Pagan DLC quite a broad concept

[yourworstnightm]

The pagan cultures were different. For Norse religion to be interesting you'd need an earlier start date, and I would love to have some specifically Norse stuff like blots, special mechanics for Norse kingship elections etc.

I'd also like the Hordes to get a lot of unique stuff if Tengriism become playable, and I'd want the Lithuanians more fleshed out. What I don't want is "generic pagans", making every pagan the same. That's why I don't support a generic pagan DLC, but rather separate DLCs for the different pagan cultures.

 

[ZechsMerquise73]

It might be something to consider, if they make a bunch of seperate DLCs for the different pagans. Though, I fear, not many people will buy the Canari Island DLC

 

[Faber81]

Well, I'd like to have a big pack pagan DLC with every pagan religion/culture with his own flavour.

 

[Voy]

That's why the devs are making the next DLC "as big as Sword of Islam or bigger".

And surely they won't be doing a DLC per culture. This DLC madness people are talking about is unreasonable. Rational thinking isn't too much to ask for guys...

 

[Wallain]

It is too broad a concept for a single DLC to handle well, I feel.

 

[STGeorge]

Watch this space... Wrath of Odin!

 

[cybrxkhan]

The pagan cultures were different. For Norse religion to be interesting you'd need an earlier start date, and I would love to have some specifically Norse stuff like blots, special mechanics for Norse kingship elections etc.

I'd also like the Hordes to get a lot of unique stuff if Tengriism become playable, and I'd want the Lithuanians more fleshed out. What I don't want is "generic pagans", making every pagan the same. That's why I don't support a generic pagan DLC, but rather separate DLCs for the different pagan cultures.

While I do think there can be features that apply to most pagans in general (process of conversion to Christianity/Islam, struggle between tradition and "new" ideas, etc.), I agree that the best situation would be, at a minimum, to have one DLC for northern pagans (Norse, Baltic, Finnic), and one for steppe nomdads in general (Tengrii pagan or not).

 

[dorukdorucu]

IF the next DLC is as big as or bigger than SoI, then they could surely make seperate mechanics for pagans. Especially Tengriists. Tengriism was a semi-pagan religion. It is based on believeing the "Tengri", translated into modern Turkish as "Tanrı" or in other words "God"
Tengriists believed that the one true god was Sky-God, translated as Gök-Tanrı. Most of them easily converted to Islam because of similarities such as jihad and world conquest beliefs, some sort of open succession (hence the name "Turkish") and the "Kut" belief, they believed that Tengri granted the ruler AND his/her dynasty right to rule. Also, most Tengriists granted women equal rights. Women could rule kingdoms, fight battles and the wife of Kagan, Hatun had a say in matters of state.
There is also some sort of "east rules over west" belief, in which the ruler grants the western half of his realm to a son/brother/nephew etc. and from then on the western half would be ruled mostly independently until the ruler died. After that it would be a bit messy.
Considering all of this, one can see how different Tengriists and Norse/Baltic/Slavic etc. pagans were different. So PLEASE don't make a generic DLC and try to balance each and every pagan religion well. Make them unique! And yes, by each and every pagan religion i also mean the canarian pagans :laugh:

 

[Bertouch]

Assuming pagans are in the works for a DLC--a big assumption--I'll throw in a vote for different flavored pagan cultures, as well. A single pan-paganism (forgive the pun) smacks too much of some modern Wiccans, with their "Oh, like, it's all one, I mean, Shakti? Morrigan? No difference!" That's not history. That's Disney.

 

[Sleight of Hand]

The pagan DLC is undoubtedly the one I have the most interest in. I bought SoI and LoR to help Paradox, but I've probably loaded up as a Muslim or Orthodox character no more than three or four times, and even then only to test things I've modded. I exclusively play as Catholics -- it's nothing to do with their religion, simply that the parts of the world I play in (Brittany, Great Britain & Scandinavia) just happen to be Catholic. Well, that and I can never remember how to spell any proper Greek names.

An earlier start date would be nice (nothing too extreme, just go back fifty years to the reign of Æthelred the Unready or something) but I don't see it happening.

