Open Elective?!

[thebigj_a]

Playing as Munster, I'd passed Primogeniture as my succession law. The Lord Mayor of Ossory (sp?) rebelled against me, so I banished him. I needed to give my first born son some land, and gave him that (since I was getting a penalty for 'wrong holding'), making him a Lord Mayor.

Years later, my king dies, and my first-born inherits. Problem is, the Succession laws have changed in the Duchy of Munster to Agnatic Open Elective, and my heir is some random courtier! Stranger, it doesn't show the warning that I'll get game over, even though it's just some guy. Apparently I'd just be able to keep playing as random people forever. Forget that. I'm glad it was just a learning-the-ropes campaign, because it's ruined.

So... what gives? Why would that law, meant for cities, come with him when he inherited the Duchy? Why am i able to keep playing as someone not of my dynasty? Just who are we supposed to give cities, and counties with city capitols, to anyway?

 

[Vox Imperatoris]

Are sure it's the whole duchy that's getting Open Elective? It should just be the specific city title you granted your son. Otherwise... it's a bug.

 

[themrwho]

Playing as Ireland I've had the same annoying experience. My theory is this:

When ruler grants some land (holding type=City) to the heir, in that exact moment ruler's son, who was a noble up until that moment, goes through an instant morphosis, and voila he has become a full fledged Burgher/Mayor. And a good one who is ready to fight for his cause ("more power to the burghers!")

Exactly in the same moment another thing happens: as soon as he becomes mayor, in his tiny 'realm', he adapts the true burgher law, which is Open-Elective.

From your realm perspective; when your ruler dies, your heir, who is an Open-Elective guy and a die-hard burgher/mayor at that point in time, becomes the new ruler and as you would expect from a proper man with burgher background, (again) his first act is to open the road for future burghers: Thus he *fixes* the silly succession laws existed before, which will be rejoiced by all his brother-in-arms (yes, burghers) from Dublin to Jerusalem.

Please note that, as the highest leader of the realm, your realm name/type is also changed now and your leader is no more a Duke but a Doge (similar to Republic of Venice: Mecca of trade).

 

[Taghan]

That's happened to me.

There should at least be a warning that your son will change ruler type. Becoming the Doge of Connacht (lawl) wasn't what I had in mind when I started the game.

 

[thebigj_a]

Are sure it's the whole duchy that's getting Open Elective? It should just be the specific city title you granted your son. Otherwise... it's a bug.

Yup. Quite certain. What's more, every other title I acquired in Ireland as him became elective as well. His title even briefly appeared as "Doge". It seems he turned into a lord mayor somehow when I put him at the head of a county with a city capitol.

The only way I could fix it was by becoming King of Ireland, which I managed to do jut a few months before he died.


How am I supposed to know who's a noble and who's a burgher? I mean, the difference between a landless noble and a landless non-noble isn't really apparent, unless the noble comes from a prestigious line, or the burgher is lowborn.

 

[IlyaZ]

I got the same problem.

I put my heir to be mayor of a newly built city and the mayor (hmm?) of a church.

=> My heir inherits and I get open-elective. Now some random guy is in line to be the new heir and not the son.


The crown laws may have been reduced to medium as well (before or after - I don't remember). I had primogeniture (which requires high authority).

 

[pfried]

Playing as Munster, I'd passed Primogeniture as my succession law. The Lord Mayor of Ossory (sp?) rebelled against me, so I banished him. I needed to give my first born son some land, and gave him that (since I was getting a penalty for 'wrong holding'), making him a Lord Mayor.

Years later, my king dies, and my first-born inherits. Problem is, the Succession laws have changed in the Duchy of Munster to Agnatic Open Elective, and my heir is some random courtier! Stranger, it doesn't show the warning that I'll get game over, even though it's just some guy. Apparently I'd just be able to keep playing as random people forever. Forget that. I'm glad it was just a learning-the-ropes campaign, because it's ruined.

So... what gives? Why would that law, meant for cities, come with him when he inherited the Duchy? Why am i able to keep playing as someone not of my dynasty? Just who are we supposed to give cities, and counties with city capitols, to anyway?

If you CAN continue playing as non-dynasty members then you just found a way to play republics.

 

[unmerged(129317)]

It happens whenever a burgher type inherits. It spreads to the rest of your titles due to primary titles deciding inheritance.

 

[Taghan]

Doesn't playing as a republic defeat the entire purpose of the game?

You have no interest in your children and/or dynasty, seeing as you don't need them to continue playing and they probably won't take power.

 

[thebigj_a]

If you CAN continue playing as non-dynasty members then you just found a way to play republics.

Defeats the purpose. You have no dynasty in a dynastic game. Plus there aren't events coded. it was VERY boring until I managed to form a kingdom to fix it. Almost nothing happened. There was some weirdness with my vassals, too.

 

[Hystarea]

An Open Elective is a republic, which you can play under as if you swear fealty to. I have been the duke of Sicily under the Pope, which is under an Open Elective. Your Duchy might be under a different succession law then the kingdom you are under.

 

[thebigj_a]

An Open Elective is a republic, which you can play under as if you swear fealty to. I have been the duke of Sicily under the Pope, which is under an Open Elective. Your Duchy might be under a different succession law then the kingdom you are under.

Yes, and?

Not to be snarky, but what's that got to do with anything?

 

[Hystarea]

I'm sorry I mistook the title "Open Election?!" as a question to what it meant.

 

[Amagaeru]

Same happened to me in Iceland.

 

[thebigj_a]

I'm sorry I mistook the title "Open Election?!" as a question to what it meant.

No problem. Just read the actual post next time before replying.

 

[aliebling]

I'm having exactly the same problem.

Is this a known bug? Has it bee addressed?

The only solution currently seems to be to never give your sons mayoral positions?

 

[Sarin]

dont put your heir in charge of a NON CASTLE

When he inherits it thinks he is a merchant prince and brings across all the rules, it even called him Doge.

 

[thebigj_a]

I'm having exactly the same problem.

Is this a known bug? Has it bee addressed?

The only solution currently seems to be to never give your sons mayoral positions?

To be fair, you really aren't supposed to put a noble in charge of a city anyway, but it definitely shouldn't do this when you do.

 

[Zghuk]

These cities are really a pain. For Ireland it's best to give this county not as first county. E.g. I gave my son first Kildare and then Ormond and everybody was happy when I died

btw: As I formed the Kingdom of Ireland I got agnatic gavelkind, this was really strange and you can change this to primogenetur ... when you have a strong crown law... this was really suprising to me!

 

[Doomdark]

This is fixed in the upcoming patch.