Origins: How Customisable are related empires?

Cat_Fuzz

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Will the origins such as Scions and the Federated options give some customisation to your empire, or are these random/the same species as your own?

Posted as a new thread hoping this might entice a dev response.
 

GreyJack

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I was considering doing the same thing. It massively impacts whether I'd want to use either one of those origins. If the empires are just randomized, I don't really see the appeal.
 

eagletrekkie

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What I want to know specifically is if we can designate another empire we’ve made as the origin civ for lost colony and if two civs have the federation origin if we can set them to be together in that fed.
 

Tech Noir Synth

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It would be hilarious to start as a vassal of a military isolationists which send you a very angry letter the moment you send your construction ship out to construct the first outpost.

On a serious note, I am sure players will enjoy being able to decide whether they want to start with a Spirtualist FE as a Materialist or a FE thats closer to their own ethics.

Also Hivemind Fallen empire when?
 

Janx14

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There origins mod made it so that if an empire with the same species (traits/portrait/name) also spawned, it used that as the origin.

So its doable via scripting, whether the devs do it is another question.
 

The Founder

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The best basis for speculation we have about Lost Colony is this:
Code:
every_country = {
    limit = { is_ai = no }
    country_event = { id = country.900 days = 460 random = 60 }
}

### SPAWN UNIQUE SYSTEMS
# If any Empire is Commonwealth and UN is unplayed
if = {
    limit = {
        any_country = { has_country_flag = human_2 }
        #NOT = { any_country = { has_country_flag = human_1 } }
        # Replaced UN check with generic Sol check
        NOT = { any_system = { has_star_flag = sol } }
    }
    random_system = {
        spawn_system = { initializer = "com_sol_system" }
    }
}
else_if = {
    # If there are no Sols
    limit = {
        NOT = {
            any_system = {
                has_star_flag = sol
            }
        }
    }
    random_list = {
        50 = { }
        40 = {
            random_system = {
                spawn_system = { initializer = "special_init_03" }
            }
        }
        10 = {
            random_system = {
                spawn_system = { initializer = "special_init_04" }
            }
        }
    }
}
Groundrules:
UNS is tagged as "human_1", the Sol System is tagged via "Star flag Sol"
There can be only one Sol System per game. This even overrides force spawn. For that reason avoid select sol or deneb as start initializers.
COM is tagged as "human_2"
These tags can be aquired by modifying the pre-existing empires, however they notriously keep getting lost due to empire saving issues.

Basically:
If you are playing the Empire tagged with human_2
And there is no Sol that spawned by pure chance (UNS, Sertivtor Network or any Custom Sol System Empire)
Force spawn a Sol System. The initializer will actully use exact UNS settings, but copy the Species from the human_2 empire. This includes odities like no starting colonies, having the human species "homeworld" set to deneb, using the Denebulan namelist, etc.

That random list is about the Tomb World with Presentient Roacahes and "Primitive earth" starts, if sol is still unused by this point.

So I would say:
1. The game checks if a Empire with the same Founder Species has spawned by chance. There is afaik special code for the sole purpose of matching species during gamestart like this.
2. If not, one fitting empire is force spawned. But with teh CoM/Sol odities.
 

Goosecreature

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In Scion, you will start as a vassal of either the spiritualist or materialist Fallen Empires. If you're spiritualist or materialist, it will pick the one that mirrors your ethic. Otherwise it's randomized. For the Origins where you start in a federation, the other two members are randomized but their ethics will largely reflect those of your empire.
 

A_Dane

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In Scion, you will start as a vassal of either the spiritualist or materialist Fallen Empires. If you're spiritualist or materialist, it will pick the one that mirrors your ethic. Otherwise it's randomized. For the Origins where you start in a federation, the other two members are randomized but their ethics will largely reflect those of your empire.

How about lost colony? Can you customise the parent empire? (Would work wonders for two of my custom empires!)
 

Goosecreature

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For Lost Colony, it's completely random. They could be anything from purifiers to pacifists. It's been a while since your people left the homeworld - a lot will have happened in that time.
 

Ecervele

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What about multiplayer? Can you start together with two other players in Federation/Hegemon start?
397b76288f767a97d59ea7681326a8f5f92a50dd446bf80d64c71a114dbc2086.jpg

In normal circonstances I wouldn't think that but...
 

