Opinions by older HOI2 players.

[zveroboy]

Big fan of HoI 1 and HoI 2 (DD Arma with/without mods), I have spent thousand hours on HoI 2, and more than a hundred on HoI 1

National Focus system is nice but quite strange : 70 days for any focus ..?
I like the production system, it is quite well designed but...

No feedback. At all. I miss a lot the pop-up messages (entirely adjustable) from HoI 2 :
- I DON'T want to click on small "bubbles" on ports or at sea to see the results of a port strike or a naval combat. I want a pop-up or a LOG.
- In HoI 2 you were able to see what happened everywhere in your country : Strategic bombardement, naval combat, ground attacks, etc...

Your army can be attacked and encircled without you being notified (no ground attack / province loss notifications at all), same thing for your air force.

And ...

No statistics, no way to see casualties of a previous war, no countries comparison (you have to click on each country and go to the details page...)

 

[Zoob]

I've played since hoi2 loved hoi2. Hated hoi3, hoi4 is amazingly good.

 

[agus92]

and why cant i chose to have air units use old equipment like i can with my groundtroops?

You can.

Source: Bridger second HOI IV stream

 

[Herr Rosseland]

cant find it, link?

 

[nik1_]

I was huge fan of HoI 2 and played few of its mods too. HoI3 was never my thing and honestly, few months after its release i went back to HoI2. I bought HoI4 day before its release, knewing that it will be sketch of what this game is some day going to be.

Things i like:
Battleplan - it is still new to me and im not totally used to it but, i can see that this cuts useless micromanagement.

National focus tree - I feel like it gives small nations better change to do well in this game. Main nations also have tons of unique focuses here maybe someday minor countries have them too!

AI - is making naval invasions and yesterday i saw nationalist spain joining axis and conquering gibraltar and west africa.

What i miss the most is leader-system. Example Finland in HoI2 had hundreds of army leaders and i was amazed by their historical accuracy. In HoI4 we have like 5 army leaders for Finland, as they now command lot larger units. Historically we had Heinrichs and Airo leading our whole army but we had also great division leaders.

Province names was also something i liked. Now we got only the biggest ones marked on the map.

 

[Peter Wass]

1. Research system. HoI 1-2-3 had better ones.

Keep the trolling at last vaguely sensible. In HOI 1 you could have panthers and mechanised infantry before the war started.

 

[desiriel]

I've come to the conclusion that HOI4 is a step on the road back to the spirit of HOI2 in terms of game design (and I'm not discussing if it's been successfull or not so far).
Complaining that it's not the OOB or the divisional micromanagement of HOI3 is just the wrong comparison.
HOI3 was overly intricate in its gameplay flow (and I'm not talking about bugs or UI defects). HOI2, on the contrary, run like a charm in its various incarnations and variations.
Yesterday I saw a comment by a forumite that Gary Grisby's War in the East 2 is going to be a better wargame than HOI4.
But HOI4 is not meant to be a "wargame". It's a GSG.
HOI3 tried to be a GSG but with the level of detail and mechanics of a dedicated wargame. That was the problem. It was a nice and admirable endeavour but with a deficit at its core that could never be solved.
So is HOI4 all right ? No, it's not.
It's lacking in several in-depth aspects that, I suspect, PDS means to address in the succession of coming DLCs. Which is the business strategy that Paradox has been following in these last few years. I'm not dogmatically against it (for many aspects it's positive in terms of player feedback and game development) but I've the impression that this form of release tends to convince the SH to press "too base" releases. Stellaris is an even more clear example.
I'm enjoying HOI4 but I think that it needs further refinement in the depth of various features. And the AI.
It's not a failed game by far either.

PS: by the way, the musical score is awesome. As in Stellaris. I would say that they're on Hollywood motion pictures' level. Good job !

 

[archita]

HOI 2 the best on land warfare, the worst on sea warfare, great on intelligence, worst on research.

HOI 4 without bonus of battleplan a nice welcome back of HOI 2 land warfare system, new ideas on naval warfare, great production system, worst on diplomacy, absence of intelligence and typical horrible AI.

