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nsahn

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I know that you said the maps haven't changed much. However, it would be helpful in making decisions about your Med Empire if we could at least have three maps in particular: your kingdom, Anatolia and Greece, the Levant and Nile delta. Also, I hope you don't continue playing without the other knights' input.
 

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@blsteen: Very much so. I can say I probably wouldn't force myself to have all of my cultures accepted, as there are always minorities no matter where you are. It looks now once cores start to go that Austrian will be close to an accepted culture. I look at that and say 'OK, now I can move on to the north.' Now I can go beyond Austria.

But, say I go over to Thrace and start making things happen. If I were to apply that going East, I may not get Hungarian or Bosnian as accepted, but I would have to have one of them OR have Greek.

Somewhere in that region of the empire I have to have a predominant accepted culture in order to push further east. I won't necessarily wait for it, but I have to have some sort of certainty when all of that area cores, there will be at least one accepted culture between home and the new 'front'.

I'm not sure that this is what Sir nsahn had in mind when he proposed this, and I'm sure he would be happy to enlighten us as to whether this fits within the spirit of his vision.

I believe that this would at least be realistic and doable... Although even this as a limitation could put some severe restrictions on expansion, as I'd have to wait the 50 years for cores on Greece before moving past the Otts for example.

Sound feasible/plausible/possible...?

As for Alexandria, yes it's expensive, but the BB is cheap compared to that 5 or 6 province beach head.

I know even at 50%+ I can take 2, and realistically I can probably get 3 with Alexandria and get away with it. I also know given my current monarch I can get that much cap room cleared before I need to take the provinces. I'm a little fuzzy on the exact numbers, but I believe I'd only need 1.5 BB to take 3...

Anyways... Here are my personal reasons for Alexandria vs. Jerusalem:
1: Defensible @ 3 provinces.
2: Closer to the mainland if I need more men to arrive.
3: Why leave the Mamluks their #1 funding source to support their counter offensive...?
4: Earlier core on COT = more ducats and no more -15% compete... Just in time for monopolies...
5: The fewer provinces the Mamluks have, the more expensive Alexandria will be.
6: I love COTs. No better motivation exists for me.

The fact is, Alexandria is always going to be expensive. Might as well bite the bullet and take it now, and then use the extra income to support phase two of 'The Mams have just run out of luck...'

As far as Thrace and the Otts are concerned, they are a collective When, not an If. Right now, my only advantage over the OTTs is 15 or so galleys. They match me in every other way. I would say a war with them would be prohibitively long, drawn out and expensive.

Now if they were to say, go to war with the Mams or the Timurids or something, well that changes things...

Maybe I should pop a GTY on Thrace if they haven't jumped yet...

I will go there.

And then I will head out to India.

Right after I visit Mecca...

Though your comments be short, they are precise and to the point.

You have stuck by Milan from the beginning, always ready with wit or wisdom.

I dub thee Sir blsteen, Knight of the Eastern West...

Arise, Sir Knight, and claim your place at the Table of Milan...

If you want... :cool:

T
 

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Sir nsahn, Knight of ITALIA: "I know that you said the maps haven't changed much. However, it would be helpful in making decisions about your Med Empire if we could at least have three maps in particular: your kingdom, Anatolia and Greece, the Levant and Nile delta. Also, I hope you don't continue playing without the other knights' input.

Who am I to refuse a request of my Knights...? (as long as bodily harm isn't involved...)

You want-a the maps...? I give you the maps.

The Glorious Purple(ish) Milanese Soon To Be A Republic But Still Currently A Kingdom...

And the surrounding countryside to the North:

PR_308_North2_1438.jpg


And the Countryside to the South and East:

PR_306_Southeast_1438.jpg


And the Countryside to the South:

PR_307_South_1438.jpg


And the whole world, as we know it...:

PR_EU3_MAP_MLO_14381.jpg


I apologize most profusely. Why I had assumed my Knights were clairvoyant and could see this already, I do not know... :eek:o

As for continuing without council....

I would love to hear from all of my Knights. They have all earned their titles, and it is my sincerest hope that all Knights will uphold their obligations to Milan.