Grim Deadman

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For Lost Colony, it's completely random. They could be anything from purifiers to pacifists. It's been a while since your people left the homeworld - a lot will have happened in that time.
I assume in both Scion and Lost Colony your progenitor empires have the same species as you?
 

Tim_Ward

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So, with Lost Colony, are you the lost colony, or do you *have* a lost colony?

Also, assuming it's the former, if you make a lost colony of humans al-la CoM, does other human empire spawn in sol, or and will it always be the UNE, agian, as with the CoM?
 

The Founder

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In Scion, you will start as a vassal of either the spiritualist or materialist Fallen Empires. If you're spiritualist or materialist, it will pick the one that mirrors your ethic. Otherwise it's randomized. For the Origins where you start in a federation, the other two members are randomized but their ethics will largely reflect those of your empire.
So there is no matching of Origins?

That sounds potentially dangerous. If I can force spawn two empires near me, that gives me a very good chance to get those two having some globally usefull Origins. Stuff like the Gateway one or a Gaia World. It would be easy to absorb them, or thow them out/conquer them.
It would work better if you spawned or linked people with "Federation Start" together. That way, there would be no 2 additional Origin rolls.
And Hegemon could have a "Subservient" counter Oirigin, for the subjugated people.

So, with Lost Colony, are you the lost colony, or do you *have* a lost colony?

Also, assuming it's the former, if you make a lost colony of humans al-la CoM, does other human empire spawn in sol, or and will it always be the UNE, agian, as with the CoM?
For the Com Case, I alraedy posted to code. I asume it will stay taht way.
The best basis for speculation we have about Lost Colony is this:
Code:
every_country = {
    limit = { is_ai = no }
    country_event = { id = country.900 days = 460 random = 60 }
}

### SPAWN UNIQUE SYSTEMS
# If any Empire is Commonwealth and UN is unplayed
if = {
    limit = {
        any_country = { has_country_flag = human_2 }
        #NOT = { any_country = { has_country_flag = human_1 } }
        # Replaced UN check with generic Sol check
        NOT = { any_system = { has_star_flag = sol } }
    }
    random_system = {
        spawn_system = { initializer = "com_sol_system" }
    }
}
else_if = {
    # If there are no Sols
    limit = {
        NOT = {
            any_system = {
                has_star_flag = sol
            }
        }
    }
    random_list = {
        50 = { }
        40 = {
            random_system = {
                spawn_system = { initializer = "special_init_03" }
            }
        }
        10 = {
            random_system = {
                spawn_system = { initializer = "special_init_04" }
            }
        }
    }
}
Groundrules:
UNS is tagged as "human_1", the Sol System is tagged via "Star flag Sol"
There can be only one Sol System per game. This even overrides force spawn. For that reason avoid select sol or deneb as start initializers.
COM is tagged as "human_2"
These tags can be aquired by modifying the pre-existing empires, however they notriously keep getting lost due to empire saving issues.

Basically:
If you are playing the Empire tagged with human_2
And there is no Sol that spawned by pure chance (UNS, Sertivtor Network or any Custom Sol System Empire)
Force spawn a Sol System. The initializer will actully use exact UNS settings, but copy the Species from the human_2 empire. This includes odities like no starting colonies, having the human species "homeworld" set to deneb, using the Denebulan namelist, etc.

That random list is about the Tomb World with Presentient Roacahes and "Primitive earth" starts, if sol is still unused by this point.

So I would say:
1. The game checks if a Empire with the same Founder Species has spawned by chance. There is afaik special code for the sole purpose of matching species during gamestart like this.
2. If not, one fitting empire is force spawned. But with teh CoM/Sol odities.
 

Goosecreature

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The other two members of your federation will also start with the Common Ground/Hegemon origin (called Hegemon Subordinate in the case of that origin).

Alas, it will not be possible to start with human players as the other federation members in multiplayer.
 

eagletrekkie

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The other two members of your federation will also start with the Common Ground/Hegemon origin (called Hegemon Subordinate in the case of that origin).

Alas, it will not be possible to start with human players as the other federation members in multiplayer.
If you have two empires with the common ground origin and force spawn them both is it possible for them to be in a federation together at gamestart or will they each have their own federation?