HOI 4 has best UI of all HOI games however and it can be improved with mod and patch.

 

[piscatorcompos]

I am glad the game is "dumbed" down. In earlier HOI games I always wished I could just give my planes and ships an area to operate instead of micromanaging.
I stopped playing HOI 3 after a short while as I found it to be more unpleasant work than fun.

And grand strategy means strategy on a grand scale to me and not managing every detail. HOI IV needs some improvement for sure but for those who moan about lack of what is tedious micromanagement for most of us: There are other games that satisfy your needs. I am glad that clutter is gone.

 

[Herr Rosseland]

wrong.

Grand strategy, also called high strategy, comprises the "purposeful employment of all instruments of power available to a security community". Military historian B. H. Liddell Hart says about grand strategy:

The role of grand strategy – higher strategy – is to co-ordinate and direct all the resources of a nation, or band of nations, towards the attainment of the political object of the war – the goal defined by fundamental policy.

PI could (should?) make one game for arcade players that want a quick and easy game, and make one for the players that like games that span over months, with tedious mechanics and constant tweeks THAT MAKES IT FEEL LIKE YOU ARE A F.....ING GENERAL AND JUST NOT SOME KID PLAYING A GAME

 

[Zoob]

Did it make you feel like a real proper general? Should I be saluting?

 

[Herr Rosseland]

Did it make you feel like a real proper general? Should I be saluting?

I got the arcade-feeling from HOI IV I want more micro, but thats just me, cant make everybody happy

 

[Aries666]

So are we now trying to say the only people's opinion that are those who have been playing Paradox games for decades?

 

[Herr Rosseland]

who is saying that..? some people want an easy game, some want a hard game, paradox has to choose which group their game is supposed to sell to. further then that one could just hope to be in the chosen group...

None of our opinion matters, its up to the paradox team and their devs to make the game they want to sell

and think will sell

 

[kof]

Been playing since HOI 1

HOI 4 is a big step forward in many respects, in particular, better game design concepts and a much more finished product at release. Currently in only my first game however, but enjoying it. Some issues, but much better than I expected. Well done PI.

BTW, I thought that HOI 3 was a disaster. HOI 2 was a great improvement over HOI 1.

Enjoy!

 

[Corner79]

Apparently, the game suffers from oversimplification, due to the fact that Paradox, from what i can fathom, would rather oversimplify a game and make it for everyone, than make it deeper and make it for a small yet truly dedicated group of players.

From the time I dumped into the game this week, I can honestly say that this game is not overly simplified in my opinion and certainly with the many changes that was not the goal of Paradox. They attempted to take the complexity of HOI3 especiall with the OOB and make it more accessible for players. I believe they have accomplished this goal just fine. What many people are not talking about is the fact you do not even need to use the army planner, you can still manually move troops around if you so desire. I really enjoyed HOI3 especially after it was optimized nicely a year later, but even I had micromage issues fighting on multiple fronts with 160 divisions. I like the battle planner because I can manage many more forces but yet still not worry about a small front while my main focus is micromanaging the main front line.

Also the purely cosmetic baltle designer in HOI3 was awesome even though it did little for the game, so the fact that the battle planner is now part of the planning is just awesome in my opinion!

Overall this game is not dumbed down, just made more accessible. I am also a HOI2-HOI4 player btw, but I began with the first copy of HOI2 back when it first came out.

IMO what HOI 4 lacks is immersion.

This would probably be my only minor complaint so far. I WOULD NOT go as far as saying that it has no immersion and I cannot play this game. That is not the case, I simply LOVE HOI4! But the small list of generals, and the lack of air commanders does leave a little bit to be desired. However I am sure that with future DLC the game will just get way more immersive. In the mean time its immersion is enough, just lacking a bit.

 

[Ringwraith_JP]

From someone that shares an almost exactly identical history with Paradox games than you: HoI 4 feels like an successor to the spirit of HoI 2, unlike HoI 3.