That said, life happens... I will wait for a time, but we here in the not so old USA have a holiday Thursday... It would be nice to spend the evening with a round, especially after being subjected to the non stop screaming of children for 12 hours... ;)

T
 

nsahn

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Updated Strategic Initiatives... 1438 Next Edition
Stuff we can actually do in the next 12 or so years...:
The Pope... Annexation and you:
Annex: I did some rough calculations (I don't have access to EU3 right now) and if you annex Roma and do not take any additional provinces you should get Umbrian as an accepted culture; take what you will from that. Anyways, Roma will stick out like a sore thumb by the time you have conquered The Boot and you will have wished you had annexed it; after all you are following the legacy of a Mediterranean empire ruled by an empire named after a city.
Grand Centralization:
Yes Centralization.
Getting serious about taking the Holy Land:
Alexandria: Second Malurous and blsteen. Though I don't understand your argument for not fighting on two fronts. Unless you plan on taking provinces from Alexandria down to Nubia, your second war will have Mamelukes attacking your beachhead from east and west.
Thrace: Potential COT Site and Important Land Bridge...
No Thrace: Ottomans are too strong. The investment of time, money, manpower will not be worth a few Greek provinces that you will have to spend missionary money on. Every game is different and my current Venice game featured a crumbling OE.
Maybe not this time, but next time...:[/U]
Noble: Aristocracy penalty for Merchant makes it a no-go.
The Big List Of Stuff That's still being bantered about but hasn't really been decided yet...:
Forming Italy and turning Pukey Green vs Retaining Our Purple(ish) Milanese Heritage:
Go for some other unified country: Quicksabre is dead-on here. Do tell if you want me to create a 'Lombardia Unification' decision or whatever country title you want.
Protestant bound:
Protestant: Converting to Reformed is a 100% hindrance and I prefer a different set of handcuffs.
The Long Range Forecast: Other Stuff We Get To Decide On Too
Cultural Significance: Should we pursue accepted cultures as an objective?:
Yes (of course): However, here is a list of updated culture goals: Austrian (in the bag), Umbrian (if you want to really restrain yourself for the next few years), Bavarian (there are many rich Bavarian provinces) (will also be cool for a Republic of Lombardia, formed of the Alps and hinterlands), Greek (it may look difficult now, but it is the wealthiest culture east of Italy in the Mediterranean), al Misr Arabic (if you go for Alexandria, however I haven't done any calculations on this one), etc. Cultures that have no chance: Croatian, all Slavics, and Sicilian.
Taking Japan as the end game:
Yes Japan: Fits in well with an island theme. Though by the end-game I don't think it will be much of a challenge.
Austria: There's GOLD in them there hills.
Austria whenever: Don't worry about the culture, it is a lock for acceptance.
Mediterranean Empire or Colonizing Force:
Both and Womanizer: Island-specific colonization.
When to have to engage France:
Wait for the dogpile and/or religious turmoil.
No New World:
Yes New World: I agree with Malurous that this can be boring. Which is why I suggest only the Caribbean islands; and not just only but all the Caribbean islands.
Can't touch Portugal:
As soon as possible: There is no other way for you to get to the Caribbean in time for colonization, you need The Azores/Madeira/The Canarias. Warn and wait (Portugal will attack the North Africans).
 
Last edited:

blsteen

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For sure, guarantee both Thrace and Hungary. I understand your points about the value of Alexandria and so withdraw my recommendation my liege. So which province(s) will be the target of Operation PYRAMID STORM? And as side note,being a Knight is cool even if when my exclamation on reading about my elevation was met with a surly "What did you say" followed by my wife rolling her eyes and saying "Oh its about your game".;)
 

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@Sir nsahn: Very good. I will incorporate them into the next strategic update. As it is, it appears the holiday hath wreaked havoc on the world at large. Or I managed to tick everybody off... :eek:

I will be traveling to family tomorrow and have a 12 hour day for Friday thanks to one of our (not so) favorite customers not yet able to grasp the concept that 'Objects in your path may be more solid than they appear...' At least I'll get some nice OT out of it. So it looks like Saturday before I can do anything anyways.

I think I address the two front question below and I have similar misgivings about Thrace. Were the OTTs sinking instead of swimming I'd look harder, but they're kicking strong this time, leading me to believe they may be a lucky this time around. (I like random luckies.... :))

Noble does appear to make more sense, so I think that's a done deal, unless someone has some definitive arguments against that relay a particularly helpful advantage. And given the change at 19, it won't be terribly long...

