Overseas Expansion or Holy War casus belli?

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Koivin

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Hey all. I am currently playing as Russia (formed out of Musvovy) and I have finished both the expansion and religious idea group. Now that the time has arrived to gobble up Central- and East Asia, I have reached a conundrum. I have read people on this swearing their life on either OE CB or HW CB. Yet which one is better (and for what?). I remember Holy War giving 0% dip cost provinces, what is the boon of OE CB?

Cheers.
 
U

Ultrix Prime

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Expansion and Exploration give you CB's on entire regions, essentially, such that you can hop in a boat and go stomp them without being next to them.
 

atwix

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holy war cb allows for 0 dip point peace deals on any participant in war you can make seperate peace deals with. Province costs are 100%. This is ideal if you have holy cb ONLY, since you can be at 0 dip oints and still get loads of provinces for vassals.

Overseas expansion? Even better. Same as holy cb, but LESS province warscore cost. So, you get more provinces.

And here comes the real problem, and my major problem with 1.8. The CB province cost applies to all war participants. You can make seperate peace deals with this -% province cost active.. makes vassal feeding too easy.

Example. You got a coalition against you, consisting of a one province minor in asia and rest in europe. Declare on the asia op with overseas, and gobble up entire coalition with reduced warcost for province.

Note that holy war cb is not really needed anymore. Sell a nation a cored province, or let a province defect on purpose due to rebel occupation. Bam, you got reconquest CB now, for your nation OR a vassal. If you then declare with that recnquest, all war participant peace deal will have reconquest cb province cost. At least it seems so. Not 100% on this.

Combine this knowledge with diplomacy idea group that has -% province war cost, and a nation that has serious diplomacy bonuses like austria, or serious -% coring cost bonuses like ottomans, and you can deduct a nie WC strategy.

I'm doing a foix wc atm just because i wanted the mechaics, and i find the game too easy... Simply because this thing combined with the new coalition mechanics simply makes wc easy.

Coalition? Just declare on whoever you have cb on once truce is over. You usually got a month window before the nation enters a coalition. This allows for endless war chains, keeping any possible coalition member in a truce or in a war. My current wc is usually 5-10 wars at once...


..but hey, its all WAD.
 

AurochsAway

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And here comes the real problem, and my major problem with 1.8. The CB province cost applies to all war participants. You can make seperate peace deals with this -% province cost active.. makes vassal feeding too easy.

Example. You got a coalition against you, consisting of a one province minor in asia and rest in europe. Declare on the asia op with overseas, and gobble up entire coalition with reduced warcost for province.

Note that holy war cb is not really needed anymore. Sell a nation a cored province, or let a province defect on purpose due to rebel occupation. Bam, you got reconquest CB now, for your nation OR a vassal. If you then declare with that recnquest, all war participant peace deal will have reconquest cb province cost. At least it seems so. Not 100% on this.

Combine this knowledge with diplomacy idea group that has -% province war cost, and a nation that has serious diplomacy bonuses like austria, or serious -% coring cost bonuses like ottomans, and you can deduct a nie WC strategy.

I thought they changed it in 1.7 so the province warscore effects didn't hit everyone in the coalition anymore?
 

atwix

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I thought they changed it in 1.7 so the province warscore effects didn't hit everyone in the coalition anymore?

ah. hm. maybe you are right on the coalition example. But province warscore did seem low. Now you make me doubt :)