Paradox Lounge (Off-Topic)

[unmerged(9770)]

what the herbal vodka said i.e. Noble name, Richard of York, wealthy peasant name Thomas Smith.

but again, monks, poets etc. indeed often used the noble form hehe

well, all has it`s reasons


poets - it`s quite obvious - their works travelled and it also was important to know "who is who". In the same moment the poet could be known with the diffrent name in his city. ( like nobles - Rene d`Anjou on the battefield or Rene Le Bel in his domain ).

monks - well, when all leave their homes and join the monastery - it`s easiest to name theirselves with name of your origin place isn`t it?

 

[unmerged(9770)]

I understand. But priests of lowly origin were still usually named after their birthplace or some other place that had significance in their lives. A peasant moving to another village (ordered by his lord or because the village was destroyed, etc) got to be named after the place he came from. Also, we already have third estate in France, and they travel alright. Further, as in the case of Martial d'Auvergne, his original surname was dropped in favour of the name of his place of birth.

Though I don't know the link, François Velde of the Heraldica.org has a treatise there explaining why the "de" doesn't imply nobility right away, and why the lack of "de" doesn't imply that someone isn't noble.

yes I know. I think we are in some way between "fixed" surnames and names given if they are needed in these times.

 

[unmerged(18481)]

yes I know. I think we are in some way between "fixed" surnames and names given if they are needed in these times.

Bingo .

 

[Hawkeye1489]

EDIT: Pet, I do know the pain. I'm trying to compile a list of all dioceses since... a year?

Well, I just made up a couple, hope that was ok, considering I had to ''create'' a few things for my court, Archbishop Henri Cardinal de Aix, Cardinal Archbishop of Ledra, was just another one. I do know, that the Cardinal Archbishop of Ledra (Nicosia) was real in the Mid-1200s.

 

[unmerged(18481)]

Well, I just made up a couple, hope that was ok, considering I had to ''create'' a few things for my court, Archbishop Henri Cardinal de Aix, Cardinal Archbishop of Ledra, was just another one. I do know, that the Cardinal Archbishop of Ledra (Nicosia) was real in the Mid-1200s.

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4180452&postcount=1864 <- I was sleepy, so it's in a terrible English. Anyway, in this time period, when a bishop was made cardinal, he lost his original diocese. This wasn't always so, but most frequently was. Hence there was no Cardinal-Archbishop of Reims, but there was an Archbishop of Reims and a Cardinal, Protector/Priest [of a church in Rome].

As a rule of thumb for those in the Avignon obedience: you may freely make people bishops, archbishops, deacons, whatever, but you shouldn't make up cardinals. The Pope alone appoints cardinals. As for the bishoprics: try to be moderately accurate. A good guess is perfectly okay -- such as yours, Hawkeye --, but please do not simply use the modern bishoprics. When in doubt, contact the nearest Pope (who will probably know nothing).

 

[Voshkod]

The Horde (Golden) is open for business. Those that recognize the picture of my HoS will know that he is not to be messed with.

 

[Hawkeye1489]

Sorry, fixed. Thanks SaT. I missed your first post, otherwise it would have been changed earlier. The Archbishop of Ledra will look forward to Your Holiness's Great Consistory.

 

[Longinus]

last event rock NK

 

[unmerged(9770)]

Yeach that`s how I imagine events. Respecto....

 

[unmerged(44882)]

Hmph. I didn't like the event that much.

You haven't heard the last of Mighty Montferrat! *shakes fist*

 

[Hawkeye1489]

To avoid confusion, although the county is Famagusta, the actual capital of Cyprus is Ledra (Nicosia), and just making sure that SaT received my letter...

 

[cccino]

Well, in reality each title counted as one vote in the Council of Princes. So the important princes like the King of Bohemia etc had much more than one vote in the Council of Princes. Off course, most of the voting princes is not played anyway so 1 per played realm is perhaps the best. Off course, in the Council of Electors each Elector only has 1 vote regardless of other titles, but thats different

IIRC it's even worse than that - in Germany, every member of the family held the same title (eg all the sons of a count were all counts)... so really big families actually held a larger vote! This is why the Habsburgs and the Wittelsbachs became so powerful. Also, the lesser nobles (ie the Counts that weren't Princely Counts, and I think the free Barons) held a collective vote... I think there were around 100 of them holding 5 votes or something.

 

[cccino]

I guess you thought of other kinds of things, but...

"and later on those of St. Maurice and St.Lazarus in Savoy." The Orders of St.Maurice and St.Lazarus were attached to the crown of Savoy only in the 16th century. The Order of St. Maurice doesn't even exist yet.