I can see the PRO REF debate going to the wire. Hope it ends as good as it began... :D

I'll do the rest with the update.

@Sir blsteen: I'm set with 10 transports and 31 galleys at the moment... I have 23 Regiments I can build before I hit my FL. Of the 33K I have on the ground now, most will stay stateside... Unless I absolutely have to ship them. I figure though if I have to take them over there, I didn't go at the right time...

Figure a decent CAV army, 11-13K or so and probably two 4K INF/siege to start. I'll bring one of the CAV armies over to as a backup until the Mams main forces are gone, then ship them back to the homeland. Once the main force is wiped, I'll break everything down into 2K's and keep a token 6K CAV chase force with the general to play watchdog.

I may have to keep another 2K or 4K in that stack, it depends on how big the rebels are and how often they pop. Nothing will start until the Mams are hurting from something else...

I'll work to hit Libya or Alexandria herself first, depending on where the Mams are. With Libya, I have a single front from which to expand out from. It isn't worth much, but it may be the 3rd province I go for in the peace to concentrate my forces on the one side of Mam territory. Figure Delta is the other target, and anything else is gravy and give back.

From there I'll work across the coast to Judea and Beirut. The last phase will be to head south towards Mecca.

Should be fun.

T
 

OrangeYoshi

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This is the knight's page reporting in. The knight is currently away for a prolonged holiday and most likely will not be back for at least 5 more days. He does wish to convey that the King's progress does look good, and that there are some things he will need to report on in full about the Kingdom's situation, but that will have to wait. ;)
 

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Please have a safe and thoroughly enjoyable journey...!

We will be here when you return, provided the world does nothing too foolish...

T
 

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With the disruption of service due to Thanksgiving/Black Friday, I'm going to go ahead and play the next round now. I have a good idea of where everyone wants to go, and I think this time may be more of a 'sit and spin' as opposed to anything actually happening.

I'll be back later with hints, lies and maybe a few allegations.

T
 

Malurous

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With the disruption of service due to Thanksgiving/Black Friday, I'm going to go ahead and play the next round now. I have a good idea of where everyone wants to go, and I think this time may be more of a 'sit and spin' as opposed to anything actually happening.

I'll be back later with hints, lies and maybe a few allegations.

T

That's cool, looking forward to reading your lies and therefore making ill-advised suggestions for future actions :rofl:
 

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We're back in the studio after another session...

@Sir Beamed: I think they're growing too.

@Malurous: What else could you make with this drivel...? Though if I had some Bis-Quick I could probably get some pancakes out of it... :D

As for the quick synopsis...:

Opportunities finally developed, though we still walk the ragged edge of BB.

The game is definitely steering me away from the Med, as all of the items that came up for bid and were available for purchase went the wrong way from our hopeful target of the land of the Mams.

In fact, between the Mams and the Otts, I think I've witnessed the quietest, most civilized behavior I've yet seen from them. At least until the Otts stuck a fork in my eye...

Best part of all is a beautiful gift wrapped setup just waiting for some BB room, which should be something to capitalize on very quickly. It really is precious and will net me two solid cores...

BB is barely workable as I have yet to score a Diplomat above two stars. I even went so far as to try a GOVT focused Hiring Fair. I had a better shot at the Kitchen Sink... I eventually shot the 2 star out to make room. Need to get something going, and a run at Noble Republic was the answer.

I'll be working on the updates later tonight and tomorrow...

Till then...!

T
 

Enewald

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-Keep the Pope 'On a Rope' as a Vassal: Keep him still as a vassal. Rome is a dirty place. And better to keep the pope close in a leash then let him work agaisnt you in some distant land. ;)

-As you don't annex the Pope, you can go for quality. :D

-Take Alexandria first and Ierushalem asap afterwards.

-Take Thrace and also possibly Edirne and Burgas. You must not let the Ottomans gain a stronger presence in Europe. Maybe a crusade agaisnt them? :cool:

-Yes for Republic! Death to the rex! ASAP. Noble republic, as I am one of the nobles leading that republic. :cool: Noble sounds cooler anyways.
Maybe not this time, but next time...:

-I'm still for staying as Milan.

-I could change my vote back to PRO if there would be enough protestant provinces in Milan, including the capital.

