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Bullfilter

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Interesting discussion on the use (and possible AI abuse) of engineers. I tend to have largely overlooked them in my HOI3 games so far and not really looked into their other benefits. When I do think of them, I dimly think “hmm, increase speed a bit; maybe a small combined arms bonus; attack over rivers; um, ah, can’t be bothered, need that next xxxx more ...”.

This discussion has prompted me to look harder again. It may be the next Talking Turkey Cabinet meeting will have a look at their merits (especially as we are in such parallel positions - you are a bit further forward in time and playing SU, but with me having started the GPW early as a Turkish ally of the SU: we may soon catch up in terms of the battle situation!).

Having a few engineer-equipped INF divs to dash back and more quickly establish the next defensive line in a delaying defence makes sense, for example, in addition to their specialist attack properties. Also will ensure I keep trying to laboriously work up the tech to 5-brigade divisions - 4 doesn’t give you much room for specialist brigades without losing too much - well, grunt (pun intended).

Many thanks for this little exchange markkur, Finshades and roverS3! :)
 

Eurasia

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When I play Germany Engineers always end up being added to as many Panzer Divisions as I can afford. :D
 

Finshades

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The Doppelganger is one of the, if not the, AAR that inspired me to start this AAR. Sad that Uriah isn't really around anymore... haven't seen anything new from him since his Stellaris Rome AAR went silent. He is one of the greats.

I concur. Every day he does not post another epic saga of struggles is a day my heart weeps with sadness :( His boardgame AAR has also remained in radio silence since February, unfortunate as I think that is a great piece of work, the best since Doppelganger. I follow and like the Regere Imperio Populos, too, but WW2 is and shall remain my preference.
 

roverS3

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Interesting discussion on the use (and possible AI abuse) of engineers. I tend to have largely overlooked them in my HOI3 games so far and not really looked into their other benefits. When I do think of them, I dimly think “hmm, increase speed a bit; maybe a small combined arms bonus; attack over rivers; um, ah, can’t be bothered, need that next xxxx more ...”.
Having a few engineer-equipped INF divs to dash back and more quickly establish the next defensive line in a delaying defence makes sense, for example, in addition to their specialist attack properties. Also will ensure I keep trying to laboriously work up the tech to 5-brigade divisions - 4 doesn’t give you much room for specialist brigades without losing too much - well, grunt (pun intended).
Especially if you're controlling your Divisions yourself, you can position and use those with Engineers in a more advantageous way, attacking across rivers, into jungles, and against fortifications with Engineers is significantly better than without them...

This discussion has prompted me to look harder again. It may be the next Talking Turkey Cabinet meeting will have a look at their merits (especially as we are in such parallel positions - you are a bit further forward in time and playing SU, but with me having started the GPW early as a Turkish ally of the SU: we may soon catch up in terms of the battle situation!).
About the context of Turkey, I wonder how their equipment is... Can you even build Engineers? Is their specialist equipment up to date? Maybe the Soviet Engineer Brigades are in better shape?

When I play Germany Engineers always end up being added to as many Panzer Divisions as I can afford. :D
A sound strategy.

I concur. Every day he does not post another epic saga of struggles is a day my heart weeps with sadness :( His boardgame AAR has also remained in radio silence since February, unfortunate as I think that is a great piece of work, the best since Doppelganger. I follow and like the Regere Imperio Populos, too, but WW2 is and shall remain my preference.
Maybe Uriah also prefers WW2 and he's secretly preparing another HOI3 AAR, or who knows, maybe even HOI4? One can always hope...
 

markkur

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Rover keyed in on my point. My hesitation with ENG completely centers on A.I. vs Human-controlled. However, many other issues can come into play, i.e. As a IC powerhouse like the USA, I spread them like butter. But now? I'm not for or against using them, it's that I like to micro and ensure that where they are headed - they will actually provide their bonus. Another way, that I use them is with Marines because in my games, I seem to always be attacking ports etc. So, I was glad the US-A.I. had MAR+ENG when I nabbed them yesterday.:)

