Ottomans can into Austria

[Orctavius]

Everyone was talking about how the Ottomans got nerfed in the latest patch, but as far as I can tell they're just as beefy as ever. In my latest game they surpassed their historical counterparts by conquering Vienna, absorbing most of Poland, and taking a sizable bite out of Russia including Moscow.

I will note that this was effectively an observer game as I was playing as Hamburg and spend most of the game as an OPM Free Imperial City, only expanding in the game's final century and having little influence on world events.

 

[Vetgirig]

Ottoman is slower to blob in this patch then earlier patches. But they get there eventually.

 

[Kawa7CR]

That is interesting.

 

[Tarkilth]

While the removal of the cores and such would have seemed like a nerf in the beginning, and certainly, it is. Howeve,r once they conquer their way past it and start aggressively pursuing their plentiful missions with claims and ambitions they are as strogn as ever. When you add the changes and swaps in the muslim religions, the pashas and the reworked Janissaries Ottomans are buffed somewhat. Then you add the improved AI building logic, and you have yourselves a conquering powerhouse with manpower, quality troops, good monarch power generation and robust economy. Without player interference they do as good or better than they ever did, on average, in my observed games.

 

[Badesumofu]

Strangely enough the hysteria that was based on 2 or 3 observer games from the pre-release code turned out to be unwarranted.

Or maybe it really is a PDS conspiracy against the Ottomans. I mean why else would they keep the core on Venice-guaranteed Albania?

 

[Fanstar1]

Strangely enough the hysteria that was based on 2 or 3 observer games from the pre-release code turned out to be unwarranted.

Or maybe it really is a PDS conspiracy against the Ottomans. I mean why else would they keep the core on Venice-guaranteed Albania?

because they held it right before the start date? Though Ottomans took over Serbia and lost it in 1444 yet it is not cored, so idk.

 

[Badesumofu]

because they held it right before the start date? Though Ottomans took over Serbia and lost it in 1444 yet it is not cored, so idk.

I may have been a tiny bit insincere in that post - there were posters claiming very seriously that the Ottomans losing all their cores except on Albania was a PDS plot to undermine the OE. You are of course, correct, it actually makes total sense that they have that core, and there are good reasons for them not to have the ones they lost as well.

 

[Fanstar1]

I may have been a tiny bit insincere in that post - there were posters claiming very seriously that the Ottomans losing all their cores except on Albania was a PDS plot to undermine the OE. You are of course, correct, it actually makes total sense that they have that core, and there are good reasons for them not to have the ones they lost as well.

I know, I have seen them plenty when the update rolled out. And it does make sense.

 

[Less2]

Most every time complaints of "nerfing" are around they are talking about the potential for catastrophic failure of a major tag in the first 30-50 years, not their ability to blob across the map if they survive and are unimpeded by players.

 

[cuendillar]

Ottomans really have been boosted, not nerfed, by the Cradle of Civilization changes.

No free cores on Anatolia means they take Byzantium earlier (a better move anyways) while more development in the Middle East pretty much equals more Ottoman development come midgame. They're much stronger at the same apparent size, just slightly slower out of the gate than before. IMO, that makes them that much deadlier.

 

[Ironside121]

Their early game is weaker slightly- as they have to get CB's and pay for coring etc, but their mid game is stronger than ever.

I like it to be honest.

 

[atwix]

ottoman get balanced/administrator ruler personalities a lot more, from my observation. That slows them down a lot.

The biggest neccessitty for ai to blob is presence of enough militarist ruler personalities.

God knows a low chance militarist in FRance or Austria can go HAM in HRE.

Successive militarists made Ottoman border India in some of my older games, but in CoC I see a TON of non militarists in Ottoman all the time. And they then do no wars almost, and if so, they hardly take land due to those personalities not flagging a lot of vital interest.

 

[jdavis86]

They fixed the naval bug so they actually declare war on countries like the Knights now too.

 

[Vokasak]

The people who talked about how overnerfed the Ottomans are would point out that they still haven't taken Tunis in your game, and therefore are underperforming. Never mind that they regularly eat all the developed parts of Russia

 

[Dominion]

They're not nerfed, except for humans.

Them getting diplomats and builders more often means anyone can ally them easily.

 

[grommile]

The part that impresses me with that screenshot is that Iran and India each contain a blob instead of a Trust-induced hugbox.

 

[I_am_Nemo]

AI Ottomans didn't do WC by 1623?!!! Buff Ottomans!

 

[Fanstar1]

Ottomans don't take tunis because 1. usually allied to tunis and 2. tunis has HCC and ai recognizes that

 

[chegitz guevara]

The issue with the Ottomans isn't, omg, they didn't conquer the world, but that they don't perform historically. The OE exploded in size, and basically reached its limits within 70 years of game start. This never even comes close to happening. Instead they just slowly grind their neighbors down.

But the flip side of this is, none of the historical problems with the Ottomans happen either. The loss of trade, the influx of Spanish silver causing massive inflation and currency devaluation, the Janissaries becoming a powerful class capable of enforcing their own interests, the power of the Ulema in retarding technological advancement, etc.

The OE should grow like a weed for the first 70-100 years, then stagnate and shrink for the next 300. Instead they start out slow, and accumulate more and more power, becoming nigh unstoppable in the late game.

 

[I_am_Nemo]

Ottomans don't take tunis because 1. usually allied to tunis and 2. tunis has HCC and ai recognizes that

3. That land is pretty poor anyhow. Much better use of time going for India for trade, or into Europe for high dev.

The OE should grow like a weed for the first 70-100 years, then stagnate and shrink for the next 300. Instead they start out slow, and accumulate more and more power, becoming nigh unstoppable in the late game.

Problem is the game really isn't set up to handle any of that. Over-extension, warscore, truce timers, and AE all limit how fast you can expand, while there are really no ways to make empires stagnate. Trying to reflect historical Ottos would require either a major re-work of the game, or a lot of specific mechanics for Ottos.