-Cultures are not important, sooner or later everyone shall speak milanese. :D

-Why take Japan? Let it be discussed later...

-All your gold are belong to us!

-Stop! Time to hammer Portugal! And we can touch them!

-Corniness? After WC maybe. Or when I get elected to eternal dictatorship. :cool:
 

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Wow Otto's, cutlery and antracer don't mix. The wrong way from the Mam's with no Med focus...le blob?

The Otts have even left Thrace alone, if you can believe it. BYZ is currently an OPM, begging to be taken. I'm just not sure I want to go there. Although as you will see, they do something that actually might prove to be motivation to do so...

Phew - just caught up. Great read!

Excellent. Now you get to do it again...!

-Keep the Pope 'On a Rope' as a Vassal: Keep him still as a vassal. Rome is a dirty place. And better to keep the pope close in a leash then let him work agaisnt you in some distant land. ;)
-As you don't annex the Pope, you can go for quality. :D

I completely brain faded on the Pope, so it's still an open question. I have to say that big off white blob is getting annoying to look at, and he's pathetic at keeping his nation straight.

-Take Alexandria first and Ierushalem asap afterwards.

I think that's the plan...

-Take Thrace and also possibly Edirne and Burgas. You must not let the Ottomans gain a stronger presence in Europe. Maybe a crusade agaisnt them? :cool:

I doubt I can call a crusade any time soon. Considering many of the Cardinals are still a 1% sway chance... The Otts have ticked me off, so there may be some possible follow up on this one.

-Yes for Republic! Death to the rex! ASAP. Noble republic, as I am one of the nobles leading that republic. :cool: Noble sounds cooler anyways.
Maybe not this time, but next time...:

Next time I think... It's going to happen soon.

-I'm still for staying as Milan.

It's still my sentimental favorite. Though the thought of creating a new land and flag and all that just for this AAR is appealing as well.

-I could change my vote back to PRO if there would be enough protestant provinces in Milan, including the capital.

I think the reformation will guide this decision. If I get a large turn of PRO, it makes no sense to fight it and go REF, making me convert them again. However, usually it's a 50/50 split. I also see the REF reformation starting first many times. Maybe they get a head start. We'll have to see how it all comes together.

-Cultures are not important, sooner or later everyone shall speak milanese. :D

I think getting accepted cultures along the way is a nice balance to conquest. It should keep me 'just the right size', though I won't go into the buying and selling and giving away of provinces just to get it done.

-Why take Japan? Let it be discussed later...
Because it's there...

-All your gold are belong to us!

:rofl:

-Stop! Time to hammer Portugal! And we can touch them!

I think we may have too. They're actually being the aggressive that the Mams and Otts usually are. They have the west coast of Africa already... :eek:

I just realized you're calling for 'Hammer Time'... Stop! Break it down... Uh oh uh oh, uh oh uh oh...

-Corniness? After WC maybe. Or when I get elected to eternal dictatorship. :cool:

I don't think you get elected to that. I think you just 'make it happen'...

Anyways, the questions become answers now...!

Update in 3... 2... 1...
 

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Chapter 14: We Went Thataway...!​

As we enter into this chapter in the annals of the mystery and history of our beloved Milan we find ourselves led by a King with Mamlukian aspirations. Visions of Alexandria consume his dreams, and Jerusalem haunts his sleep.

As we begin, we make our obligatory moves and placements, starting with a shift in gears...:

PR_309.jpg


First thing you'll notice is the brain fade on the central move. This won't be the first I'm afraid. My head was in it, but my mind wasn't, and AMTRAK was right on schedule derailing thoughts with ruthless efficiency...

The second is the Warning to Naples, so as to try and take advantage of the core mission we currently have.

Our research is doing OK, as we're pumping Production currently to get those almighty workshops. Santa isn't the only one who needs those...:

PR_310.jpg


Government Tech has been cruising along quite nicely with the combination of Universities and an excellent advisor. We're pushing for Tech Level 10 for a switch to Noble Republic...

Things kick off with a revolt in Abruzzi, which is ping and a pong and a gone, followed by not a whole lot.

It isn't until September that anything happens at all:

PR_311.jpg


This gives us something you don't see every day:

PR_312.jpg


It's basically on auto pilot now, which is nice. One less thing to worry about, or screw up... Within days of that our Naval Tech bumps to 5. I'm not in any hurry for that to go anywhere just yet. Once we hit 9 and the inevitable Pirate swarms we'll punch up research there a little.