This discussion has prompted me to look harder again. It may be the next Talking Turkey Cabinet meeting will have a look at their merits (especially as we are in such parallel positions
There are lots of older discussions at the general forum where folks are into stats etc. but it seems there is no correct answer because...it depends; :D just posting for new players that may have missed this forum.
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?forums/hearts-of-iron-3.415/
 

roverS3

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Rover keyed in on my point. My hesitation with ENG completely centers on A.I. vs Human-controlled. However, many other issues can come into play, i.e. As a IC powerhouse like the USA, I spread them like butter. But now? I'm not for or against using them, it's that I like to micro and ensure that where they are headed - they will actually provide their bonus. Another way, that I use them is with Marines because in my games, I seem to always be attacking ports etc. So, I was glad the US-A.I. had MAR+ENG when I nabbed them yesterday.:)
Interesting, of course any specialisation of units will be better utilised by a human player (See the British launching an Amphibious Assault into a fortified port with Infx3, Art...), and that's a good point. The part about where they are headed... most of Siberia and Manchuria, is bad terrain with quite a few rivers, which is why an emphasis was put on adding Engineers to the Divisions in the Far East. It remains to be seen whether they'll actually be very useful there, but adding an Eng Brigade in the Far East definitely makes more sense than adding AT. Where I'm really positive on the need for Engineers, is with the Armour, and even the Motorised Formations. When the AI eventually makes them attack across a river and/or into a city, they need all the help they can get to mitigate their inherent weaknesses. Thanks for posting the link to the forum, I do go there from time to time when I need some specific guidance, but as you say, for newer players... I will strongly back your recommendation to check those thread out...
I'm afraid I didn't quite get your use of 'keyed in'... I'm not a native English speaker, and from time to time I don't get a particular figure of speech. I looked the phrase up but didn't find any conclusive meaning for this particular use of the phrase...
 

markkur

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I'm afraid I didn't quite get your use of 'keyed in'... I'm not a native English speaker, and from time to time I don't get a particular figure of speech. I looked the phrase up but didn't find any conclusive meaning for this particular use of the phrase
Old school I guess.

You "nailed-it".:D Saw my point etc.

I agree with the eastern use. Let's hope the A.I. understands too.:)
 

Finshades

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I think the beauty in using ENG to fortify the formations in the East is that the AI doesn't really need to understand how to use them. The terrain (both mobility-wise and combat-wise) means that using ENG is a net bonus in nearly all situations, if you can keep them in supply. The fortification is a nice plus, especially since the AI likes to shuffle troops around a lot, but the really useful things are the attack bonuses and the extra mobility. It could be a lot more optimized of course, but that goes for pretty much everything the AI commands.

It is very true you can squeeze a lot more out of specialist units like ENG if you micromanage them. In fact, like I've expressed, I don't think regular infantry should have ENG in the European front in any situation. There, the terrain is far more conductive to operating without them, which is pretty much in line with reality to be fair. I just can't find a compelling argument to use ART+ENG with INFx3 over ART+AT or even ART+AA if I expect heavy enemy air activity and less tanks. Assault units can and should still get ENG, but they usually have some hard attack in the form of tanks, TDs or assault guns anyway, so I can justify swapping out the AT for ENG while ART is of course replaced by tanks, TD, SPART or assault guns. In the East... I really like firepower that ART brings, but having 5 slots available means I have one empty slot left since I sure as hell am not going to slap AT on them and AA seems rather like a waste, too, considering the sparsity of airfields and that hard attack will be most likely useless, unlike the attack bonuses into urban areas (not many, but important) and rivers (there are a lot of them). Plus, I am a fan of maneuver warfare, so the movement speed bonus is a hard one to ignore.

In the end, it depends on a lot of things. What kind of war will you be fighting, where and with what infra, against whom, who will lead... I think Markkur is correct in saying that they are best employed to support special forces, which will need to be able to move quick, fortify quick and attack fortified locations. I would use them also in places where the terrain is inherently counterproductive, which means that infantry will have to do most of the fighting and pushing instead of relying on armoured units to break the enemy line, but that's more down to a personal preference and the assumption the enemy won't have armour either.
 