EDIT:
*sends the Apostolic Benediction to Petrarca for listing the Archbishoprics of France*

*sends the Apostolic Benediction to Katz for the multi-choice event!*

*excommunicates Petrarca and Katz for being friends with the Antichrist*

Ummm, hopefully I'm get the old Pope running very soon... just a bit lost at the moment

 

[Petrarca]

*excommunicates Petrarca and Katz for being friends with the Antichrist*

Ummm, hopefully I'm get the old Pope running very soon... just a bit lost at the moment

This ought to give you the kick in the pants necessary: I was just thinking of how appropriate my quotation in your signature was now that we are on opposite sides. I the saved, and you the damned.

 

[N Katsyev]

As per the whole naming thing, in the Russian case anyway (stick with what you know) nobody but the nobility had family names up through the 16th century if I recall - and i'm thinking it probably wasn't much different further west. They just sufficed with Christian + Patronymic. Nobility on the other hand rarely had a family name based upon locality (there were exceptions), but rather upon a Saint or even event. Such as Nevski.

Glad to see my events went over pretty well, I hope to put up something of a guide later (including what happens if you don't choose in time, cheers Long). I finished work pretty early today, so I should have some spare time to catch up on my court and such as well i'm hoping.

 

[unmerged(18481)]

*excommunicates Petrarca and Katz for being friends with the Antichrist*

*excommunicates cccino by sheer force of habit*


Hawkeye, I haven't forgotten your letter. Right now I'm busy pondering how should I deal with these conflicting claims. I wonder how the real Clement did.

 

[unmerged(7924)]

Niccolò Caracciolo Moschino, O.P., inquisitor of the Kingdom of Sicily. ------> ?
Galeotto Tarlati de Petramala. ------> ?
Giovanni de Amelia (or Amadeo), archbishop of Corfu. ------> Mine
Filippo Ruffini (or Gezza), O.P., bishop of Tivoli. ------> ?
Poncello Orsini, bishop of Aversa. ------> Mine
Bartolomeo Mezzavacca, bishop of Rieti. ------> ?
Gentile de Sangro. ------> ?
Philippe d'Alençon, patriarch of Jerusalem. ------> ?
Giovanni Fieschi, bishop of Vercelli. ------> ?
Adam Easton, O.S.B. ------> ?
Ludovico Donato, O.Min., minister general of his Order. ------> ?
Bartolomeo de Coturno, O.Min. + Executed in December 1386. ------> ?
Francesco Renzio, relative of Urban VI, uncle of Cardinal Marino Bulcani. ------> ?
Landolfo Maramaldo, archbishop elect of Bari. ------> Mine
Pietro Tomacelli, protonotary apostolic. ------> ?
Marino Giudice, archbishop of Tarento. ------> Mine
Tommaso Orsini, of the Counts of Manupello. ------> ?
Gugilemo d'Altavilla, archbishop of Salerno. ------> Mine

Just wondering... which ones are mine? Some are obvious, but some are in areas that I don't know where is... Just so I know... At the moment I've got quite many, but I'd like to have it clear...

Bishop coming your way, cccino

 

[Avernite]

IIRC it's even worse than that - in Germany, every member of the family held the same title (eg all the sons of a count were all counts)... so really big families actually held a larger vote! This is why the Habsburgs and the Wittelsbachs became so powerful. Also, the lesser nobles (ie the Counts that weren't Princely Counts, and I think the free Barons) held a collective vote... I think there were around 100 of them holding 5 votes or something.

Well, from what I have read (in one of the nice links up in one of the threads here--think it was rules) every 'princely' land held one vote. Princely lands being those that had noone above them except the Emperor, like Duchies, Palatinates or some margraviates etc.

However, FE Bavaria was split in several territories at times, and if they were all princely you allready had powerfull Wittelsbachs right away

 

[unmerged(945)]

Well, from what I have read (in one of the nice links up in one of the threads here--think it was rules) every 'princely' land held one vote. Princely lands being those that had noone above them except the Emperor, like Duchies, Palatinates or some margraviates etc.

However, FE Bavaria was split in several territories at times, and if they were all princely you allready had powerfull Wittelsbachs right away

Thats what I thought too, and since one lord may hold many titles and lands that can mean a lot of votes. It may be that each title can be held by more than one person though, which I guess would give the german nobles a good reason to breed a lot

 

[Avernite]

Thats what I thought too, and since one lord may hold many titles and lands that can mean a lot of votes. It may be that each title can be held by more than one person though, which I guess would give the german nobles a good reason to breed a lot

They do, indeed have the title, but there is only one person who truely IS something (this proved quite confusing when I had 2 people named Duke of Jülich ) so I'd expect only one person to get a vote for it.