Perhaps a sign of things to come...?:

PR_313.jpg


That makes it both France and Burgundy trying to sow the bad blood. It also makes for a little trepidation when considering getting involved over seas. We'll have to keep an eye on this.

It isn't until almost a year later anything at all happens, and that a minor rebellion in Scwhaben. It seems 6,000 people decided they wanted to follow a guy named Chlingensperg to his death. Idiots. It's another ping and then a pong and then lunch.

Not a scant few months later, the same province spawns yet another ruckus...:

PR_314.jpg


Maximilian Maximillian...?

What, pops couldn't afford another 'L'...?

And what's with following guys with the weird names...?

We managed to go an extra ping with this group, but when it's over they end up where most rebels go... The special 'You Just Really Annoyed Me For No Reason' section of electronic hell where there's weeping and wailing and alot of flies.

On a bright Spring day
On the 1st of May
Twas a Saturday
From the Herald 'Hey'
'Good news I say'
'Share if I may...?'

'Oh shut up and spill it...!' The King growled...

'The good news: We have reached Production Tech Level 8, sire.'
'The bad news: We are 10 years ahead of schedule to level 9.'

'Thank You.'
'Now go away.'
'Right now I say...'
'I've had quite enough of you today.'
'And all of this rhyming, well it's just...'

'Silly.'

We're also 10 years ahead of time on GOVT still too. The game then reads my mind and throws me a bone:

PR_315.jpg


Why certainly. Absolutely. Happily even. Hired. Done...! The only problem...? The only logical placement is in the slot my 2 star Diplomat currently resides... It's +15 GOVT tech vs. 0.02 BB reduction. Given that Noble Republic waits at the end of this rainbow, where I can go for Diplomatic rulers every 8 years, I have to say I can make up the 0.02 with a decent candidate... So, so long Mr. Diplomat.

It seems both France and Burgundy are quite ambitious this game... France is spreading outwards both south into Castille and east into Piedmont heading towards Liguaria. The Burgundians have had one war with Baden already, and are pushing the Palatinate around too. This is not a good sign I tell you. My best case scenario is the two of them go at it and relatively soon. At least that way I can jump on the loser (and maybe the winner too) and take them down a peg.

Hey, we built a Temple in Trent...!

From the 'We're so happy your our target... Er, neighbor...' Dept:

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Thanks for saving me 5 BB too, while we're being friendly. With the core on München the DoW is only -1...

I think I'll start looking around and see what's what. I need to make something happen, whether overseas in Mam land or closer to home.

As I said in the teaser, the Mamluks have been downright docile, as have the Ottomans. Neither has involved themselves in much, and neither has suffered any of the usual meltdowns or rebel fests or enemy crushings that usually befall these two giants. This could be a good thing... When they finally do go into cardiac arrest, it'll be one heck of a show.

Closer to home, I get something else I haven't seen in a very long while:

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Another French vassal to boot. They may not get the decentral cancel in a mission, but they'll be trying to annex it in the future. The English army in the pic lasted all of a day. That French stack walked in and *spoof*, no more English.

The only other event of 1441 was a revolt in Trent which was pinged, then ponged.

1442 Started off on a sour note:

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Already being at 5+ inflation, and having the ability to get a STAB level back in 6 months I opted to take the hit and lose the inflation. The +1 STAB didn't look so hot, but the 2.1 inflation was a welcome sight. Already being able to maintain zero gain, it opens the door for some minting to take place should the need arise, like say, when I need to build all those workshops...

In July, we get our first STAB level back, peasants in Modina decide rebellion is the quickest way to die and Holland enters the CoT owners fraternity with a new franchise.

We also get a CB on Austria, as apparently they decided to play the spy game and lost. With my two advisors, I have huge defense numbers. Doesn't help much if I want to instigate, but keeps me from having to deal with the AI spam of silly spy actions whenever they don't have anything better to do.

In anticipation of some hostilities I build up some extra forces, starting with 6K CAV. I'm on the fence about Austria though, as she has some very big and healthy allies...

The end of the year finishes better than it started...:

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I had totally brain faded on this for the strategy session... The nice thing is it would be a minor inconvenience to change it.