1st of October 1941, 'Odin', 10-day report #173

roverS3

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The 1st of October 1941, Vologda, 1,1°C, 10am Moscow Time,

Report on the state of the Soviet Union for the ten day period between the 22nd of September and the 1st of October 1941,

by 'Odin'

Army:
91. AP, a brand new Artillery Regiment has been deployed to Maj. General Kriuchenkin's 73. SD, XXIII SK, 6ya Armiya, 2nd Army Group, STAVKA/Moskva HQ.
Army numbers (Brigades/Personnel) Reserves included (these numbers don't include regiments being upgraded):
Front line troops: 656 / 1.968.000
Support troops: 296 / 296.000
Total fighting troops: 952 / 2.264.000
Headquarters: 63 / 63.000
Total Army Personnel: 1.015 / 2.327.000
Officers: 92.514 + / 101.090 needed / 91,516 %
Active Leaders: 268 / 155 more available
Production of 152mm ML-20 guns continues towards the formation of another Artillery Regiment.
No changes to Army Leadership
Air Force:
No changes to VVS, nor Navy Air Fleet numbers for the last 10 days.
Navy:
Our second Fleet Carrier, Minsk, identical to Kyiv, was launched in Sevastopol, it has joined I. Avianosets Flote for some exercises in the Eastern Mediterranean.
Navy Numbers (Flotillas / Ships)
Transports: 2 / 10
AG-boat Class (I): 11 / 55
Series II Class(II): 9 / 45
Series V-bis Class(III): 3 / 15
Submarines: 23 / 115
Norvik-Class (I) : 3 / 15
Gnevnyi-Class (II): 2 / 10
Kiev-Class (IV): 1 / 5
Sevastopol-Class (IV+): 4 / 20
Destroyers: 10 / 50
Light Cruisers / Profitern-Class (I): 3
Escorts: 13 / 53
Heavy Cruiser / Krasnyi Kavkaz (I): 1
Battleships / Gangut-Class (I): 3
Escort Carriers / Moskva-Class (I): 2
Fleet Carriers / Kyiv-Class (I): 2
Capitals: 8
Total combat ships: 21 / 61
Total Navy: 47 / 186
Leaders: 13/ 21 Reserve
The construction of a third Carrier of the same class, named Novorossiysk has been laid down in the Krasnaya Kuznitsa Shipyard in Archanglesk, while the move is not ideal, it does make sure that our next Carrier is neither trapped in the Black, or Baltic, sea, nor threading the needle of the IJN or risking capture by the IJA in Vladivostok.
Politics / International:
The Norwegian Front
Norway (Surrender Progress / NU): 0,00 / 84,9 =
Germany (Surrender Progress / NU): 0,0 / 82,5 =
The German Northward advance has met some resistance, and no further advances have been made there...
GNW41-10-01S-min.jpeg

Things are see-sawing more to the south. The Wehrmacht has taken Kongsberg, putting the Norwegian bridgehead in Skien in a difficult position, with the risk of being dut off. Norway struck back further north, taking Gol. The advance along the Swedish border has been stalled after a Norwegian unit was finally sent to the area. Numerical superiority or not, this is going to take a while longer...
British North Africa Front
United Kingdom (Surrender Progress / NU): 0,0 / 77,6
Italy (Surrender Progress / NU): 0,00 / 79,4
BNAF41-10-01-min.jpeg

British troops crossed the former border into Lybia in force, with tanks leading the way, quickly reaching Tobruch. The Garrison of the fortified city itself being well supplied and dug in, the advanced stalled. The RAF unleashed a vicious bombing campaign on the city, at a rate of 4 Missions per day for more than 5 days. Finally, ground forces took over the city with minimal losses. Supply on the British side is shaky, but it will surely be vastly improved once the Royal Navy organises convoys into Tobruch. This does give the Infantry time to catch up with the tanks, while the RAF rebased it's Dive Bombers to Tobruch Air Base.
Belatedly, the Regia Aeronautica has started intercepting British Strategic Bombers over Rome. At least 20 Armstrong-Whitworth Whitley Bombers were shot down over the Italian capital during three missions.
In the Mediterranean, the Royal Navy continues to pester the remnants of the Regia Marina. HMS Hood, pride of the Royal Navy, sunk an Italian Destroyer Flotilla, while Aeroplanes from HMS Glorious went straight for the Flotilla of Transports the Italians were trying to shield. The Italians have now lost 10 Troop Transport Flotilla's, they must not have many ships left to ferry troops across the Mediterranean.

