Now, if only they would know how to use that fleet properly. In my current Byz game, they still behave like the fleet is lead by a drunken sailor (early in the morning 
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Ottoman AI spam galleys like no tomorrow.
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Lepanto was won by a COMBINED christian fleet led by Spain. History. No country could rival the turk navy in the Mediterranean alone. As for cost, as others have mentioned galleys are cheap and the ottomans will obviously be richer than Naples.
The problem is that attaching/having fleets attached doesn´t work properly in the game, and thus you can´t have allied fleets fighting together in a coordinated way.
Finally, naval rise/decline isn´t well modelled in the game as after Lepanto the Ottomans never became a huge threat on the sea again. Blame the game for having silly, deterministic and eternal NIs and idea groups that never require maintenance.
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That.So they have 118 galleys? Great. Now you just build 150 galleys before DoW'ing them. No big deal. Same strategy as always, just require a bit more galleys.
I had a couple of war with them (as Castille, I know it's easier this way :/ ), I built a 200 galley fleet and broke their 150+ fleet every wars, at a point they gave up building them
This galley menace patrols the Bosphorus. That's their dedicated task. In my Carthage run, they're an ally and half or more of the Turk galleys escort a 0 X 0 0 trader from Marmora to Satalia gulf, which in this game has a leader. These escorts have the 0 0 X 0 composition and have no leaders. Up and down they go on that route, oblivious, which is exploitable. Some do leave this route ofc and they're the ones you can easily counter, Minmatar hit 'n' run style.
Shame this patrol isn't likely to, but I'm open to surprises, help Tunis demolish Aragon and Spain's Navies, though. That'd be interesting.
Shame this patrol isn't likely to, but I'm open to surprises, help Tunis demolish Aragon and Spain's Navies, though. That'd be interesting.
It's what I do as the player. This is a good thing. One needs a challenge
And again. Point is not "how player can take them out", point is "how other AI's can take them out".
I am not concerned about player abilities, more about the balance between AI's in this part of the world.
So they have 118 galleys? Great. Now you just build 150 galleys before DoW'ing them. No big deal. Same strategy as always, just require a bit more galleys.
I played test game as Ming so I'm not really interested in OE. I used them as military access provider to get to genoa so...
The problem is AI not combining fleets. Period. No, AI Venice alone should not beat the ottomans. Ever. Get over it.
The expansion was a bit dissapointing in the naval aspect. "Sell ships" hurr durr. I want to see some sort of rally point to make allies merge fleets.
Small nations alone, no, small nations combined, yes. Big nations alone, yes, big nations combined, definitely. Big nations do not build that kind of force either so...back to the start point. Because of that code the Ottos own alone whole Mediterranean, and it seems that Denmark own alone whole Baltic Sea.
Hm? I noticed it too spam a bit of those galleys, but in more manageble manor. Anyhow, some counterbalance would be nice here too. Otherwise its getting a bit onesided.
Venice is doing this in my current game; I assume it's to beat the Ottomans, who are also doing this. It's a lot like watching Cold War tensions between US and USSR, honestly.
If we're talking about AIs, this is doubly a good thing rather than a problem. AI Ottoman consistently underperforms in this game, moreso in 1.8 as far as I can tell. Why would we object to something that makes them a bit more competitive in their back yard?
ottomans take maritime as first idea too now. Annoying but challenging at same time.
Maritime maybe isn't the best choice as a *first* Ottoman idea, but the Ottomans should definitely be a force to be feared in the Mediterranean. I would actually change their last NI to give increased naval force limits and/or a galley combat bonus, to encourage them to build a strong galley fleet. (Force limits are the main restriction on galley fleets, seeing as each galley is so cheap.)
Gallies are very cheap for the blockade power they give, a galley can blockade better then a heavy ship for a much lower cost and even lower maintenment cost and blockades hurt more then the cost of that navy hurts Ottoman, especially against nations like Venice.
Spanish naval commitment to the mediterranean (without which Lepanto would NOT occur) was extremely short term and thus making them build, say, 50 galleys all the time is stupid, unless they are rivalled to the ottomans and already fought wars.
No matter how you look at it, the italian minors were that, MINORS, with zero chance of fighting the ottomans on their own. And as other said, blocking the straits cripples Ottomans too much and thus it makes a LOT of sense for them to have an override on their building priorities.
The only REAL issue is lack of allied fleet merging.
A proper size Venice can roast that navy no probs, with the proper tech. Being over naval force limit costs too little, as well as not accounting for manpower.
When I play as Venice I have huge fleets patrolling the med, and later the world. Ally with a few countries that have decent land armies, and become a powerhouse.
First thing you do is take the Otto navy down a notch, after that the Otto's crumble with combined wars.
So, not OP in that sense, gamey, yes, a bit.
When I play as Venice I have huge fleets patrolling the med, and later the world. Ally with a few countries that have decent land armies, and become a powerhouse.
First thing you do is take the Otto navy down a notch, after that the Otto's crumble with combined wars.
So, not OP in that sense, gamey, yes, a bit.
Seriously...that strait can be defended with less ships you know...In this pic fleets are rated by "Total" tab.
Good. They still have 1 year and 9 months to build the remaining 88.
I ve seen rivalry between AIvenice and AIottos in terms of galleys to total number about 400 (abotu 200/200 for each side) so in this pic ottos probably won war with venice this time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Preveza
Ottoman had almost as many ships as the alliance they faced. So in this regard Ottomans spamming galleys is one of the best things the devs could do.
Ottoman had almost as many ships as the alliance they faced. So in this regard Ottomans spamming galleys is one of the best things the devs could do.