Pacifist Germany

[21oliver]

I remember SM did one in a previous version, but has anyone tried with TFH? Thoughts? Strategies? First targets?

 

[Traks]

As soon as UK neutrality allows, it will DOW you. Usually in 1940.

 

[thenachobuffalo]

One game I waited until I had nukes in 1945, then declared war on the allies. I conquered Poland, Benelux, France, and England in 2 months. The Soviet Union took 3 more.

 

[Secret Master]

Funny you should ask. I spoke with Secret Master on this topic recently...

I've run it in TFH, and there are some changes, but most of my original AAR on the subject still stands. The UK will DOW you when it has the ability to do so (based on threat/neutrality) after January of 1940. Threat is calculated in slightly different ways, which I summarize below.

You write one book about HOI3, and people expect you to do years of followup research to retain your credentials. Getting tenure will be easier. Sheesh.... :laugh:

Alright, so I tested threat.

Here's what you need to know about Peace in Our Time^tm gameplay:

1) All threat generation statistics below assume threat on the UK. Threat against other countries will vary; for those wondering, you generate around 15-20% less threat on the Soviets. I only kept detailed track of the UK.

2) A 4 brigade division of active duty brigades generates 0.08 threat rounded up. (I know it's not exactly 0.08 because doing multiple divisions does not generate neat multiples of 0.08) Type of brigades does not matter in a measurable way.

3) An air wing generates 0.08 threat. Type of wing does not matter in a measurable way.

4) Ships generate 0.08 threat. Type of ship does not matter in a measurable way.

5) Reserves generate a prorated amount of threat. Under Volunteer Army, 4xINF reserve divisions generated 25% of the threat of their active duty counterparts.

6) Almost all of Germany's pre-war decisions (except Spanish Civil War) generate threat AND reduce neutrality in key majors. So, when considering decisions, you can't just count the threat.

7) Without Germany reducing the neutrality of the majors via decisions and increasing threat via military build up, most countries do not have the threat/neutrality ratio to DOW Japan, even if Japan completes Seize the Coast.

8) Putting brigades back in the queue for upgrades generates threat.

9) Upgrading technology via the upgrade slider does not generate threat.

10) Forts, ports, air fields, RADAR, IC, province AA, rocket sites, nuclear reactors, nuclear bombs generated by nuclear bomb-making technology, infrastructure, convoys, escorts, and supplies do not generate threat.

So, with all that in mind, I figure you could probably budget a decent sized German military if you didn't fire any decisions and still not provoke a war. Firing Anschluss and Munich will drastically lower the neutrality of the UK, putting you on the road to war. To grab Austria and the Czechs with provoking a war from the AI, my estimate is that you'd have to keep you non-decision threat well under 20.

I'm not going to test actual applications tonight, because I don't have any booze in the house and it's as boring as watching paint dry. (I ran the previous test at full speed in the background while doing work for hours, but actually building units and monitoring threat requires a wee bit more intervention.)

Also, do keep in mind that if Japan joins the Axis, she will 99% of the time DOW the Americans no matter what you are doing. This will drag you into war if you aren't careful AND it might cause threat issues with the British. So, do NOT invite Japan into the Axis until after you are in a war. (Japan won't attack the US if she isn't in the Axis.)

As for first targets, consider the following:

Britain and France are easier to defeat than the Soviets. Also, if you are playing pacifist, then Poland still exists.

So, what you should do is guarantee Poland (because the Soviets will attack her at some point) so that you have the right to intervene AND it should bring them into your faction if they are attacked. But only put defensive forces in the east. Your priority should be to defeat France first, then Britain. Puppet them quickly, and then invite all the European states that are left into the Axis. If you spend 1936-1943 using spies to support fascist parties in all of them (the ones with elections), they will all join the Axis willingly when the British fold. Belgium, Netherlands, Spain, Portugal, Norway, Denmark, Sweden, and so on. Since they all join willingly, and since the French and British are puppets, you can leave absolutely nothing in the west and march everything east to deal with the Soviets. Destroy the Red Army in Poland, then move east.

Also, with the British surrendering and becoming a puppet, you get her naval bases, so you can run an invasion of the Pacific coast of the Soviet Union without Japan by basing an invasion force in Hong Kong.

After that, the world is your oyster.

EDIT: And for the record, if you reference the above thread, I was easily able to completely avoid WWII by following the threat/neutrality guidelines. The Soviet AI shows a distinct lack of interest in war while Germany is at peace.

 

[21oliver]

Interesting, ty!