against Italy and France it would be a lot more interesting and realistic to see two relatively balanced coalitions squaring off against each others in the final decades of the game. If only for our entertainment.

I don't really care who wins. Score in Eu4 means very little, and victory cards nothing at all. I'm far more interested in how well they play and how enjoyable their actions are to watch. Sure, they are playing for a trophy, but I'm not watching for one. ;)

More like Yonaz is the only reason Johan is still in play for top 3. He could have easily crushed the Mughals by now tbh.
Johan played it smart by trying to ride the Bahmanis coattails to top 3.

Smart, but boring and very gamy. They really should ban the voluntary exchanges of victory cards, since trading victory cards defeats the reason they added that feature to the game in the first place, which was to break up "hugboxes".
 
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Viperswhip

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Well, the Mamluks, Mughals and Bahmanis could easily march their armies over to Europe to fight in the British war against France, and they hardly suffered for that. Now, rather than a grand coalition against the Bahmanis or another one-sided beat-down against Italy and France it would be a lot more interesting and realistic to see two relatively balanced coalitions squaring off against each others in the final decades of the game. If only for our entertainment.

I don't really care who wins. Score in Eu4 means very little, and victory cards nothing at all. I'm far more interested in how well they play and how enjoyable their actions are to watch. Sure, they are playing for a trophy, but I'm not watching for one. ;)

Smart, but boring and very gamy. They really should ban the voluntary exchanges of victory cards, since trading victory cards defeats the reason they added that feature to the game in the first place, which was to break up "hugboxes".

Bahmanis sent half of their army, not all of it, and that was enough to face Ming, the only threat in the area, which is not the case for any Europeans leaving their lands behind, who have more than one enemy close by. Ming is bordered by the Mughals as well, meaning he can't attack either one of the allies without getting stomped by the Bahmanis army that remained at home.
 

wingren013

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I'm curious, what is the worst thing that could possibly happen in a fair, single peace deal towards Bahmanis?

Everyone in the world declaring a seperate war and taking or releasing 100% warscore worth of provinces.
 

CassCD

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Everyone in the world declaring a seperate war and taking or releasing 100% warscore worth of provinces.
Perhaps I should have emphasized the word "fair" a bit more. :p. Basically, all I'm wondering is if a single 100% deal can deal enough damage to bring down the Bahmani behemoth.
 

wingren013

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Perhaps I should have emphasized the word "fair" a bit more. :p. Basically, all I'm wondering is if a single 100% deal can deal enough damage to bring down the Bahmani behemoth.

Kick out of first? Yes. Kick out of the top three? Maybe.
 

JoanK

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No, I don't think it's possible to kick them out of the Top 3. Have you seen that accumulated score?

I mean it is, I just don't really think it's feasible.
 

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Assuming Bahmanis wins, why is Yonaz eligible for the trophy anyway? He started as Poland and was destroyed. Surely somebody who is destroyed and given a second country to play with shouldn't be allowed to win the game overall?
 
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CassCD

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Assuming Bahmanis wins, why is Yonaz eligible for the trophy anyway? He started as Poland and was destroyed. Surely somebody who is destroyed and given a second country to play with shouldn't be allowed to win the game overall?
Does less than 50 years of irrecoverable devastation seriously trump hundreds of years worth of Bahmani build-up to you? To move on to a second nation is to take a step backwards, the other players had the advantage of more time and effort and Yonaz overcame that to an astounding degree.
 
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londoner247

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Does less than 50 years of irrecoverable devastation seriously trump hundreds of years worth of Bahmani build-up to you? To move on to a second nation is to take a step backwards, the other players had the advantage of more time and effort and Yonaz overcame that to an astounding degree.

He got reincarnated in an isolated country surrounded by AI nations he could gobble up. His only human nearby was Johan who couldn't risk getting into a one-on-one fight with him because it would have left Johan exposed to attack from the Ottomans or Russia so it was in Johan's interest to agree a non-aggression pact with him.

So, yes, I do think that his early failure is relevant because after that he stopped playing a multiplayer game and had hundreds of years of a single player game.
 
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CassCD

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He got reincarnated in an isolated country surrounded by AI nations he could gobble up. His only human nearby was Johan who couldn't risk getting into a one-on-one fight with him because it would have left Johan exposed to attack from the Ottomans or Russia so it was in Johan's interest to agree a non-aggression pact with him.

So, yes, I do think that his early failure is relevant because after that he stopped playing a multiplayer game and had hundreds of years of a single player game.
He was effectively playing a "single player game" because the others were treating him as if he were. A result of European and African infighting, on one hand, and complacency among the other Asian players, on the other. This isn't Yonaz's fault, it's theirs. As of right now, everybody is too afraid of being backstabbed by their neighbours in order to deal with the biggest threat in the game. Trust is irrelevant in this situation, if they really want to put a stop to Bahmanis, they need to put aside their differences right this instant. They need to get over their situational problems and deal with it. From what I hear, such is the problem in any MP game.

I suppose in reflecting on this, you're right but only partially, I believe. It's less of a credit to Yonaz but a discredit to everyone else. (No offense intended, Devs. :p). And I seriously can't think of a reason why this should disqualify Yonaz from a trophy, he's "earning" it as a result of everybody else letting him have it.
 
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yonaz

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With risk of being a bit biased towars my own benefit, it is not always the best option to just gather a grand coalition and go for the nr1 all the time. You have to think on your own situation afterwards and what YOU actually gain on it. The guy in nr2 spot should probably think twice about it.

There is always also a big web of deals/alliances going across the entire globe behind the scenes. So it isn't always as easy to attack certain targets as it might seem.
Many people also care about their words and promises they have given, which might be smart for future campaigns.

I think GB for example chosed a good diplomatic choice by actually asking my alliance for help, instead of joining a coalition against us. He would probably never have passed either France nor Italy otherwise. Same goes for Mughals who needed to pass them in score.

Also if lets say 3 countries co-operate in order to try and get trophies, it might be wise to not start a fight internally for which trophy you get or you might not get anything at all.
 
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