Even more significantly, British patrols increased, French submarines returned in force, and more than 50 Italian convoys were sunk in the last week, an atrocious loss rate... In the same time period the British lost no convoys to Italian raiders, and a mere 15 to German u-boots. It's no wonder the Italians have trouble supplying their troops...
French North Africa Front
France is a Government in exile.
Italy (Surrender Progress / NU): 0,00 / 79,4
FNAF41-10-01-min.jpeg

Agadir is just the next nail in the coffin of the Armée de l'Afrique... it won't be long before this front will go quiet entirely...
Industry:
Moskva fortifications are now even more impressive, with more tunnels, more layers, and more command bunkers throughout the city (Level 8)
In Vladivostok, construction has started on more bunkers facing inland. (Level 3), strengthening defences against a possible overland attack.

Working Industrial Capacity / available capacity: 240 / 324
IC Usage: ( Allocated IC / Need )
Upgrades: 73,50 / 76,75
Reinforcement: 3,50 / 3,93
Supplies: 27,00 / 45,03
Production: 192,83 / 226,20 (the Licensed MP remains mostly unfunded, as well as three Mountain Rifle Divisions and 10. TTGvD)
Consumer Goods: 29,16 / 29,16​
Stockpiles:
Energy: Maximum tonnes +
Metal: Maximum tonnes +
Rares: 41.802 tonnes +
Crude: Maximum barrels +
Supplies: 41.786 tonnes -
Fuel: 99.086 barrels -
Money: 2.081 -​

Intelligence:
Spy numbers, spies in (active / added / lost / caught by us)
France (Supporting our Party / Counterespionage): 5 / 0 / 0 / 0
{ Germany (/): 0 / 0 / 0 / 1 }
{ Japan (/): 0 / 0 / 0 / 0 }​
UK (Counterespionage) : 8 / 1 / 3 / 1
Other: 0 / 0 / 0 / 4
Total: 13 / 1 / 3 / 6
Reserves: 0
Spy training leadership expenditure: 0,65 (a new spy every 10 days)
As a weakness was sensed in Scotland Yard's Counterespionage operation, our UK spy team started hunting the hunters again. 3 of our spies were lost, but 4 spy hunters were killed or captured (from Nepal, Bhutan, South Africa, and the United Kingdom). In the Soviet Union, spies from Germany and Italy were caught.
Research:
No completed Research Projects, no new projects started.​

Statistics:
National Unity: 83,241 =
Neutrality: 0,00 =
Dissent: 0,00 =
Manpower:
Available: 2.108.000
Men To reinforce(need): 6.000
Men To mobilise(need): See above
Monthly gain: 48.200 Men (1 fully mobilised Infx3, AT Division every 7 days)​
Party Popularity:
- Communist Party: 62 (+5)
- Trotskyite: 1 (-3)
- Bukharinite: 11 (+1)

- Octobrist: 5 =
- Social-Revolutionary: 8 (+1)
- Trudoviks: 2 (-5)
- Kadets: 1 (-3)

- Tsarists: 5 (+4)
- NTS: 4 (-1)
- POA: 1 (-1)
The Communist Party has grown in popularity significantly and it's popular support is the strongest it has been in years. For the first time since we started measuring in 1937, the Bukharinites are demanding a seat at the table of government. Their 'moderate' socialist ideas are less repulsive than Capitalist and Fascist ones, but that doesn't mean they'll just get a seat in the Central Committee...
Party Organisation:
- Communist Party: 82,70 (+0,38)
- Trotskyite: 8,50 (-0,1)
- Bukharinite: 3,60 (-0,1)

- Octobrist: 4,20 (-0,1)
- Trudoviks: 0,90 (-0,1)
- Social-Revolutionary: 0,00 =
- Kadets: 0,00 =

- Tsarists: 0,00 =
- NTS: 0,00 =
- POA: 0,00 =​

This Information is accurate on the morning of the 1st of October 1941, I hope it serves you well in fine-tuning your possible suggestions.

'Odin'​
 

Finshades

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Man, Italy is getting hammered. I'm starting to wonder if, between the rapid advance and the relentless convoy hunting, the Italians won't actually be able to eliminate those French troops. Movement across the desert and mountains is slow, and the Italian supply situation seems to be going from bad to worse.

Great to see another fleet carrier, too! It's a shame, really, that both existing ones and the one in construction are so out of date, but luckily the air wings are much more modern since they are what matters most.
 

roverS3

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Old school I guess.
You "nailed-it".:D Saw my point etc.
Thanks, I'm learning something new (or old) every day.