 

[Arizal]

I'm beginning to understand something about DLCs. If they are supposed to be something they sell to upgrade the game freely and without us having to buy every one of them, they ought to be unerealistic or flavourful, or we would whine that they are making their games sold in detached pieces, just as... other companies. Thus, finally I have no problem with a Pagan DLC or anything other as long as they continue to upgrade the game, and I think they should look into the papacy next, but not as a DLC.

 

[ZhugeKongming]

It is too broad a concept for a single DLC to handle well, I feel.

I agree. I think trying to do all the pagans in one huge DLC would just end up making the pagans feel unfinished and generic. Besides, there are more important and more relevant aspects of the period which deserve DLC to flesh them out, like the Church or republics.

 

[TheLionHeart]

I say we should just leave out the Norse, those cray-cray vikings wouldn't fit in with the crusades time period as much. Maybe with another fantasy DLC with an event that has hordes of Vikings come back to Scandinavia forcing you to convert or be killed. The main pagan DLC should only focus on three major pagans, Romuva, Tengri, and Suomensko. Maybe add small features to the non-prominent religions such as African animism.

 

[unmerged(147169)]

I say we should just leave out the Norse, those cray-cray vikings wouldn't fit in with the crusades time period as much. Maybe with another fantasy DLC with an event that has hordes of Vikings come back to Scandinavia forcing you to convert or be killed. The main pagan DLC should only focus on three major pagans, Romuva, Tengri, and Suomensko. Maybe add small features to the non-prominent religions such as African animism.

yeah but Paradox is Swedish so norse is in.

Also I just want DLC that makes it easier for Pagans to survive, I don't care if it's ahistorical.

 

[cybrxkhan]

Also I just want DLC that makes it easier for Pagans to survive, I don't care if it's ahistorical.

That's not ahistorical. Having pagans get wiped out by 1100 from massive holy wars is just as ahistorical as having super-powered Viking bereserkir pagans conquer half of Europe. But having pagans that cannot be converted to Christianity/Islam easily, and ones who put up a good fight - that's pretty historical.

 

[n000b]

I say we should just leave out the Norse, those cray-cray vikings wouldn't fit in with the crusades time period as much. Maybe with another fantasy DLC with an event that has hordes of Vikings come back to Scandinavia forcing you to convert or be killed. The main pagan DLC should only focus on three major pagans, Romuva, Tengri, and Suomensko. Maybe add small features to the non-prominent religions such as African animism.

I get your point, but no. I want to conquer the world in the name of Thor! xD

 

[Theddude]

Assuming pagans are in the works for a DLC--a big assumption--I'll throw in a vote for different flavored pagan cultures, as well. A single pan-paganism (forgive the pun) smacks too much of some modern Wiccans, with their "Oh, like, it's all one, I mean, Shakti? Morrigan? No difference!" That's not history. That's Disney.

Agreed. It may sound silly, but seeing as SI... I'm hoping that they'll throw in a small possibility for the court chaplain heretic event to change you back to a type of Paganism appropriate to your culture (or Zoroastrianism for Persians, Kurds and possibly Armenians). One can hope, I guess, but the most important thing is that they cut back the Holy War spam across the board and add more meaningful interreligious interaction (including Christians and Muslims esp. Spain).

 

[Stratagyfan101]

The issue isn't a single DLC or not. It is mechanics. One DLC dubbed as a general pagan DLC does not mean the content is general pagan mechanics but that the theme is the pagan religion. I just want to see the Baltic region not fall within the first 15 years of the game.

 

[unmerged(147169)]

That's not ahistorical. Having pagans get wiped out by 1100 from massive holy wars is just as ahistorical as having super-powered Viking bereserkir pagans conquer half of Europe. But having pagans that cannot be converted to Christianity/Islam easily, and ones who put up a good fight - that's pretty historical.

well my point was more of the fact that I don't care how, so they can make it as ahistorical as they want.

 

[unmerged(55459)]

Before releasing such a dlc, they need to make pagans stronger, so that they dont dissapear in the first 20 years after start.
Christian rulers should actually have a hard time conquering them. I'd like to see pagan tribes stick together even more when one of em is at war with christians.