In the past I would take Military Drill, no questions asked. However, I wanted to see if Discipline would be an advantage on par or better than Moral. I know what Moral does, as I'm used to fighting with it. This should prove to be an interesting comparison.

Our last tech level to Noble Republic is 13 years ahead of schedule. That means I have all kinds of time to wait for it. I can even trade away one of my advisors should something open up.

By January 1443 I have my STAB back. The Mams further demonstrate their new peaceful, civilized ways when the diplo annex Syria in February. What happened to the hard charging always fighting Mams of yore...? They've been at peace now as long as I have...!

The produces a few other noteworthy events also. The Palatinate becomes the new HRE, though it currently has a few issues. The biggest is the province of Franken, where rebels are holding everyone hostage. Maybe now with the added manpower they can actually build an army big enough to move them.

Our CB expires on Austria. She was clearly wanting a fight, having positioned her main armies on my border. But after the CB went away, she decided to back down and went looking for trouble elsewhere.

Burgundy annexed Brabant, continuing it's push to expand at the rate of France. I can't help but feel this is going to get ugly...

Then I get another wonderful event just to let me know I'm not alone...:

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I can't afford to go in the hole over 2,000d in GOVT tech. That'll be another 2-3 years to get to Noble vs. 6 months of +2 STAB.

Speaking of STAB, we complete another temple in Schwyz. I've never been much on building Temples, but my STAB level cost is currently 487d, minus the new 5d. It was over 600 a little bit ago. Maybe not a big deal now, but as we continue to grow, every little bit helps.

Especially when the game has an agenda... 1443 is going to go down as a banner year for ouch...:

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Another lost STAB level as I can't afford the cash hit. Them's the bounces though, and maybe we've got them all out of the way now...

Hey, you remember that Papal State thing there...?:

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I never even noticed the rebellion. Seriously, total brain fade. What's worse is that now our relations are zero... At least they're one of the few countries I get a positive number with. Needless to say, diplo annex aint coming soon.

I also have to re up the alliance, which I do right away. Later a gift to just help things along.

By July our STAB is fully recovered, so we can go back to business as usual on the tech front.

Later that month, England decides to excommunicate Aragon. I suddenly wished they had picked someone else. For some reason Aragon just doesn't take to excommunicating very well.

At the end of July, the Year of our Lord 1444, I decide the time has come to put Bavaria in the proper position. I need to make that core accessible, which means making Bavaria an OPM.

The DoW is minimal, and the time is right. Even better is the cadre of accomplices I may get to become entangled with...:

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A bonus Ferarra AND a shot at completing the mission against Naples...? Heck Yeah...!

My trusty Allies, Cleves, The Papal State and Switzerland all join in the fray. They'll be enough to draw fire away from me for awhile, which is all I'll need.

The first battles are ping pong classics, bouncing around Europe a few hundred men at a time. I'm not too concerned, as it's just the nature of things.

This is probably the first war where I have little manpower fear issues. I imagine it will be quite difficult to lose 28K against these guys. As such, my only real concern is attrition.

Come September I discover that Portugal has re-gifted the 'See and Excommunicate' I gave them...

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Ugh. I wonder how long we'll have this one go roundy round...

I make another 4K INF siege unit to give me some flexibility with the CAV to chase down enemy forces. As they maneuver to their form up province, word arrives that the Bavarian main army is no more:

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It went pretty well considering the army was at 6/9/0 when it started. That there is alot of pong. At least with that I can start getting aggressive in siege mode, and maybe get some help down south with Naples, where I'm spread out pretty thin.

The battles rage, England Excommunicates, Battles are won, England Excommunicates...

And so it goes through the end of 1444... However 1445 starts with me making a bit of a gaffe...:

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Nothing like throwing 3K CAV away just for fun. Maybe I'm just jealous that Portugal didn't send the See and Excommunicate to me.

Gaffes and blunders aside, I can't complain. The only real issue is that we seem to be heading in the wrong direction. However, given the continued activities of Burgundy and France, this may not be a bad thing at all. The provinces we're after are all above 5 base tax and all have decent manpower numbers. At the very least we'll have a decent foundation for defending ourselves, at the best we have enough to actually afford to send enough men off the reservation to actually accomplish something.

Still a ways to go before we can wrap up this war, so until then...

T