I agree with the eastern use. Let's hope the A.I. understands too.:)
I think the beauty in using ENG to fortify the formations in the East is that the AI doesn't really need to understand how to use them. The terrain (both mobility-wise and combat-wise) means that using ENG is a net bonus in nearly all situations, if you can keep them in supply. The fortification is a nice plus, especially since the AI likes to shuffle troops around a lot, but the really useful things are the attack bonuses and the extra mobility. It could be a lot more optimized of course, but that goes for pretty much everything the AI commands.
The AI isn't big on optimisation... but that makes things interesting... you need to expend more resources to attain the same goals, and you need to make sure the AI gets units that will be, at least somewhat effective in the environnements they could end up fighting in.

It is very true you can squeeze a lot more out of specialist units like ENG if you micromanage them. In fact, like I've expressed, I don't think regular infantry should have ENG in the European front in any situation. There, the terrain is far more conductive to operating without them, which is pretty much in line with reality to be fair. I just can't find a compelling argument to use ART+ENG with INFx3 over ART+AT or even ART+AA if I expect heavy enemy air activity and less tanks. Assault units can and should still get ENG, but they usually have some hard attack in the form of tanks, TDs or assault guns anyway, so I can justify swapping out the AT for ENG while ART is of course replaced by tanks, TD, SPART or assault guns. In the East... I really like firepower that ART brings, but having 5 slots available means I have one empty slot left since I sure as hell am not going to slap AT on them and AA seems rather like a waste, too, considering the sparsity of airfields and that hard attack will be most likely useless, unlike the attack bonuses into urban areas (not many, but important) and rivers (there are a lot of them). Plus, I am a fan of maneuver warfare, so the movement speed bonus is a hard one to ignore
Pretty much my thinking on the matter... no point in AA or AT in the East, and bad terrain... let's add Eng...

In the end, it depends on a lot of things. What kind of war will you be fighting, where and with what infra, against whom, who will lead... I think Markkur is correct in saying that they are best employed to support special forces, which will need to be able to move quick, fortify quick and attack fortified locations. I would use them also in places where the terrain is inherently counterproductive, which means that infantry will have to do most of the fighting and pushing instead of relying on armoured units to break the enemy line, but that's more down to a personal preference and the assumption the enemy won't have armour either.
I also like Engineers with Marines, and other specialised units.

Man, Italy is getting hammered. I'm starting to wonder if, between the rapid advance and the relentless convoy hunting, the Italians won't actually be able to eliminate those French troops. Movement across the desert and mountains is slow, and the Italian supply situation seems to be going from bad to worse.
I doubt it... unless the Italians entirely run out of supply, the tiniest amounts will be sufficient to clear a province, and as there are only 4 provinces left to capture, I think the supply shortage will be too little, too late... Moreover, it should be noted that the vast majority of Allied convoy-hunting is happening around Malta and in the Aegean, which means that Supply convoys sailing from Genoa to Tunis, for example, remain relatively untouched. If those French troops are entirely out of supply, they can only flee, so even if they aren't eliminated, units will shatter from attrition in the long run, and even if they don't they'll be essentially useless... The British probably aren't moving quickly enough to save them, but who knows... if the Brits launch a Naval Invasion into Casablanca and south of there, they could still save the French troops by giving them an escape route and offering a distraction for the Italians. I'm not betting on the UK AI being that clever...
I'm glad that the British took out most, or all of their TPs, which means that we definitely won't have to face any of those heavier units in Europe...

Great to see another fleet carrier, too! It's a shame, really, that both existing ones and the one in construction are so out of date, but luckily the air wings are much more modern since they are what matters most.
At least we have Fleet Carriers, in 1937, that means we're part of a very small group of Navies... The Air Wings are state of the Art, soon including the latest Air Launched Torpedoes... that's one big advantage of CVs, all the Small Aeroplane Tech improves your CAGs...
 

Bullfilter

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The carriers will be an interesting proposition when it comes to war - whether, where and how they might be used. And if there would be any European Axis navies left to use them on!

Norway drags on - let’s hope your AI generals, who will at least have some adult strategic direction, do better than the German ones!

And on the ENG question, in my Turkey AAR I can’t build them yet myself. I’d need to either research the tech (which is hard with my meagre LS resources) and then do more research to make them effective ... or revert to seeking licenses from the SU if I want to build some. Easy choice (fortunately the succession of earlier expansion wars before the GPW-equivalent left me with a very large cash surplus)! :)
 

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Once again, fantastic work and thanks for the update.