And reading this post I notice that pretty much everyone on the same situation (loved 2 and hated 3) is enjoying this 4th version. So it seems to corroborate what I've felt playing it.
However it is simpler than HoI 2 was at its final days. Not that it is bad, its just a fresh new beginning. But I feel there's so much room to improvement that I do not regret buying the Field Marshall Edition with the "Season Pass". Things are Ok as it is and the future looks REALLY positive.

I say you should give it a try. The worst that could happen is leaving it aside while Paradox cooks up improvements.

 

[Corner79]

1. Research system. HoI 1-2-3 had better ones.
2. Supply system. HoI 1-2-3 had better ones.
3. Events and immersion. HoI 1-2-3 was better at that.
4. Province names. Hoi 4 got almost none. Imagine Eu4 or CK2 without province names.
5. Combat system. HoI 1-2-3 had better ones.
6. Adjustable Combat messages. HoI 1-2-3 had them.

Just my counterpoints and opinion: (I have thousands of hours in HOI 2-3, and all my free time this week in HOI 4, AND I DO MEAN ALL!)

1. Research system: HOI 1-2 Good (design companies), HOI 3 (ok, confusing, no design companies), HOI 4 (awesome, colorful, design companies back)
2. Supply System: HOI 2 (pretty good, except in the pacific, auto convoy system buggy), HOI 3 (supply system very confusing), HOI 4 (easy to see,works great)
3. Events and Immersion: HOI 2 really good, HOI 3 (not as immersive but ok), HOI 4 (on par with HOI 2, but lacking a bit for a new game)
Keep in mind, all HOI games were always way better with DLC and Mods concerning immersion, so not really surprising
4. Province names: HoI 2 (small map, not so tactical), HOI 3 (big map+, not so artistic -, very tactical with names+), HOI 4 (big map+, eye pleasingly good looking++, no provinces names-) However, it is obvious this was done for a reason and in the meantime a mod can easily update til then
5. Combat system: Hoi 2 (ok, dumbed down compared to others), HOI 3 (very realistic OOB, hard to learn, cool division design), HOI 4 (very realistic, easy to get into to, best yet I would say)
6. Adjustable combat messages: HOI 1- HOI 3 (yes had them and were adjustable), HOI 4 (does not have them)
but is that really a bad thing? in HOI 2 and 3 I remember turning them all on and filtering through as they popped up with what I would keep and I found myself forcing many popups to auto-pause or pop for like a year game time before I was like, this is a distraction, I really do not need this. So very, very few did I really ever use. So far I have not missed any of these popups in HOI 4, the event messages mini popups at the top are all I need


I am not saying that my opinion trumps anybody else, I am just saying that this is what I see as a gamer and overall I am very pleased with HOI 4 and think that Paradox did an amazing job. HOI 3 on launch was a mess, but it cleaned up nicely after year, don't forget that! HOI 4 is optimized very well, super fun and I just want to share with my fellow comrades in arms!

Enjoy!

 

[Utopiar]

I loved the smaller scale of Hoi1&2.
Was more hands on with fewer provinces. In that sense i didnt like the 10.000+ provinces in hoi3.

I liked the smaller nations in Hoi3 because of this and the massive oob. My god. Really disliked the bigger oobs. What a microfest at the start, and do everything manual or full auto ingame.

In that sense i think Pdx got it right in Hoi4. Battleplan with micro if you want it.
Could be made a bit more userfriendly or intuitive.

Maybe a two level oob might be nice. A Fieldmarshall for a front and a general for an army.

I'm not missing the oilstockpile too much, but i do hope they bring it back. I don't see how we couldnt produce fueldrums or something. I hope we'll get there with one expansion or another.

Resources are a bit too easy right now. Just build some syntetic oilplants and voilá,
oil-be-plenty.

Ai seems okay if you stick to 'reasonable' deviations from history, but i'm not that far into my Italy game. (Geez some people have already clocked insane hours, or are speedfiving?)

All in all, its a PDX game, it will get better.

 

[nigo]

DH > HoI4