Being in October now, it is hard to see the Germans declaring war in 1941, or at all. Norway in this game has been the Yugoslav spoiler from OTL, only much worse. Italy is knackered and even if the British don't invade, the Italians won't be in a position to help in the Soviet Union as they defend the homeland. This is setting up for some interesting decisions to be made in 1942.
 

roverS3

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The carriers will be an interesting proposition when it comes to war - whether, where and how they might be used. And if there would be any European Axis navies left to use them on!
Who knows, maybe we'll try to take the IJN head-on, though that may have terrible consequences, if a combined Fleet closes on our Carrier Fleet, their Aeroplanes keeping ours busy, our Carriers could be blown out of the water... The Axis navies of Europe aren't entirely out though, Tirpitz, and at least two Italian Battleships are still around, they could make a come-back, or we could help out by sinking them in port...

Once again, fantastic work and thanks for the update.
Thanks, and you're welcome

Being in October now, it is hard to see the Germans declaring war in 1941, or at all. Norway in this game has been the Yugoslav spoiler from OTL, only much worse. Italy is knackered and even if the British don't invade, the Italians won't be in a position to help in the Soviet Union as they defend the homeland. This is setting up for some interesting decisions to be made in 1942.
Norway drags on - let’s hope your AI generals, who will at least have some adult strategic direction, do better than the German ones!
Yes, Norway is perpetually taking longer than anyone is expecting... one could now seriously question whether that will be wrapped up before 1942.

And on the ENG question, in my Turkey AAR I can’t build them yet myself. I’d need to either research the tech (which is hard with my meagre LS resources) and then do more research to make them effective ... or revert to seeking licenses from the SU if I want to build some. Easy choice (fortunately the succession of earlier expansion wars before the GPW-equivalent left me with a very large cash surplus)! :)
Well, nothing wrong with Soviet-trained Engineers...
 
5th of October 1941, 'Sem', Partisans in Finland #2

roverS3

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The 5th of October 1941, Archanglesk, 4,8°C, 2pm Moscow Time,

Having gone on a trip to Archanglesk, to see the start of construction of our new Carrier Novorossiysk, I spent the morning walking around the one large dock in the area, this Carrier will be the largest ship ever built in the Krasnaya Kuznitsa shipyards. Since the late 1880s, no new ships have been built there, and it was used as a repair yard only. Now though, with an influx of experienced shipbuilders from Leningrad and Sevastopol, new construction has been restarted. Local elders are happy to see shipbuilding return, especially in the shape of Carrier construction.

When I was about to leave the yard to go for lunch, I was called into their offices, there was an urgent telephone call for me... it was 'Tri':

"Out and about again? Let me hand you 'Sem', as he's the one who actually needs to talk to you"
After a short silence, 'Sem' started talking, excited and somewhat worried:

"I had to ask 'Tri' to reach you, I still don't know how he does it... anyway, I'm calling because there is a bit of a situation developing in Finland. A coordinated uprising has happened across the interior of Southern Finland. Partisans have risen up and taken control of Parkano, Eura, Keuruu, Jämsä, Lammi, Riihimäki, and Kuusjärvi. In total, aprroximately 24.000 partisans, spread out in organised Regiment-sized groups of around 3.000. This is not spontaneous or local, the level of coordination is just to high, and several of my sources in the Area think the Finnish government in exile is behind this, with German support, though we'll only know for sure once we capture some of the rebels and/or their weapons."

FPF41-10-05-min.jpeg

Finnish partisans, all rising up at the same time, this level of coordination is worrying.

"The NKGBF has already started moving it's two Mounted Brigades towards the affected areas. All reserve Aeroplanes have been moved to the area.
IV. ShAK and 7. KPA have been re-based to Helsinki, II. BAK was re-based to Leningrad, and the Red Banner Baltic fleet is sailing out of Leningrad along the Finnish Coast.

'Dva' suggests that we ferry
XXXIII SK from Tallinn to Helsinki to help contain the rebels. This would take a day or two as we can only move one Division at a time, but it would vastly speed up the campaign. In any case, a vast bombing campaign is already underway and the first bombs will be dropped within hours."
This is rather worrying... I do think sending in XXXIII SK is a good idea, with the caveat that they have to be returned to Tallinn, if the Germans attack, that is. Thankfully, the rebels haven't coordinated with an all out German attack, so this will be another big exercise, keeping our Armed forces on their toes. We should consider training more NKGBF mounted Brigades, to maintain the peace in the future.

I will take an aeroplane to Leningrad now to keep close tabs on this developing situation,

Greetings,

'Odin'
 

markkur

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I say that's a Finnish Rising.

The AI isn't big on optimization... but that makes things interesting... you need to expend more resources to attain the same goals, and you need to make sure the AI gets units that will be, at least somewhat effective in the environments they could end up fighting in.
Yes indeed; this commitment to detail and preparation - to then hand off the effort is going to be fun to witness. Queue Suspenseful theme.:)
 

Eurasia

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Oh, Comrade Odin, I would like the reaction of the Mounted Brigades to be documented and studied for future anti-partisan operations in Europe.

OOC : In other words can the AI set-up handle partisans by itself?
 

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This is rather worrying... I do think sending in XXXIII SK is a good idea, with the caveat that they have to be returned to Tallinn, if the Germans attack, that is. Thankfully, the rebels haven't coordinated with an all out German attack, so this will be another big exercise, keeping our Armed forces on their toes.

Unless the Germans are clever enough to see if by this they can cause enough of a distraction to facilitate Barbarossa.
 

roverS3

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Yes indeed; this commitment to detail and preparation - to then hand off the effort is going to be fun to witness. Queue Suspenseful theme.:)
suspenseful theme indeed...

Oh, Comrade Odin, I would like the reaction of the Mounted Brigades to be documented and studied for future anti-partisan operations in Europe.

OOC : In other words can the AI set-up handle partisans by itself?
It will be documented in detail, the AI will be handling this by itself. But, considering the scale of the insurrection, XXXIII SK has, temporarily, been placed under the command of NKGBF

Unless the Germans are clever enough to see if by this they can cause enough of a distraction to facilitate Barbarossa.
I don't believe this is a large enough distraction... yet... to be a serious opportunity for the Germans.
 
11th of October 1941, Finnish Autumn Anti-Insurrection operations #1

roverS3

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The 11th of October 1941, Leningrad, 3,6°C, 10am Moscow Time,

XXXIII SK was successfully ferried to Helsinki, with the headquarters unit arriving at 10am on the 7th of October. Meanwhile, both NKGBF Mounted Brigades moved towards rebel-held territory. 1. NKGBF Konnaya Brigada stopped in it's tracks when it spotted the enemy... it's not clear why, 2. NKGBFKB hasn't arrived to the 'front' yet. XXXIII SK has been placed under the command of Commissioner for State Security Second Class Provalov's NKGBF HQ. His orders were changed to a very agressive posture, but for now, there have been no engagements.

The Partisans have take quite a bit of territory in the meantime, linking together all of their territory, except for the area around Kuusjärvi. This, despite a large scale bombing campaign from both the Navy and the VVS.

FPF41-10-11-min.jpeg

A total of 90 missions were flown in 6 days, killing a total of 3.704 Finnish Partisans. A total of 882 Aeroplanes participated, and losses were limited to a couple of lucky shots, which put 1 Yak-4 out of service.
The navy flew 59 of the missions with three independent CAGs, two from the decks of Moskva and Leningrad, one from Helsinki Air Base. In total 62 Il-10Ms, 31 Il-2M3Ms, 62 La-7Ms, and 31 LaGG-3Ms were deployed over
Huittinen, Riihimäki, Jämsä, Jyväskylä, Pori, Lahti, Suolahti, Kankaanpää, and Padasjoki, accounting for 1.182 kills.
Two VVS Aviation Corps also participated:
II BAK, counting 200 Yak-4s and 124 La-7s, based in
Leningrad, was responsible for 17 missions (over Parkano and Hämeenkyrö) and a total of 1.659 fewer insurgents.
IV ShAK, counting 124 Il-10s, 124 Il-2M3s and 124 La-7s, based in
Helsinki, flew 14 missions (over Lammi and Orivesi) eliminating 863 enemies of the state.

yak-4_01-min.JPG

The single casualty of our anti-partisan bombing operations. One badly damaged Yak-4, after a crash-landing at Kouvola Air Base.
Everyone is waiting for NKGBF to prove it's worth and crush the Partisans, reinforced with a full Rifle Corps, and supported by heavy Air Support, they should be able to easily deal with the insurrection.​

The usual report will be out soon,

Greetings,

'Odin'